Angry...advice please

[Daisypops]

Hi everyone.
I've had a shocking day at work so far,I won't bore you with every detail (honest!) but my salary is an issue & getting reviewed which has caused some hassles. I am refusing to do any additional work until I get more money so things got a bit heated this morning. It was that bad I nearly walked out. My boss (whos a muppet) said in a meeting about my salary 'all these young 'uns they do owt to get out of work, go travelling or get themselves pregnant' I said I'm sure your not allowed to say things like that and my boss's boss agreed. Then no one said anything else. I find what he said truly offensive. He knows nothing about my circumstances. I am also getting asked what I intend to do after bub is born, I have told them I will be coming back part time and they're making a real issue out of it and asking me all the time. Yesterday my line manager said 'oh your mum might be able to look after bub 5 days a week in which case you can come back full time'. I am not obliged to tell them what I intend to do until 28 days before my return date. I am so mad. And now I'm worrying my stress levels will affect my bubba. Please help.

Stay calm. It sounds like you are well-appraised of your rights. If they keep on badgering you why not find an opportune (calm) moment to point them out to your boss - or boss's boss as sounds more sensible.

Your boss's comments were totally inappropriate and insensitive, but, hopefully, probably only intended as a joke. Don't let them wind you up.

Before I read Mazzystar's post, I was hopping mad! I agree, you sound very well informed. BUT your boss cannot say these things, even in jest ("I was only joking" is not a defence in a tribunal!) - is he the same line manager who asked about whether your Mum could look after the baby 5 days a week? If so, sounds like the main problem could be him.

I would bear in mind that putting in a grievance would force your employers to address it appropriately, but your boss' boss does sound sensible. Could you approach him/her informally?

Perhaps you need a meeting (facilitated by someone you feel supported by - perhaps boss' boss?) to tell your boss that you feel insulted by his comments.

I did that last year (refused to work above and beyond until my worth was recognised) and then this year had to challenge maternity policy. I was told that I would be allowed to take some holiday if I wanted to boost my maternity; I got all assertive and wrote a very nice, but firm, letter, telling them I was insulted by this as it was my statutory right. I explained in the first sentance that I was writing a letter because I found it a very emotive subject and that I wasn't prepared to put myself through stress. The result was very positive and they had to go away and find out about maternity rights/rules so they didn't make any more faux pas.

Best of luck!!

pregnant women in work continues to be an issue even in this day and age and its so annoying and totally unexceptable!

Squisy-it was my line manager who mentioned me possibly returning full time and it was the next manager up that made the comment about getting pregnant to get out of work and it was his manager who was the sensible one who agreed with me (although he is a bit useless). I'm still peed off with it. My line manager even suggested demoting me, but keeping me on the same salary? Is this allowed? Human Resources have told me and my line manager that I have to come back to the position I am in now as thats their policy. I can't be arsed with the stress, theres been a few comments that have been unreasonable, I'm wondering whether to have some time off and speak to HR as the salary issue and peoples attitudes are really starting to get me down, it sounds dramatic but I feel a bit bullied because I'm pregnant, I didn't think this sort of thing happened nowadays. xx

I think you are absolutely being bullied because you're pregnant (they probably don't realise that legally that is what they're doing). It has to stop. And no way can they demote you because you're pregnant (constructive dismissal; go straight to tribunal and sue for sexual discrimination).

If you feel someone in HR is human and will listen, I would go to them. Or to your boss' boss (the sensible one). I know it can be a pain, but if I were you, I'd put it in writing- it saves you the hassle of getting even more stressed (and means you can sum up everything you want before the meeting, don't know about you but pregnancy brain and stressfull situations make me forget some issues!) but also it serves 2 more purposes: 1. you may need it later and 2. it shows you're serious - if they know their employment law, they will recognise that your written communication constitutes a grievance that they must take seriously and sit down and try to resolve with you. In employment law, you don't have to mention the word grievance or even intend to put in a grievance for it to count as one.

Alternatively, as back up, ring ACAS - free advice and support. Are you in a Union?

Keep strong, they are in the wrong, you have the right to be treated with dignity and equality. Take care, keep us posted

Its awful to be bullied. My former employers were a little more subtle than yours but still managed to be hugely undermining in the months leading up to my taking maternity leave.

Were I you I would got to speak to HR, whose job it is to know the law - to protect the company by making sure it adheres to it. Put your understanding of the outcome in writing to them and your boss. I would think carefully however before getting involved in a formal grievance. From what you have written, it sounds to me like they are scandalously ignorant of your rights, and very tactless. Whilst you need to get it sorted, a grievance procedure could be unpleasant and stressful for everyone concerned, particularly for you. You presumably will need to work with your line manager, and their boss, in future. Save a grievance for if you really really need it.

My point about putting it in writing is that that will actually constitute a grievance without Daisypops actually having to mention it and instigate it. They should recognise her letter as their early opportunity to address it with her first, before she goes formal (if they're an HR department worth their salt!!)

Daisy, legally all your company have to do is keep your job open at the same level, pay and hours as it was when you started mat leave. They ar enot legally obliged to agree to part-time if you were previously full-time. However, they have to consider an application by you to reduce your hours and if they can't/wont offer you part-time then they have to show reasonable reasons why not.

I spoke to ACAS about this as I was in the same position and they were v helpful and explained everything really well. You can also go to their website (sorry, can't do links have tried but always cock it up) for more info.

