Did anyone drink alcohol through pregnancy?

[KacyB]

Hi,

I am just wondering how common it is for women to drink during pregnancy.

I used to drink quite a bit, but stopped the minute I found out I was pregnant. I would rather not drink at all, that's my personal choice.

I was chatting to a couple of friends today, one of who happens to be PG and she said she's still drinking 1-2 glasses of wine a day...

I didn't say anything other than I've made a personal choice not to drink at all during my PG... I mean, I know it's not a guarantee everything will be OK, but it makes me feel better...

The more I think about what she said, the more shocked I am about it... I am thinking maybe I should say I disagree?

Its the whole alcohol thing in general though isn't it???

A recent survey was done and they assessed how much women thought they were drinking compared to how much they ACTUALLY were drinking. A LARGE glass of wine can be 2 units and when combined with other factors including how much you have eaten/slept etc the amount can be even higher.

I will try and dig it out.

1-2 glasses sipped with a meal is different from getting home from work and having two glasses instead of dinner to wind down. The latter affects you much more than the former.

The contrast was made as I am simply pointing out that the risk of Alcohol in fetal development is still not on the same par with say Toxomoplasmosis (yet the risk is very low) and I think it should be and should be taken as a serious risk. (These are my personal feelings but this is a discussion board after all)

And I think it is, generally, being treated as a genuine risk (not to the extent of cutting out alcohol altogether, but to the extent of most women cutting right back on consumption). And that this thread backs up that opinion.

I used to love drinking so will admit I would find it hard to cut it out completely. I am pg at the moment and drink 1-2 cans of guinness every week, usually on the weekend. Guinness is the only thing dp will let me drink lol! I did the same with ds and he is perfecty normal, maybe even a little advanced with his speech for his age. My iron levels in my first pg were really good, I put that down to the guinness (even though I didn't tell the mw that!).

If I got as much enjoyment from petting a lamb as I do from the odd glass of wine then I might go and pet a lamb once a week .

Please don't lecture me on glass sizes; this is something I know a fair bit about, as it happens. The 'one glass' I drank in pregnancy was quite often a small sherry-style glass.

And I didn't, and don't, need a glass of wine to make life bearable in general. I found pregnancy quite loathsome. A small glass mitigated that loathsomeness. Not being pregnant now, my life is much less loathsome.

I drank 1 or 2 units per day during pregnancy and found it helped me feel a little more like an adult human and a little less like a walking incubator. Each to their own. If I were your friend and you started lecturing me, I would not appreciate it - we are all adults who can make up our own minds about the risks involved of drinking, smoking, eating liver/soft cheese blah blah blah... I really doubt that your friend has misunderstood the guidance - it sounds like she's made a calculated decision and I don't think it's worth risking yor friendship to tell her you are .

Jeez.. I needed my once weekly glass of wine both times I was pregnant. I NEEDED IT !

I dont think there is anything wrong with that really, as long as you don't need a bottle, a case of stella or some turps.

Needing one glass of wine once a week does not an alcoholic make.

Of course not MI.

I'm sure it's Not. Thats why you get so uptight when someone has an opinion is it????

I mean if you want to stand by your convictions thats fine.....but then why get uptight if someone chooses not to agree with you.

Not lecturing about glass sizes...stating FACTS

Yes, it's just that I restate those facts quite regularly when I write about alcohol and Glass Size and Suchlike.

Agree with Bellabelly and the walking incubator, defiance of, syndrome.

I agree on the walking incubator feeling. Not pleasant.

I think Cedes puts it very well further down the thread when she says
"If you read any peer reviewed articles or medical journals you can see the evidence in black and white - drinking in moderation during pregancy is ok - but the problem is the world moderation, and because it can be (and IS) interpreted differently the advice from the govt and health care community is to abstain..."

