Gina Ford The Complete books

[MissyEm]

Hi has anyone read these books, are they any good?

I think different methods work for different kinds of people. I like structure in my life so her routines appealed to my preference for that. I FF DD from birth, and started her on the first routine at 2 weeks. It was essentially a feed every 3 hours and lots of naps. I don't think DD even noticed she was in a routine!

It wasn't hash or horrific, it was gentle and taught me a lot about reading her cues for hunger, tiredness etc. She got plenty of good quality sleep and 'contented' was a word that lots of people used to describe her. I took her principles and applied them in ways that suited us - DD was summer-born and we had lots of day-long walks where she had her naps in the pram (much better for both of us than spending the day holed up at home so that she could nap in her cot)

It made mat leave bearable, and returning to work easier because we didn't have a traumatic (for everyone) rush to get DD sleeping through by a certain deadline, she'd been doing it from about 12 weeks anyway. I have never had to leave her to cry it out which I thank GF for.

I am a routine bird and hate the thought of the baby been attached to me and only soothed, content etc by me.

I'm afraid that that is what it is to have a newborn, OP. You might find it interesting to read the most recent thinking on the concept of the 'fourth trimester'. GF won't stop your baby needing you. 'Attachment' isn't just about parents who co-sleep and use slings; attachment theory is of vital importance in the baby's first year for many developmental reasons.

There's absolutely no reason why you cannot form a strong attachment and use GF, of course, but I think you need to manage your expectations of what parenting a newborn looks like.

I'm afraid that that is what it is to have a newborn, OP

Not quite @Buxbaum

When it all got too much for me at a few points in the first few weeks, DH would step in and happily feed DD.

He also wanted to share the love and the feeding and the skin to skin too.

The OP is being honest about her feelings here. Not all of us want to have the babe a-breast all the time and the modern world means we don’t have to. A godsend if you have other demanding children to look after

I used it with my first child and found it wasn't making me happy. I was constantly anxious about times, naps, feeding etc.

However I do think it is a good general rule of thumb and used the timings with my second child but in a much more relaxed way. I ignored the other bits and cuddled him to sleep, co slept and breastfed on demand and he's turned out a very happy and healthy boy.

When it all got too much for me at a few points in the first few weeks, DH would step in and happily feed DD.

So did mine. Attachment theory cheerfully recognises the value of more than one caregiver.

Not all of us want to have the babe a-breast all the time

I didn't suggest that was necessary.

How defensive. I haven't criticised GF, or anyone who uses her guidance. As I said upthread she wasn't for me but she was a godsend for many friends. OP has been honest about her feelings and I am trying to be honest about the biological needs of a newborn.

Hang on, after posting I can see how defensive-y it looked. Not my intention, honestly.

Very understandable, Beans. It's an emotive subject

Please understand that it is entirely up to your baby or not whether the GF routine 'works.' If your baby is like my DS, then theu will fall into a routine anyway. If your baby is like my DD and you try to impose a routine you're setting yourself up for a world of misery. Read your baby not a book.

Try the baby whisperer, still routine, but much more baby's needs centred, and less imposing things on them.

Really confused as a first time Mum want to read now Also looking at the Mumsnet book list..........I will end up buying 5 books at this rate! I know and I will follow instincts but it's in my nature to do some reading and get some ideas and guidance as well. Your personal opinions have been great thanks for sharing.

My life (and my baby's) was a much happier and relaxed place once I ditched the books. So bloody stressful trying to get babies to fit to a routine!

Babies work to their own timetable. If you work around them, your baby will be happier and, by extension, so will you.

Those who found GF to work for them, what happens if your baby doesn't do the things they're supposed to at the correct point in time? Does she give methods for correcting this to get back on schedule?

Im reading sarah ockwell-smith Gentle
Sleep book at present.

Well every day is a new day Assassinated and you treat it as such and start afresh each morning. There will of course be days when nothing goes according to plan - that happens whether you follow a schedule or not - you have to be able to brush those days off and start afresh the following day.

In terms of within the individual day, if my DC had wanted to sleep when it wasn't nap time, then I worked hard to keep them awake - not always possible, but it worked most of the time. It was hard work for sure, and like I said - those first few months are by far the hardest - but you get on with it. If it's the other way around and they didn't sleep at all when they were meant to, then yes, you get them up at the scheduled time, even if they have only slept for 10 min and carry on as best you can.

You do of course have to have a bit of wisdom to deal with those situations and you read your baby, so you might bring forward bed time that night by 10/15 min to help make up for the lost nap time earlier, but you pretty much try to stick to schedule and deal with anything that goes wrong as it comes up.

I mentioned above that my first dc was a total speed-feeder and so I always had way more time to fill than the book suggested because feeds only took 15-20min. I worked around that.

I did the same with my youngest two who took a hell of a lot longer to feed because there were two of them and because of the reflux which resulted in so many throw-ups and clean-ups that feeds seemed to take forever! Again - we worked around it.

Same with middle DC who also had severe reflux, but also severe eczema so every nappy change/clothes change took way longer than it would normally because of all the different creams etc - we worked around it.

