elective c section yes or no??

[katrinaxx]

im absolutely terrified of giving birth because im a weakling and I dont have a very high pain barrier some people think I should have an elective c section but im not sur just wondering what the recovery is like afterwards and if you think I should of shouldn't???.

Hiya ladies. Butting in a lil :)!

Im 23weeks and also want an ECS. I.have psychological problems due to a traumatic event which occured.when i was younger, which leads to very uncomfortable, painful sex. Got to the point where i used to have to have a drink when i wanted to have sex with D. Also smears and internal exams make me SCREAM!! Im terrified of giving birth naturally and have only mentioned it to MW once and she dismissed me. So now i.dont know what to do/who to speak to. She just said "oh dont worry your vaginismus will go away after giving birth" which i thought was very rude of her. I dont want my first childbirth experience to be spent in absolute agony and panic.. Gonna keep an eye out on here to see how you all managed to get the NHS.to let u have an ECS.

Sorry to hear about the sad stories too! :(

Buninmyoven I would bring it up again and ask to be referred to an obstetrician to discuas it further. I would also suggest getting your partner in with you for support as I know that was what helped me to keep me strong. read up as much info and go in their with a determined mind and full of facts its the best way

x

Cake I totally appreciate you can't ask for one and I am prepared for them to say no hense we already made arrangements to go private if they refuse. I just can't have a vaginal birth... The research advice is really helpful.. Cheers

Thanks Jess :) il see what i can do. When.i told the.MW she didnt even.write anything down -- she may as well have just said 'get over it' !!

Il bring it up again next time. Maybe write a letter to.the hospital? DP is very supportive bless him.. People ive mentioned it to before have basically looked at an answered me as if to say 'dont be a mard arse'.. We're all in the same boat!! :) wish everybody the best of luck x

I think im just going to bight the bullet and do it naturally although im absolutely terrified but my dp is really against the idea of a ecs all these stories have put me in more of a panic tbh but I will just have to deal with thanks for the replies xx

BunInMyOven: I had very similar circumstances to you and was offered ELCS without much fuss. Just asked to see consultant and he agreed that past traumatic events were a valid reason.

Thankyou rowtheboat i'll get onto a consultant asap! :) .. Im a bit of a pushover tbh and if someone tells me 'no' i wont argue. Suppose il have to step up!

It must just be easier/harder in different areas!x

I am having an ELCS - due to my medical condition (diabetes) I am not allowed to give birth naturally, and this is my second child. I was induced for my first child and reacted really strongly to the syntocinon which made me contract very strongly and the baby got into distress. I thought he might die. He probably wouldn't have, but at the time I was dosed up to the eyeballs with diamorphine, panicking and paranoid. This time round I have chosen an ELCS as for me the baby's safety is paramount, they can do what they like to me but if there's any chance of the baby getting into distress again I am not willing to go the vaginal route.
I do think women should be entitled to have an ELCS if they have a good reason, psychological reasons should count as well as physical. Obviously the nhs needs to make sure it is an informed choice the person is making, but sounds like in this case the OP is, good luck with getting it.

There is certainly a place for elective sections, both for medical and psychological reasons but am rather concerned that nobody here has mentioned that it is riskier for baby. Being squeezed through the birth canal prepares the lungs for breathing hence why section babies have far more breathing difficulties. Obviously most babies are fine but it would have to be something major for me to make the conscious decision to increase the risk. All birth is risky but vaginal is generally far safer for mum and baby.

Buchanon08, I don't think that is right. Elcs is the safest for baby. Many birth injuries to the baby (cerebral palsy, forceps, ventouse) are a result of a (botched) vaginal birth.

The breathing difficulties arising from an elcs are negligible compared to the greater risks I have just listed from a vaginal birth. In a way, in an elcs, the mother takes the risk onto herself.

I really recommend the book below. Extremely informative, was actually recommended to me bya mums netter. It explains all the risks of both, how statistically aft a certain age you are unlikely to have a natural birth without forceps etc. based on this I would have chosen an ELCS. As it is I need one medically. This book really helped me with this.

www.amazon.co.uk/Choosing-Cesarean-Natural-Birth-Plan/dp/1616145110

Buchanan08 - yes, all other things being equal, a vaginal birth is best for the health of the baby.
For me, having had two emcs, that isn't the case.
If we're discussing long term health, surely it's also important to consider the psychological effects of birth trauma on both parent and child?

Absolutely for a few people elcs is a necessity. I'm not underestimating the effects of birth trauma but for all those people who are scared of giving birth, the chances of something going wrong (cerebal palsy, botched forceps etc as mentioned above) is very small and certainly smaller than if you chose elcs.
Also, for all those saying it's a personal choice, while I appreciate what they mean, elcs cost the taxpayer ALOT of money (think consultant and anaesthetist wages plus a couple of registrars, midwives, paeds, theatre technicians, lots of extra drugs, cost of running theatre plus extra bed days) it's a good job most people don't agree that it's safest because we couldn't all afford to have one!

all the stats about CS babies having weaker respoiratory systems don't really take into account the different types of CS. they aren't comparing ELCS with vaginal - it's ALL CS, which by their nature includes some very vulnerable babies who have been through a hell of a ride beforehand & who need to be whipped out in an emergency. DOn't worry so much about that. I had an emergency CS then an ELCS. the elective was a walk in the park - calm, quiet and easy, whereas I had nightmares for months after the lead up to the emergency one. Recovery from elective is very much easier than recovery from emergency, you can get back on your feet iwthin hours - and the sooner the better so you don't get stiff. good luck

buchanon the cost of CS is actually not more when you compare the amount of people who have a vaginal birth and need medical assistance afterwards eg mental, physical help. this is all detailed in the book that i posted - i was actually really surprised.

