Very Naive Best Friend pregnant with twins......do I offer her advice or leave it alone??

[mymama]

My bf is 12 weeks pregnant with twins. It is her first pregnancy/children. She is very naive (sp??) with regards to the whole pregancy/children thing (she didn't know you bled after birth !?!) It is actually quite lovely.

However, they have quite a lot of debt and she earns double what he earns. He is also casual and doesn't get sick/holiday leave. Their plan is for her to have the twins and return to work after 10 weeks and he will stay home full time to care for the twins as child care will be too expensive. (I know, I know!!)

He is not the most "paternal" fellow and this would be a tough job for an experienced mum never mind a first time dad. She asks my advice about most things but can also be a little touchy if it is not what she wants to hear. Do I try to suggest they may need a backup plan or do I let it go and experience it for themselves?

well, you shouldn't pidgeonhole him as incapable at this point in time - people change so much when they have children, I think it would be harsh.
Let them work it out themselves and don't put anxieties and doubts in their minds at this point in time - what good would it do?

As for the bleeding after birth, I don't think I knew that until I was pregnant. It's not exactly something single people discuss, is it?

You've got months before the babies are born. I would wait and see if she asks your advice. Otherwise, just drop hints about how difficult it is to cope with a newborn baby, let alone twins, and see if a conversation develops.

I wouldn't impose it on her as she might be feeling bad about only having 10 weeks off anyway. Presumably, they have their own reasons for doing it like this and financial necessity often means we have to do things we would rather not.

PS - I didn't know about bleeding after birth until one of my friends (with children) told me I had to get maternity pads about a week before ds was born. And I had done the NCT antenatal classes by then!!

I don't think any of us have any right to decide if people would be competent with their own children or not

I would be frank but encouraging iyswim. They will get through it but it won't be easy. And also I would be on hand to take twins out for long walks so they can get some sleep.
He may well rise to and enjoy the challenge, offspring have been known to change men.........

is there a light hearted way you could open her eyes? Like a funny memoir (if she's a reader), or light hearted instruction manusl, or a film? Then you don't have to push thew point, butr she might start to 'wake up'.

In the same vein of 'letting her discover it herself' perhaps engineering gatherings wher there are young babies present. Before long mum's start to spill the beans. if she hears thiungs by eavesdropping, she may be less touchy.

Thanks for the replies.

geekgrrl I don't think of it as pigeonholing him - he didn't want kids. She kind of forced him into it as they have quite an age difference. She has told him he has to stay home as he doesn't earn enough. I am not sure what he thinks.

My concern is that they will go with this plan and he may not cope. They have no family support close by and I am leaving for a year in the UK 3 weeks after birth otherwise I would have tried to help out as much as possible. (We only live 1 street apart). I am pretty much the only close friend she has.

So don't suggest perhaps putting her name down with local childcare centres just in case?

I wouldn't presume to offer advice unless she specifically asks for it. I don't think any of us were really properly prepared for motherhood and birth at the beginning. I would let them be on their own journey of discovery. The best you can do is make sure she knows you are there for her if she needs you whether it's just to chat, moan or for practical help.

fireflyfairy2 I am not suggesting whether he will be competent or not. I actually think he will be a pretty good dad. I am not sure how he will cope with twins at 10 weeks of age on his own without any outside help. I have 3 dc and shudder at the thought myself.

if they are being unrealistic, they'll soon find out. i'd be very offended if i was told my ideas were naive and my partner was useless.

I may have come across wrong. I will not tell her she is naive and he is useless. I was planning to suggest a plan b in case they need it.

The thing is that there is no way to impart to first time parents how parenthood will be. So yes explain that a plan b would be a good idea just in case, tell them you will answer any questions you can and leave it at that.

i have to say whats the difference between a mum looking after twins and a dad? most men get at most 2 weeks paternity leave and the mum is then generally left on her own at home, whether she has one or two babies.

i found your original post quite sexist, you are implying that men are incapable of taking care of 10 week old twins. What is going to make the mother sooo much better than the father. They are both first time parents to the twins!

well that's different. it's early days though- they may change their own minds anyway. or what they are planning may work wonderfully. you never know.

katzg I don't think my original post was sexist at all. This fellow currently spends his nights/weekends playing playstation/watching cable television/drinking beer whilst my friend does everything. She works full time 6:00am to 6:00pm cooks, cleans, looks after their pool/yard/car and fetches his beers. My general assumption is that he may not be up to the task of two babies ie 2 x nappies, 2 x bottles and everything else that goes with such young babies.