I read a lot of peer reviewed journals, I prefer to rely on these than on hearsay or health visitors or generalised "better safe than sorry" overcautious government guidelines. If I thought it was unsafe I would have abstained, but I really haven't come across any proper evidence that I should.

i think i nursed a glass of red say, 3-4 nights a week
and i MEAN, i nursed it! i'd have the thing in my hands for ages - it was warm! it was more for the feel of the glass and the lingering taste
So far DS (16 months) has been an absolute delight. spoke to my GP about it, as the advice changed to zero towards the end of my PG
his response - i think we've lived alongside alcohol for long enough by now, just relax
also, time was, beer or wine was the safest option as it was relatively sterile
of course, once you start caning it - different ball game.
ultimately, though, it's up to the individual, and i don't think (unless there's huge amounts involved) it's anyone else's business

But isn't the whole point that the true effects are not known?

No woman in their right mind would volunteer to be the "80 units per week" subject or even the "30 units per week" subject for a randomised controlled trial during her pregnancy.

In fact, it is unlikely that most women would tell their midwife exactly how much they drink. It is well known in health circles that if a patient tells you they smoke 10 cigarettes a day, they are likely to be smoking at least 15.

So, all the journals can report is speculative information, based on what they have been told by pregnant women as to how much alcohol is consumed. Then, people use this lack of information to justify continuing with something that has been shown to be a risk.

FAS has been shown to be 0.2-2 in 1000 in America. Spina Bifida is about 0.7 in 1000 in America - who's going to vote that you shouldn't bother taking Folic Acid because research only shows about a 70% decrease in incidence with FA? No, you take it because there is a chance that it will have an effect on the outcome.

I am that people can have such a cynical attitude to something so serious. Yes, of course the government are just joining with the masses to undermine the free will of women everywhere.

Come on, this isn't China where you get told how many children you can have. Britain is one of the most privileged countries in the world. Some women, even in America, for example, don't get any prenatal advice, because they can't pay for it.

How totally irresponsible for people to ignore completely the advice given to them. I am not talking about the odd glass of vino. If you can accept the (probably very small) risk then go for it.

What is known is that like so many other things, the risks for FAS can be disproportionate. The alcoholic down the road could have a string of healthy children, whilst the woman across the street who 'only' drank moderately could have a child with FAS.

Anyway, doubt my view will be popular. I just think that we need to remember that there are so many things you can't control in a baby's development. This is one thing you can.

Sorry if anyone is offended by my last post. I just saw

I used to work alongside Dr. Raj Mukherjee, who has done lots of the research into alcohol and FAS.

The problem is that no safe level of alcohl exposure can be agree upon, because it is wholly unethical to undertake the sort of trials that would be needed to establish this. Ergo to 100% guarantee the absence of any infinitessimly small risk of alcohol damage, the advice would have to be to avoid alcohol completely.

But common sense clearly tells us otherwise.

I gave up alcohol after finding out I was pregnant, but did so completely irrationally, to "compensate" for the fact that I got totally trollied on at least 3 occasions between getting pregnant and finding out I was pregnant.

I think what irritates people the most about the more strident insistences that pregnant women shouldn't even have a sniff of shandy is the way in which pregnant women are assumed not to be able to make risk assessments and choose for themselves (we have a Government that just loves making up more and more rules and exerting more and more control, so we now have a culture where everyone (except politicians and their mates) is assumed to be a vicious moron who needs to be watched, nagged and controlled every minute of every day, just in case he or she does something bad.) The how-could-you-possiboy-do-anything-with-even-a-tiny-risk approach is basically saying to pregnant women: you are not a person any more, and the foetus matters much more than you do. Which is a toxic, dangerous way of thinking.

not every day and rarely in 1st trimester but later in preg did have low alcohol lager 3-4 x a week but only one each time