Yes; was going to say that surely my augmented labour + emcs and failed vbac + emcs would have added up to more than the cost of 2 elcs?

But those cases are the minority by a very long way! We can't know who the unlucky few that will have tricky/dangerous/costly vaginal births will be. Comparing those horror stories to a straightforward elcs is not helpful and I'm worried by the trend of going elcs just in case.

have to pipe up here as im one of those having an elcs

we are all grown ups and I think everyone has the right to choose how they give birth. I find it hard to believe that any woman would go into an elcs without reading up on it first or at least discussing it with their doctor /midwife/ family etc. everyone medically I have spoken to has told me all the risks so I am not going into this with my eyes closed. its a personal choice that is right for me for various reasons and I do not have to justify it or explain it to anyone.

second of all I have paid into the tax system since the first day I worked on my 16th birthday and I am not one to go to the doctors for every sniffle. I do believe as a full time worker that when the time was right for me to have a child that my tax money would at least allow me to have an informed conversation with health professionals about what I do and dont want for the birth of my child at the very least. I understand that they cant give it to everyone and thats understandable but the option should be their and shouldn't be frowned upon and the option to discuss it should be open to everyone.

I dont want to get into a discussion about tax etc etc but lets face it over recent years tax payers money has been wasted on alot of things that are nowhere near as important......

They are NOT a minority, Buchanon. You are letting your own anti-cs agenda cloud your judgment.

Leaving aside the hard evidence, anecdotally, how many threads are there on mn of botched vaginal births with injury to baby and mother? How many threads are there on breathing difficulties in elcs babies?

weebarra is absolutely right about the cost of fixing a vaginal birth (which includes emcs and post-birth surgery) having to be added to the stats and cost of a vaginal birth. Easterholiday, I agree that cs babies are more likely to be compromised babies than babies born vaginally, which skews the stats for breathing difficulties in cs babies.

Ultimately, it is for OP to make up her mind about the risks of cs and vb, taking into account her own mental state.

I am not advocating either cs or vg, but what gets my goat is when the risks and costs of elcs are overstated and the risks and costs of vb are swept under the carpet because somehow women as supposed to take the risk of birth trauma, incontinence, prolapse and other far nastier things onto themselves with consequences to the baby, because it is what women have had to do for millienia. It is not a surprise that many women obstetricians opt for elcs when it comes to themselves.

I suspect that botched/augmented vaginal births actually are in the minority compared to normal, standard vaginal births.

Thank you, Toby. Let me clarify. They are NOT "But those cases are the minority by a very long way" as Buchanon describes

Is there really a trend for opting for elcs "just in case"?
Or is it just that the revised NICE guidelines have very sensibly taken into account the myriad reasons why a woman may want to consider an elcs?
I have no evidence for saying this , but I thought the days of people accusing those electing for elcs of being "too posh to push" / going for the easy option were over.

My ds had respiratory distress when he was born by elcs, he was in nicu then scbu for 8 days. His consultant time said that it was common to see babies born by electives with breathing difficulties, because of the combined factor of them not having been pushed through the birth canal, and because labour hasn't started (as would usually be the case with emcs) the babies lungs haven't been 'prepared' for labour.

Personally of 3 births, the elective was by far the worst of the 3. I found recovery long and very difficult, and found the whole experience very traumatic. I realise this is a personal thing, and that any birth can be traumatic, but one of the things that i found hard, was that i had read so much about recovery from an elective being a 'walk in the park' compared to emergency c sections, that it just exacerbated how awful I felt. It can be as difficult to recover from an elective as any other birth - unfirtunately there are no guarantees.

When I was opting for my elcs, I asked the senior midwife, who was counselling me on the risks, what the risk of a first time vaginal birth resulting in forceps/ventouse delivery with 3rd/4th degree tear. She said they did not keep stats (am I surprised?), but from her experience, it was less than 5% of all women.

However, when I compare that to the experience amongst my friends, almost 50% had significant trauma for their first time babies. That does not even take into account the women who don't talk about their traumatic births. What do we make of the long running threads on mn of long suffering ladies with injury to their bits. Even if the midwife were right, would a rational person personally want to even countenance a 5% risk of that happening? If you are were asking a man, I suspect I know what the answer is. Is it only because women have had to suffer this through out the ages that somehow this risk is ok because the cost of wasting a cs on a woman who could theoretically do a vb is somehow undeserved.

Once again, neither option is without its risks and there are no guarantees whichever method OP chooses. But OP needs to make an informed decision about the risks of BOTH elcs and vb, rather than the risks of elcs v. the positives of vb, without the conditioned knee-jerk anti-cs baggage.