Rights to an elective C section - help winning the argument

[Rachae]

Hi Everyone,

I'd be so grateful of anyone's advice who is FOR elective C sections and understands the value of these and the feeling that they are safer.

I know that I have a right to ask and that under guidelines, the consultant has to refer me to another if they refuse ... It would just be easier if I can win the argument first time round.

Any stats/ facts/ pointers would be very much appreciated!

I'm going to put together a slide deck on this to present my view at my meeting... And I want to be data driven where possible.

My personal thoughts and stance is:

1. Vaginal birth is ideologically pushed on women. A lot of facts about risks of vaginal birth are skirted over or not discussed at all, i.e. tearing, forceps implications, baby going into distress, cord wrapped around neck etc etc

1. There is a national target in the NHS to keep C sections below 25% - this is backed by campaigns for vaginal births and bias language features in every pamphlet

1. The obvious one, C-Sections cost the NHS more money

1. Because I've had many losses and PTSD across the first trimester, I lean towards a c section because I'd like more certainty around due date. I also believe this is the safest option for my baby - rather than necessarily me. (I may end up with a blood transfusion or an infection, yes). Rather than a baby being forced down a birth canal and knowing im in agony and possibly hear me crying out ... The baby is lifted out of my tummy calmly. This to me is safest, most calm way of delivery

Xxx

You’re making a decision for yourself, you’re not policy making. You don’t need to be data driven (and you wouldn’t be going the right way about it if you wanted to be!) You wanting a C section is enough. Just be really insistent. Good luck with it.

To the comments like 'is this a wind up' - you know it isn't. I've mentioned pregnancy losses and PTSD, so what kind of pleasure do you get by putting a judgemental remark like that? Nice empathy for other women

Sorry, I really couldn’t believe someone would genuinely go into a meeting with a medical professional will a slide show, spouting stuff about their unborn child’s distress at hearing their mother in labour.

@Wnkingawalrus then I guess my desperation doesn't come through enough and you really also don't understand or empathise with PTSD/ those in need for better mental health

I think turning up with a slide show will actually highlight how anxious you are and how the thought of a natural birth is damaging to your mental health.

You have the right to a caesarean but they don’t make it easy so you do what you feel is right to make your point.

When I was researching I looked up natural birth vs births with interventions and then of those interventions how many ended in EMCS. Then I compared EMCS and ELCS outcomes.

In the end I actually had a natural birth with episiotomy and ventouse because I was too scared to even ask for one because my consultant was such a cow. Good for you for sticking up for yourself! I hope you get the outcome you want.

OP, I requested an elective section with my first. No medical reason, no previous losses, no PTSD, I'd just done my research and was more comfortable with the potential risks associated with a section than a vaginal birth.

I'd read that you really needed to fight your case and 'go prepared' to the birth choices meeting with the consultant so I went to town... Wrote a letter outlining my request and reasons for it. I also put together a pro's and con's list of both methods of delivery to highlight that I was well aware of the risks involved. Turns out I needn't have bothered. They granted my request without any pushback.

I'm now scheduled to have my second elective section next month. Had to have another meeting with the consultant where she went over the risks again but it was just a box ticking exercise.

Just be aware that C-sections are not necessarily as safe as a vaginal birth for babies- my daughter was a natural birth and came into the world very calmly. However my son was a C-section and spent 5 days in the NICU on oxygen and antibiotics because he didn't clear the fluid from his lungs like a natural birth would have allowed him.

You don't need to give them facts to request one, just go in saying you want one, plain and simple.

I've just had an elective section and it went really smoothly. For me, the advantages were: I knew a date for delivery and could prepare for it mentally (previous traumatic experiences); removed the potential to go overdue (with all the associated risks) while avoiding induction (with its associated risks); significantly reduced risks of complications which were significant to me (eg prolapses, serious tears). I didn't really need to go into any of it with my consultant though - I just said to her that I was considering an elective section and she said "ok". I was aware all along that I could change my mind, but having that reassurance of a planned delivery was great.

It sounds to me like you might actually feel happier with a different consultant if your relationship with your current one is difficult, so if the discussion doesn't go how you want initially, that could be a blessing in disguise if it hrlps you get a consultant with whom you can have a good relationship.

If it helps reassure you, I was in and out of theatre in under an hour, was up and about well within 12 hours, and my baby's Apgar scores were absolutely fine.

@Rachae

Thank you everyone - I really appreciate (almost) all of your comments. You're right... The slides are too much! I guess the first time I spoke with the consultant, I realised she was incredibly data driven and came across as aggressive to me. She came across as someone who was very much against c sections and said something like 'we'll see about that'. So I was trying to think about how I could appeal to her logical nature and somehow find some common ground in the discussion.

On reflection of what everyone's said, I'm going to go way more human-centred now. She actually jeered at me when I first mentioned c section and said ' oh is it for the mental health?' in a very eye roll way. So I'd ruled this out as a plausible point that she would accept.

To the comments like 'is this a wind up' - you know it isn't. I've mentioned pregnancy losses and PTSD, so what kind of pleasure do you get by putting a judgemental remark like that? Nice empathy for other women.

Thanks everyone, I'm really grateful xx

Hello op, I’m so sorry your consultant was so awful. Doctors do and incredible job but some of them are shit people.

I agree with the others that a focus on trauma and make sure you’ve done the reading and know the risks is important. A c section is no walk in the park but it worked for me and I would potentially do it again.
I don’t want to be one of those people but hypnobirthing was amazing for me in my pregnancy. You don’t have to be pro natural birth it’s actually very empowering to women and being confident in your choices. For example it made me confident and much more understanding of natural birth but also gave me the confidence so that it was ME who pushed for a C-section when things weren’t going well.

I’d also complain about your consultant tbh.

Thanks so much for all of the additional comments - I'm really grateful! So glad I posted this as I'm going to completely change my approach to it. Thanks ☺️ xx

You need to access the policy at that Trust/Heath board. The end point will be referal to other centre.
I contacted the 'other centre' who said they were no longer accepting MREC from my Trust. So the conversation with my consultant was where will you send me then?
We were considering far flung Trysts/health boards.
They did give me one in the end.