Such an interesting thread. DD (18 months) took two years to conceive and I know that I didn't have a sniff of booze from the night she was conceived until I was 12 weeks while all her bits were forming, then I had a glass or wine on a Friday and/or saturday for the rest of the pregnancy and felt absolutely fine with that.
The only time I felt weird about drinking was on our 'babymoon' holiday in Oman when I was five months and I just felt really self-conscious having wine with dinner with a bump, esp as it's a dry country. And of course, people never offer you wine!
This time round (I'm 12 weeks now) we weren't actively trying and I was very surprised to be pg, and I know I had about 3 rather pissed nights between conceiving and finally accepting that my period was not going to arrive, and I did a test. Then stopped drinking altogether, partly because I've had dreadful sickness and just didn't want it. As of last weekend, though, I'm allowing myself a smallish glass on a Fri and/or Sat again if I feel like it. I don't need it, exactly, it's just the only way I've know to mark the end of the week (cos let's face it, Sat and Sun with a toddler are pretty much like the rest of the week!) and feeling like a grown-up adult rather than 'just' mummy. But each to their own - my best friend had a glass of wine every night after 12 weeks with her DD, and other friends have abstained completely for the whole thing and beyond.

Dear all,

It is an interesting thread and I have been watching it though have never posted before. Madammez I think your comment about all the restrictions being a toxic, dangerous way of thinking very true and valid. I am not a drinker and never have been (I just don't like the taste) but I have recently had to move countries because no doctor where I was living would prescribe anything for my severe intractible insomnia. I was talking about a very mild dose to be used occasionally to enable me to get well. I am much better now, but the result of their refusal to help as meant that I have had to stop work early. How right you are, that people make judegements / restricitons and stop thinking about us. After all we are the ones carrying the baby and if we are happy / healthy we are more likely to have happy / healthy babies. I think drinking in moderation as described by people on this page is fine!

This is indeed an interesting thread.
I think one of the problems pg women face is the sheer volume of conflicting evidence - and not just from different official sources.
My MW's clinic is a case in point.
FOR EXAMPLE:
(a) 'pre-booking in session' - basically a group talk from a MW to about 20 women, i'm nine weeks pg. 'I'm not going to tell you to give up drinking, cos that's not realistic is it?' MW says, chuckling. 'Just try to cut down a bit, and don't worry about it too much.'
NOT what I expected and I felt this was a bit limp-wristed. I'd already decided I wouldn't drink until I'm 12 weeks as had had an early bleed and was paranoid about mc.
(b) my booking in appointment - am 13 weeks pg. I tell my assigned MW (different woman) I'm planning to drink no more than one to two units once or twice a week (as per all but the very latest advice). Cue VISIBLE disapproval from MW and her insertion into my notes 'XX intends to continue drinking throughout the pgy'. Which is true, but also makes me sound like a flaming alkie imo! (or is that the paranoia again?!)

So, not only conflicting advice - but bloody full on double standards and judgement from two women working in the same profession and in the same flipping office?!
Doesn't really help one make an informed decision, does it?!

I think part of the difficulty with stopping drinking for some women is just that they've been doing it so long. For the first few months walking past the off licence near my house used to make me crave wine like nobody's business, but I've pretty much stopped thinking about it now - getting out of the habit is the thing.

My understanding is that the change in advice was about the ethics of giving accurate advice, rather than any new medical research. I'm 5ft 10ins tall and weigh 12 stone when not pg so a glass of wine would hardly touch the sides (although after months of mostly abstinence that's not the case now). My BF is 5ft and tiny and a glass would have her on the floor - so how could the same advice apply to both of us?

I think common sense is the best approach. If I want a glass of champagne at a party I'm going to have one, but I'm not going to kid myself it won't reach the baby and won't affect it. Being honest with oneself is what's really important imo.

Apologies if anyone has mentioned this before but I didn't spot it, but I thought I'd throw into the mix that the draft NICE guidelines in October suggested that women should restrict their alcohol intake to one small glass (1.5 units) per day. The final recommendations will be published in March.

After reviewing the available (and conflicting) information available I have the occasional glass of wine (sometimes two if its a small glass .

Going back to the original post - If you're friend appears to have weighed up all the options and decided to have a glass or two every day I'd be very careful about weighing in to warn her of the dangers.

However, if you really, genuinely think she's oblivious to the issues surely it could be easy enough to bring it up in conversation generally in the same way you would something else you'd seen on the news etc, without being judgemental?

Crikey, I really should have reviewed that post first. Apologies for schoolboy grammar errors etc .