Soft cheese and cured meats not giving them up

[hanny24]

So, my usual diet includes these foods anyway, since being pregnant I have wanted garlic roulade MORE. I know they say not to but what are the actual risks?, surely I'm not the only woman to ever eat 'the unthinkable' pregnancy foods...I mean think of the French women..oh I've also had a craving for beer too so I've had 2 beers in this time (up to 16 weeks) however one was non alcoholic...

I'm also a big fan of raw fish and sushi but I have checked with my local sushi place and I am fine to eat there still as the fish has been pre frozen (like most in the U.K.) but I'm really struggling with this cheese thing!!

Anything else I should not eat?

It’s only unpasteurised soft cheese. Boursin and the like is fine.

Soft cheese is fine. Eat away.

I'm sure garlic roulade is fine. It's mould ripened soft cheese and blue cheese you should avoid. You can eat them if they are cooked too
www.nhs.uk/common-health-questions/pregnancy/why-can-i-not-eat-soft-cheeses-during-pregnancy/

Google the nhs advice.

I been eating Parma ham and smoked salmon and things. I just freeze them for 24 hours then devour!!! 😂 haven't found a way around pate yet.
But I've eaten most cheeses... had a whole baked Camembert to myself the other day!! 🙈 but it was baked, so figured it was fine!

You can eat soft cheese as long as it's pasteurised (president make a pasteurised brie) or cooked, so baked camembert/brie is fine

I would 100% recommend the book Expecting Better by Emily Oster. She goes through all the pregnancy "rules" and gives the facts and the results of all the studies done so you can make informed decisions once you know the risks and how high they are

I ate an entire salami platter the night before I got my BFP, i had been craving it all day and it was one of the reasons I tested. I think its Brie & Blue cheeses you are supposed to avoid. I've had lots of people tell me different things about food - one of my friends even said I shouldn't be eating Lobster - it is my only craving at the moment and I will eat it lol.

I seem to crave pâté in pregnancy :( that's a total no no right?

You can have Brie and blue cheeses if they are pasteurised, which many are nowadays.
You can have smoked salmon, whoever mentioned that.
You can have salami if it’s been frozen beforehand.

French women also follow the same pregnancy rules.

Brie and Blue cheeses are not ok even if pasteurised due to the high moisture content - you can have them cooked though. Conversely you can eat unpasteurised hard blue cheese because it is not moist

There is nothing you CANNOT eat. Some foods just have(low) some risks. Entirely your choice!

My midwife told me I could have pasteurised! So I did

As dementedpixie says, it's not so much pasteurised/unpasteurised as moisture content in the cheese: higher moisture content results in higher likelihood of listeria being present in the cheese.

However, that doesn't mean listeria IS in the cheese and in fact incidence cases of listeria from cheese is low. Most cases of listeriosis occur after eating salad which has not been properly washed.

Listeria is killed by cooking so even soft mound ripened cheeses should be fine to eat if cooked all the way through until bubbling.

I'd recommend (as a PP has) the Emily Oster book as a good read to help you assess the actual risks of eating "forbidden" things.

I haven't given up anything this time except for carpaccio this time. I don't really drink anyway so that hasn't been an issue. I looked in to why certain things have to be given up and made a reasoned decision about all the NHS advised things. Some I don't eat anyway though so not an issue.

Listeriosis is incredibly rare. I'm not saying you should stuff yourself with soft cheese every day, but it's worth googling the actual statistics of these diseases/ risk foods before completely cutting them out. IMO, obviously.

I second the Emily Oster book if you want to make informed decisions for yourself. She examines the research basis for the guidance and also talks about whether she personally chose to reject or follow it - for example (from memory) she decides to consume coffee, alcohol and sushi.

Different foods are considered risky for different reasons. France (and some other European countries) tend to be more relaxed about alcohol after the first trimester, but obsessive about toxoplasmosis because they have much higher rates than in the UK so women there are tested regularly throughout pregnancy - if you've had toxoplasmosis pre-pregnancy then it's fine to eat cured meat, if not, you're advised to avoid it (as well as washing raw fruit and veg thouroughly at home and avoiding them completely when eating out).

Just one thing to add- I was totally sceptical about this and thought the rules were really ott.

Then I got food poisoning after eating some Camembert that had gone off (took one bite and realised!) and my god it was awful! I felt severely nauseous and dizzy for about 3 days! Thankfully wasn't while I was pregnant !

You can eat soft cheese as long as it's pasteurised

You can eat whatever you wish but this is a very very common misunderstanding of the NHS guidance. It clearly advises against mould-ripened soft cheese, pasteurised or otherwise. Hard unpasteurised cheese is not a problem.

...I mean think of the French women

The French government guidelines are exactly the same as the British ones.

I don't know why everyone also brings up French women as though they're cramming down the unpasteurized cheeses and red wine. They're not. Most of them, like most of us, give up these things because the thought of what could happen is far worse than simply skipping the camembert for a while. That said, you can look up the statistics and make your own informed decision.

Thanks everyone, the 'French women' part was a lighthearted joke, Obviously I do know they don't just drink wine and eat cheese 24/7 (but how ideal eh!) but thanks on tips from most of you about freezing cooking and buying pasteurised! X

Take it all with a pinch of salt and do your own research. My take is that you can pretty much eat anything as the risks are very low. I do avoid pate though for the vitamin A content (I've not really looked into that but don't eat pate much anyway) and although I don't think a glass of wine or two will do any harm I just don't fancy it. Probably because I know I shouldn't really down a whole bottle so what's the point!

You don’t need to buy pasteurised cheese. If you want to follow the guidelines you should avoid soft mould-ripened cheese like Brie whether pasteurised or not, and you can eat unpasteurised and pasteurised hard cheese, like cheddar or Stilton.

Although - soft cheeses like cream cheese, feta and mozzarella need to be pasteurised, but I honestly don’t know where you’d even find unpasteurised cream cheese or garlic roule unless you buy directly from a niche creamery.

I never understand the confusion around the NHS cheese guidance? It's quite clear on the NHS website.

I'm afraid I have been rather lax following the guidelines this pregnancy, although I stuck to them resolutely in my first. I've had brie once, salami / cured meat (that hadn't been frozen) a couple of of times, rare beef (including carpaccio) on three occasions... I'm currently in Spain and finding it quite hard to resist the iberico!

I think a woman's right to make an informed decision is important. I personally definitely wouldn't eat liver or pate, or swordfish / marlin while pregnant. The other guidelines I'm a bit more relaxed about it seems. Likewise I am avoiding shellfish (just mussels, clams, winkles etc. but not crab, prawns and the like) NOT because the NHS advise it, but because I have had a very high rate of food poisoning from that type of shellfish in the past so for me that is really not worth the risk. Up until I was pregnant I might have eaten a dish containing them (like fish soup or paella) but just picked them out, now I'm avoiding altogether!

It's a personal choice that it's up to you to make, and I wouldn't judge either way... I'd just make sure you understand the guidelines in the first instance.

@NewNameDueToMyIdiocy yeah I don't eat shellfish anyway and can't say I'm craving pate! My downfall really is only the odd bit of Brie and garlic roulade with crackers and some antipasti on the side!! I mean I don't eat it all the time but I'm sure the odd bit here and there will be fine :)