How to have a small baby and a VBAC ?

[jumana6]

HI
i had a c/s with my son (daughter was ventous) He was 3.92 Kg and possibly CPD (too big).
I am 14 wks pregnant and really want a VBAC next time. But one condition seems to be a small baby?
I know it sounds crazy, but I am desperate, if I starve myself will it work?

Jumana

It is crazy. You must eat sensibly.

Lulumama is a good person to talk to about VBAC.

I have just converted 3.92kg and it is only 8.6 lbs which doesn't seem that heavy at all. I really don't think you can do anything to ensure that the next baby is smaller than that. Surely you are at an advantage in that this will not be your first vaginal delivery? I think you just need to see how things go - eat sensibly and keep healthy and see how the baby is growing.

Jumana ...
I don't want to be the bearer of bad news ...
But I had a 4.5kg baby (10lbs 1/2oz) and a c/s. With my next pregnancy I was convinced that I would have a neat 7lber that would pop out after a 4 hour labour. I was also gunning for a VBAC. I had a very supportive midwife and I worked hard not to eat as many doughnuts as I did the first time round - my mother had convinced me that my first baby was big because I put on so much weight
Anyway, it is impossible to diet during pregnancy ... I watched what I ate, didn't touch even one doughnut, ate really healthy food ... but I needed to eat .... I didn't diet but watched what I ate ...
Anyway, still put on 4 stone .... .
It was clear my baby was big by month 7. But was still convinced it would be small. Anyway, I had an open mind about a c/s by the end and after a 12 hour labour I had a very positive (even enjoyable) c/section to give birth to my beautifull DD ... who weighed in at a whopping 4.8kg (10lbs 10oz) ...

There is no reason why you shouldn't have a VBAC really (3.9kg isn't that big really) but you may be very small etc etc ... but please keep and open mind about it ....

What I am trying to say is, the baby will take what it needs from you regardless of what you eat. It will be the size it is going to be .... starving yourself will only make YOU ill .... don't do it.

Aha ghosty but it can go the other way. DS was 9 lb 10 and despite the midwives saying that my next baby was bigger I stuck to my guns and had a very easy homebirth. DH and I were wittering on about how small she looked (as though she was a 5lber or something) and the midwife was giving us a funny look and weighed her in at 8lb 12.

do not starve yourself..you will make yourself ill
the baby takes all it needs from you...you eat less, the baby takes more of your reserves

3.92 kg is not massive

and thanks Mary for the heads up

Please don't worry about it and dont starve yourself and you and the baby need you to eat properly. Most babies can be birthed even if they are large it's just a matter of getting in the right position ie not lying on your back. You say he might have been too big but that isn't known so i would assume that that wasn't the case, it's very rare. 8 pounds odd isn't that large for a baby and I would be shocked if that was too large for you. Women give birth to much larger babies all the time and most say it's easier than small babies. My dd was 5lb 14 and a half and ds 7 lb 12 and a half but both were early 4 and 2 weeks respectively. The birth of ds was much better for me (even though longer pushing) and I felt much more in control.

Jumana - who said CPD - it is actually quite rare to have true CPD - and can be checked while you are pregnant.

a bigger baby in some ways is easier to birth....than a smaller one as the weight of the baby actually can help propel it out!

women tend to make the size of baby they can birth...

if i was in your shoes...

i would find out exactly why one birth was c.s and one was ventouse.....

there are so many complex reasons why births end up being mdeicalised...and there is a lot you can do to help yourself while you are pregnant...the fact your are considering starving yourself to get a vbac proves that it is desperately important to you..but there are ways to help that don;t harm you!!

you need to eat a sensible balanced diet and take care of yourself...and part of that is addressing the previous births and this one to come....

one baby has been born through your pelvis..with a little help from a ventouse..which bodes well for you being able to birth vaginally.....

i asked for a growth scan in my last trimester as had been told ( by well meaning!!! eople i was huuuuge!) including an obs!!! Babylulu weighed in at 7 lb 9.....smaller than my first! and with a smaller head!

be honest and open with your midwife and consultant about how important it is to you to go for a VBAC...

The only way to truly tell if baby is too large is an xray and they wont do that in pregnancy, growth scans aren't accurate an can be out by up to 2 pounds either way so don't rely on that. The thing is just not to worry and accept that your body does know what it's doing.

do not starve yourself - I ate everything - qwuite literally in sight, first tri I couold only manage light meals salads etc but after that it was 2nd tri of junk and greesy crap then a thir leveled out to half anfd half, boy turned out at 7lb exactly, and i'd put on the average 2 stone.

apparently some women's bodys are v good at making bigger babies - least that's what my m/w said - probably a load of old tosh thou cos each PG is differnt. my mate was careful all thru her PG v strict and her little boy ended up as 7lb 2 oz - so on balance who did better? (prob her cos i've got more weight to shift but least it was 9 months of eating fab food! )

just mention you want a VBAC and take it from there - i'm sure your under a consultant so see what they recommend.

CPD - can be checked in pregnancy in a non invasive way....to do with the woman lying down in a certain way and then midwife / obs checking if the head physically can drop into the pelvic cavity.....

and a growth scan can give a good indication of size ....as can an experienced midwife palpating the abdomen! In my experience anyway....

To actually tell the only way is an xray and growth scans are innaccurate and have been documented as such as well. Palpating also has same problems, there really is no way of telling even if the midwife is experienced, again this is documented. I was told the day before I had ds that he would be about 6 pounds, he came out 7 pounds 12 and a half. It's just one of those things that can't be predicted because the baby could feel large but not weigh much etc, there's lots of info on the net about it.

Jodie..that's why i said..in my experience......!