FB x

Thanks everyoone, I really appreciate your comments and advice. Squishy-my memory is pretty bad too at the mo so writing it all down and passing it to HR is a good idea. I think I will have to mention something to someone because if it continues I can see me just walking out which isn't good. Flumpybumpy, HR have said I can come back to the position I'm in now and thats it. Its my line manager thats complicating it saying part timers can't manage staff (one member of staff BTW!) and thats why she is saying there is the choice of demotion. Its difficult because I love my job and its only the usual office politics that gets my back up but on Friday I was nearly in tears.I'm not really one for causing a fuss but this has really got to me. I think I will inform HR and see what happens. Thanks again everyone. I'll keep you posted, in the meantime keep your advice coming!!!

Hi everyone, just to update you I have spoken to my line manager regarding the comments of my boss and apparently it is going to be discussed with him. The issue with regards to my salary is ongoing and I have been told to e-mail HR direct as my managers can't take it any further. So the saga continues. I'm hopeful that the fact I am nearly 6 months pregnant might spurr them on to sort the issue promptly. Who knows?! I'm so worried about the stress I am causing my bub. Can anyone else offer me some words of wisdom for calming down and forgetting the sh*t at work? xx

This is terrible and sorry I can't offer any real advice.

I went through something similar to this last year just as I went on maternity leave and got the union and a lawyer involved over something that was said. I have just gone back to work and have got the same job title, same pay and same overall hours but less responsibility. I lecture and the status with the job it teaching post grads which I was doing almost exclusively before I left and now I am teaching level 1's. I brought this up and was told " things move on and you were just not here to keep up with it".
My debate is whether to accept it and take the easy route since it actually means less taxing work or to fight it and maybe make myself unpopular in the process.

Good luck with whatever happens but as I learnt when I was pregnant make sure you stand up for yourself and think about your options when you are on maternity leave

I forgot to add that I got a wirtten appology from my big boss over the issues before I went off.
Keep a watch on that blood pressure though and make sure any movement up or down is recorded

Sorry to hear of your probs slalomsuki; I don't know what I'd do in your situation.

Daisy, glad that something will be done about the comments. When you email HR about your salary, I'd put in there details such as: when you first asked; the responses you've had so far; how long you've been waiting (any hold ups etc) and the fact that the prolonged process and lack of feedback is causing you stress which you would like to minimise, given your pregnancy. I'd even go as far as to give them a timescale to stick to to get back to you, or at least to meet with you to tell you how long it would take.

I went through something like this last year and nearly left, but in the end blew the whistle on a director who got sacked as a result.

Stress took away nearly 2 years in total, though.

This year, I started the year with 2 resolutions:

1. don't talk about work at home (keep home relaxed and for you)
2. it's only a job and not worth costing your health (I know how long it takes to find new ones etc, but once you've made a decision, it can help your inner strength.

I also use lavender, relaxation etc and saw a person-centred counsellor to speak to about my issues, but to keep it out of the house.

HTH, but good luck and stick with it!!

Sorry to hear of your probs slalomsuki; I don't know what I'd do in your situation.

Daisy, glad that something will be done about the comments. When you email HR about your salary, I'd put in there details such as: when you first asked; the responses you've had so far; how long you've been waiting (any hold ups etc) and the fact that the prolonged process and lack of feedback is causing you stress which you would like to minimise, given your pregnancy. I'd even go as far as to give them a timescale to stick to to get back to you, or at least to meet with you to tell you how long it would take.

I went through something like this last year and nearly left, but in the end blew the whistle on a director who got sacked as a result.

Stress took away nearly 2 years in total, though.

This year, I started the year with 2 resolutions:

1. don't talk about work at home (keep home relaxed and for you)
2. it's only a job and not worth costing your health (I know how long it takes to find new ones etc, but once you've made a decision, it can help your inner strength.

I also use lavender, relaxation etc and saw a person-centred counsellor to speak to about my issues, but to keep it out of the house.

HTH, but good luck and stick with it!!

Sorry to hear of your probs slalomsuki; I don't know what I'd do in your situation.

Daisy, glad that something will be done about the comments. When you email HR about your salary, I'd put in there details such as: when you first asked; the responses you've had so far; how long you've been waiting (any hold ups etc) and the fact that the prolonged process and lack of feedback is causing you stress which you would like to minimise, given your pregnancy. I'd even go as far as to give them a timescale to stick to to get back to you, or at least to meet with you to tell you how long it would take.

I went through something like this last year and nearly left, but in the end blew the whistle on a director who got sacked as a result.

Stress took away nearly 2 years in total, though.

This year, I started the year with 2 resolutions:

1. don't talk about work at home (keep home relaxed and for you)
2. it's only a job and not worth costing your health (I know how long it takes to find new ones etc, but once you've made a decision, it can help your inner strength.

I also use lavender, relaxation etc and saw a person-centred counsellor to speak to about my issues, but to keep it out of the house.

HTH, but good luck and stick with it!!

EEEK, really didn't mean to post that 3 times, sorry everyone!

Hasn't the situation on the right to come back part time versus full time changed relatively recently (last couple of years?) I believe there is much more onus on the employer to demonstrate why they can't agree to a change - business case - and that it couldn't be as vague as a part timer not being able to manage staff. I work in a local government setting where if anything lots of managers including ones with supervisory and line management responsibilities get to work in more flexi arrangements than many other staff, not just women with babies either!

Hope things improve for you before you go off on leave.

Luci