Then you get up at 7am the next day and start all over again no matter how the previous day or night went. Each day is a new beginning.

That's not trying to be defensive at all by the way - just trying to explain it as it worked for us.

I will however be defensive to the PP who said that GF goes against every maternal instinct - that's utter bollocks. I have plenty of maternal instinct and people who follow a schedule are not lacking in it - they just choose to do things differently.

As I mentioned above - it was interesting how when I had my twins I was told by absolutely everyone (HCPs included) that I MUST have a routine, I must NOT feed on demand, I MUST get them to feed at the same time, sleep at the same time etc because otherwise life would literally have ground to a halt which wasn't a possibility for us because I had two older DC and no wider support. (Also because they were prem and we needed to feed regularly to keep their weight up) Suddenly the things I had done for DC1&2 and been criticised heavily for, I was being implored to do and praised for doing - and no-one suggested that doing so would go against my maternal instinct or make me cruel, or a hitler-mum, or would damage my children or any of the other things I had been told the first two times around.

I just want to add that it's important to see attachment as a good thing. It really is normal and healthy for babies to be comforted and soothed by you (and your partner or another trusted caregiver, it's not all about you sacrificing everything to have your baby attached to you 24/7). But it's about meeting their basic emotional and physical needs and often that is done through physical closeness and responsiveness in the first few months. That doesn't mean following a routine is bad, but it does mean that trying to break attachment or prevent those bonds from forming by ignoring basic needs is bad. You can have a general schedule if that works for you and your baby. What you shouldn't be doing though is refusing to feed them when they are hungry or leaving them unattended for long periods of time during the day or night without changing or feeding or soothing. There are some schools of thought (not explicitly GF, though some people lean that way on the more extreme end) that babies should be left 12 hours a night with no attention at all, even if they are hungry, even if they cry for hours, even if in distress they are sick all over themselves. They have to wait til morning to be taught that they don't get attention just by demanding it. That's sick and wrong. Some of those babies go on to develop attachment disorders later in life and need all sorts of support because they didn't have the love and nurturing they needed and one or a collection of caregivers they were really bonded with from birth.

My SIL is a clinical psychologist who works with kids with attachment disorders and it's heartbreaking. I'm not saying those are directly caused by GF methods. But I'm saying that you might want to do some reading on attachment in early infancy and understand what it's about. It's not about 'attachment parenting' (though that's what we did and I found it easy and stress-free and my dd has grown up to be a lovely, confident, outgoing, not at all clingy kid who has mostly always slept great). It's about fostering bonds and trust and developing your baby's emotional life. That's not impossible with a strict routine if it happens pretty organically, but if you have to force it, withhold feeds, ignore them for hours at a time each day, to make it happen, it can have negative consequences down the line which it might be hard to anticipate now.

I’m honeatly not being goady but where does this method get recommended

There are some schools of thought (not explicitly GF, though some people lean that way on the more extreme end) that babies should be left 12 hours a night with no attention at all, even if they are hungry, even if they cry for hours, even if in distress they are sick all over themselves. They have to wait til morning to be taught that they don't get attention just by demanding it

as that’s promoting abuse, not a “routine”

Just also interested to hear from Rylan, we are at high risk of DTs occuring should I get pregnant again. How early did the DTs settle into a routine and are they still decent sleepers now?

Sorry for thread derail.

I found it really helpful after the newborn stage. It gave me some structure to work with, but she even says herself in the book, it's a guide and can be tweaked to suit you. My LG is a great sleeper and well behaved - whether Gina Ford had any influence on this, I can't say. I'm expecting my second in a few weeks so will be interesting to see what they're like! I'll be following the routines again.

Followed book 1 roughly, worked great, baby got into a feed and bed routine by 10 days old, just have to use it roughly, my baby napped longer than the book said and also didn't have wakeful periods for as long as the book suggested.
I let baby lead on naps and also didn't enforce napping in her cot, as such she sleeps anywhere, pushchair, carseat, cot.
We got into a routing for feeds (FF) and bedtime, 7pm and at 18m old she still loves her bedtime routine, always up at around 7pm, teeth brushed and story then into grobag and bed, she starts saying night night at around 7 when she's ready to go up

My DTs were in hospital until 3 weeks old Legend and when they came home they were on 3-hourly feeds but still sleeping a lot.

I switched them onto GF when we got home and by 6 weeks they were sleeping through from 7pm-12am-7am. Like with my other two it was about 4m before they were sleeping 7-7. They did sleep during the day more than the book said, but that was because they were prem and very small. We still stuck to the routine but learned very quickly that them falling asleep 20/30min early was ok.

They honestly settled into the routine probably the easiest of all my DC - it was certainly less work with them.

They are now 7 and brilliant sleepers - we've never had any regression from any of ours. We've moved house several times, moved country, regularly travelled overseas to places with 5/6hr time difference and honestly it's never been a problem - jet lag doesn't even faze them. (the only issues we have with them are them mucking about at bed time and getting into each others' beds to read under the covers together )

As per @rylan we’ve also not had any sleep regressions and have travelled without any issues

I got given them and i find her absolutely terrifying already!!

Also....she has no kids of her own i believe. I find that a bit weird.