Popular opinion seems to be leave it alone. Will do so and let them get through it on their own.

agree with carmenere - I reall don't think there's a way of telling them how tough it'll be, and any insistence on your part will just piss her off.
I do think it would be a good idea to (nicely) encourage her to consider other childcare options if there are waiting lists in your area (although wouldn't a nanny cost the same as nursery x2?), but if she doesn't want to discuss it then don't pursue the matter. It's their life after all.

I totally understand you rconcerns and think you are right, but I don't see what you can do about it. Maybe put her in touch with a multiple births support group so she gets some idea of what lies ahead?

mymama

Rather than totally leaving it alone how about some gentle support. As others have said their learning curve will be steep but most 1st timers have to go through this - admittedly their curve amy be steeper but remembering a friend of mine with twins the urge to also prepare and focus comes along at a much quicker pace. obvious reason being he rapid growth of the bump itself as well as comments from people they don't even know!. personally I wouldnt use knowledge about bleeding after birth as guage as most women don't know about this before having a baby - some not even til a few weeks before childbirth. And the decions about return to work may be straightforward neccecity.

Clearly you are a caring friend so I recokon you will get the overall balance right. How about:

• doing some research for tem about the location of the nearest TAMBA or other multiple births groups.
• keeping an eye out for hints, tips other stuff that will help both during the pregnancy and once they are parents
• keeping an eye out for places that are father friendly so that when he does take on main caring responsibilties you can give him some hints too.
• pointing her towards mumsnet - esp the twins section in parenting

It's really irrelevent if he is not "paternal" in your view. That's such a subjective description that people use, i.e. she's "maternal" or "not maternal", etc. It's impossible to tell these things, you can't know what goes on in someone's mind or heart. It's quite a different thing to being neglectful, isn't it? Plus the fact that he has chosen, however difficult it would or would not be, to stay home with the twins says a lot. There are probably more men out there that would not even consider this. It's also irrelevent that he didn't want kids. People have all kinds of reasons they don't think they want kids but when the child is there it's a different story. Reality changes all kinds of things.

Let them figure it out on their own. I cannot stand it when people try to give me unsolicited advice regading pregnancy or child care. Personally, I am not naive about these sort of things but even if your friend is, she and her DP may surprise you and cope remarkabley well. There are many people that do not find it such a struggle to raise children and balance life, for lack of better description - it's easier for some people than it is for others. If they can't cope they will figure it out very quickly. I think a good rule of thumb is don't offer advice even if you mean well unless you are aksed for your opinion. Don't worry, I'm sure they will be fine and figure things out for themselves. You simply can't tell now whether they will or won't cope at this stage so it's not for you to say unless she asks you what you think.

I had to come back to this thread as I am a little surprised at the reactions. I don't see how suggesting a backup childcare plan ie names on waiting lists for centres translates to unsolicited advice re pregnancy and raising children. I had no intention of talking to her about the pregnancy or the actual raising of the babies.

I also dislike unsolicited advice and people's tendency to tell you the hardships of being a parent. I never speak to my friend in this manner.

She asks my advice regularly regarding the pregnancy/birth/babies but I just tell her to go with what she feels, she will be a great mum and things will work out.

The bleeding after birth was simply an example. She also isn't aware babies don't sleep through from birth and that they go through more than 2 nappies per day amongst many other things she will soon find out. I have not given her "unsolicited" advice on these things either.

I am truly worried about the care thing as they have no family within 400 miles and I will not be here to help out either. As a mum of 3 single babies I can only imagine how exhausting twins will be.

I will, however, stay with the popular opinion and stay quiet and let them sort it for themselves. When the time comes, hopefully he will cope beyond my expectations and sail through.

hi, mymama. i would prob point out that 10 weeks is v early to return to work. i WOULD advise her strongly not to make any promises about return dates - as this could be v stressful. why not suggest she gives herself a little longer...and tells her employer that she'll give a firm date after the birth- leave it open in other words. i dont know any mums who couldve gone back that early! if she earns well, whats the prob with unpaid mat leave, for a while?

ps a friend gave his wife an xmas present when 7mo pg with twins (their first)...it was a surf board. lol. now thats naiive!...unless they have nannay to go on hols with, i suppose.

I agree with FC2007 - there are some small things you can do without treading on anyones toes. I think you are genuinely concerned about your friend and I would probably feel the same in your situation. Hope all goes well for them .