Isn't the size of the head (and possibly shoulders) more of an issue. Both mine have big heads. DS was in 7-10 hats at age 3. I bought 2yo DD a witch costume and the hat wouldn't go near her head, but the skirt fell straight down - it was age 3-4.

I do think that DS having such a big head and clearing the way and me being at home and stood up leaning on the bed really helped DD to be such an easy birth - I literally pushed twice. First push broke the waters, second push and she was born. It was not the story with DS, but you have given birth vaginally already which must be a help. How heavy was your DD?

That Gentle Birth Method book (by Dr Mothi? something like that), claims that western women have babies that are too big because they eat too much sugar and wheat. She advocates giving these up at certain points to a) make a smaller baby and b) decongest your pelvic passages. Something like that.
Frankly it sounds a bit suspect to me and the book is designed for rich women with nothing to do but make bean sprout salads, swim in ozone treated pools and have endless treatments.
Anyway, maybe you'll want to check it out
Pol
ps I'm aiming for a vbac in the next few weeks and from what I can gather having had a vaginal delivery before is the best indicator of success. On the other hand, having got to 10cm dilation and a failed instrumental on your one and only previous birth is pretty much the worst (yup, that's me).

good luck with your VBAC pol

having my first labour stall at 2 -3 cms, arriving at hospital for 2nd birth..to be told i just don't dilate (!) ..i had a VBAC! self belief and knowing your body can do it was for me, the thing that got me through!

Ladies,
I love you all. Your stories cheered me up today and made me laugh and happy, which is great. And a big change from the tear yesterday after seeing the UCH midwife who told me that since I was a high risk case, I would need to be monitored almost constantly (probably lying down). That really depressed me.

bty my dd was 3Kg, so almost 1 kg less than my ds.
thanks again for all the lovely advice.

lulumama

you seem to have a lot of knowledge about vbac. did you have vbac in a hospital, which one was it, and what was thier policy on monitoring.

I'm terrified of being strapped down with a monitor, which is what they did to me both times at UCH. I hate it, I want to move around.

what saddened me more, was the midwife said yesterday, that given i had a c/s i would have to be monitored pretty constantly for next time.

is it just uch with that policy?

i did...it was in merseyside thought.....they did advise constant monitoring and a time limit on labour

i stayed at home,active and moving,until the contractions were coming every 3 minutes...i did have the monitoring, but was allowed ,in fact encouraged, to stand up and move as much as i could....when i had pethidine , i had to get on the bed as too dizzy...but was fairly upright.....

You can refuse to be monitored constantly....and agree to have periods of intermittent monitoring or having the midwife lsiten with a sonicaid...

if you are well informed and can give a coherent reason for refusing constant monitoring,,,they cannot force you...different hopsitals have different policies....

and have you considered a home birth? a home VBAC is a good option if you want to stay active without restraint

water birth is also good..and would possibly be difficult to get in hospital..the water supports the belly..and takes the weight off the uterus ,,which is a good thing !

the best way to get a good birth is to be able to go with what your body is telling you....and if you know you don;t want to be confined to bed with a monitor on you,,.then you need to communicate that to the hospital

and you can change hopsitals

and have you thought about having a birth doula to support you.....

nurturing birth train & place doulas with no agency fees

hopsitals nationwide and their statistics re mode of delivery

lots of really excellent info out there.....>!

lulumama

thanks for the links and info that you sent me. I'm so glad I acidently found you on the internet. It makes me feel empowered to have this information.

Thanks so much for your help.
I would love to have a home VBAC, but my dh is too scared about it all. That is part of my problem, I guess I just feel a bit alone in all of this. I think your idea of a doula is a great one, I read about it in a US book, but did not think you can get one here.

thanks again for all your time.
jumana

try this too Doula UK

8 and half pounds isn't big at all. My first was
9 lb 13oz and none of midwives particuarly bothered about size of this one (currently 29 weeks pg).

Juman, it's official UCH policy to monitor you constantly, but in practice I think it's more flexible. I know I was really worried about the monitoring as I'm sure it's what messed it all up first time.
However, I've spoken to three midwives at UCH now and all of them have said if the graph is good they'll do it intermittently (ie 20mins out of every 60). I had a very positive tour of the delivery suite (I rung up on a saturday and it was just us and one midwife and we only talked about the specifics of my vbac). The wires were much longer than I remembered, too, about two metres and the mw was very insistent that I would be encouraged to move around a lot. She also said that if I really insisted I could speak to Astrid, head mw at the birthing centre, and I'd probably be allowed to go in there. I decided that I'd rather not as I'd find the added element of uncertainty (would I end up having to move again?) worse than just starting off in the delivery suite. It really was a lot more pleasant than I remembered it as being.
I am having a doula as my dh would not be brilliant at arguing for intermittent monitoring, active positions etc and I don't blame him either - he's too involved.
Will let you know. I'm pretty philosophical about it either way.
Pol

I followed the Gentle Birth Method loosely with DS2 - Dr Gowri Motha claims that through diet and physical and mental excercise you give birth to the baby that is the right size for your body. I have to say that it did work for me. DS2 was 7lb and very healthy. Good luck!

jumana - glad to be of assistance!

IMO - feeling empowered, having knowledge,.counteracts fear..fear can be an obstacle to a positive birth

a doula can really help you hold onto that feeing of empowerment...

keep posting and let us know how you are getting on ...and i wish you an enjoyable pregnancy & a happy, positive birth experience..whatever it may be.......

Poll seems to have found that UCH will be flexible re the monitoring, so one less thing to worry about all the best to you too poll....happy birthing!

Thanks for your encouragement Lulumama! You really are an advocate for vbacs aren't you? I'll be able to add my own experience by the end of nov...