1st time on Mumsnet - just found out am pregnant, torn whether to abort..please help

[neeliek]

Hi,

I''ve never posted on Mumsnet before so a bit scared that I'll get very negative responses... but really hoping for some practical advice/kindness.

I am 33 (34 in Nov), have been in an on-off relship with someone for past 3+ yrs. We are extremely different (e.g. I'm Asian, he's black, I'm an investment banker with 3 degrees, he can just about read/write (is a self-made man with a small business, and I respect that he is street-smart and built himself up from nothing)). He also has a 9yr old son from a previous marriage. It's the first time I've ever been with someone outside my culture..let alone who already has a family.

The relationship has been very volatile ( not helped by fact that his ex-wife is possessive and has sent me death threats)...I've ended things with him a few times but somehow we end up being back together. I guess because a) at heart he is a kind and caring man, although uneducated and inarticulate, b) I'm lonely without him and c) he's very loyal eg has stuck by me through long-term mental illness etc.

I've fallen pregnant twice in this relationship (having being convinced I was infertile) and both times chose to abort as I didn't want to bring a child into the world without being married, and not having a settled environment, and I didn't feel he can support another family financially (he still owes me a large sum of money that went towards a failed business venture). Recently he's been talking about getting married - secretly I have always felt unsure.

I just found out last night that am pregnant again (5wks) despite precautions. I am so lost....!! Haven't been able to think straight since. my initial thought was, I have to get another abortion. But, the last 2 times were so painful (physically but most of all emotionally). And, also I'm getting to that danger point now where if I don't have a child, I might never be able to. I really dont want to miss out on motherhood. Part of me feels really excited about it. But also it would be the end of my career (I was going for MD promotion this year, by keeping the baby I am essentially throwing away my chances).

How do I decide what the right thing to do is? What are the key things I should consider? Do I just 'settle' even though I feel he isn't 'the one' (there could be worse men out there)? Am I being horribly snobbish about his lack of education/financial security? Should I just keep the baby this time (and have to buy a bigger place on my own - partner can't afford it)? Or do I bite the bullet, have an abortion and end things once and for all with him? Am I failing to appreciate a really good thing?? How do you know whether a relationship is right or not?

Sorry for the long story - just feeling very lost. If there's anyone there that's ever experienced something similar (2 abortions, still no child/family at 34, wondering whether to just settle for something that doesn't feel totally right rather than risk missing out on children/family altogether) or can offer thoughts/experience, I would love to hear from you.

Thanks so much.

I think you need help to sort through your feelings and your options, rather than judgements and you should be very careful about ignoring others and listening to your own wants & needs on this.

I suspect there are a few cultural issues as well as relationship issues at play here and your family's feelings alsoatter to you. Try to cut out this noise & (sorry other posters) a lot of the comments on here too.

Answer some questions of yourself honestly without worry of repercussions..

1. do you want children?

2. do you want a child now?

If the answer to the above is yes then the next questions are;

3. do you want to continue with this pregnancy?

4. If all goes well would you want to raise this child alone or with your present partner?

From your answers to the above will flow everything else. What that
Means financially, what support you need, how to get your family involved and so on.

At the moment it sounds like all of your emotional and practical concerns are muddled and as a result you're frightened that you will make the wrong decision. By examining the fundamental few questions you can decide if an abortion is right for you now (not want, surely never a question of want) or if seeing how the pregnancy progresses is right.

You sound confused, stressed, emotional and a bit frightened. If you can go and see a counsellor - not one that specialises in this area but a normal counsellor who can help you to find the answers you need without pressure. You shouldn't be concerned by what others think right now because what matters is what is right for you. Everything else will come anyway.

ok, immediate response to OP, haven't read the rest yet.

Relationship is one thing, child is another. You can have either without the other, both or neither.

You need to decide whether you want to stay with him. Imagine yourselves together in 10, 20, 30 years, could it work? If you want children, now or in the future, is he the person you'd choose to have them with?

You do need to consider that you have limited time to establish a new relationship and arrive at the 'let's have babies' point. It may be that you could break up, meet someone else next month and be coupled up and ttc within a year. People can settle down fast at any age when they know it's right and especially at your age when both want children.

Are you willing to compromise that possibility by having a child with this man now?

Consider though that you may not find someone 'better'. How much do you want children? Would you consider sperm donation and single motherhood? What do you expect to do when you reach the 'now or never' age you've set in your head? Are you with this man partly because he is a good dad and could be again with you?

Of course you could have this child alone, or with him then break up. You might then meet someone else and might go on to have other children but that's impossible to know and your priorities will have changed. Can you face the idea of bringing this child up alone?

Regarding your age, you have some time but not lots. At least you know you're fertile but you may find it harder to conceive later, at a point when there's less time left to address any problems. Leaving it five years then wanting a family of three would not be a reasonable expectation but could happen.

How long do you need to devote to your career to secure the desired position? When could you start ttc? Would you be able to stay in work, or could you step out and back at the same level? What bearing does that have on the sort of partner or childcare you want and need?

My own 'what do I do about children' age in my head was 35. I met DP at 33, wasn't sure straight away, knew we needed time to establish the relationship and see if it could work. I conceived easily at 37, had dd at 38 and hope to have another. If we'd had problems conceiving we'd have been in trouble, too old for IVF on the NHS I think. I'd accepted it might happen, it might not.

wow I am amazed at being so different because you are asian and he is black. I just wonder if a white person said that with a black person what the reaction would be on here?

Agree with others - the baby is between you and the baby.

Whatever others say - its ultimatly in your body and you would usually be the main career for the baby.

Nobody at all can judge you or help you say yay or nay from your family.

Your old enough and ugly enough and by the sounds of it - rich enough to have a baby or at least make up your own mind.

I would say make descion on the fact this man may not be in your life any longer and go from there.

plenty of people start from happy marriages - and then they break up.....

You say family is important to you - but this baby is your family also.

nothing is normal in this life - you dont know what other secrets people have hidden, i just dont think thats a valid argument for not giving life...

herbsandhags.blogspot.co.uk/2012/08/the-joy-of-single-motherhood-and-why.html?m=1

the above ^ will give you a positive view of life as a single mother; balanced against the endless tales of woe you'll get elsewhere

You'll find other men if you decide to split with this one

Thanks all for your comments. I went to the abortion clinic yesterday with partner and I just couldn't go through with the procedure. Didn't help seeing partner in tears. I've booked to speak to a counsellor on the phone on Monday. Am 6 weeks gone.

I told mum about pregnancy and as I'd feared, she's extremely disappointed with me and furious with my partner (given this is 3rd time). Said he's irresponsible, the family hasn't accepted him, how am I going to support the baby, what if I lose my job... etc.Without actually saying it outright, it was pretty clear what she thought I should do. What's sad for me is that my younger sister recently had a baby (my parents' 1st grandchild), and my mum (who is ex-midwife) has moved in to to help her, posts at least 100 photos of baby every week on FB etc. In contrast, she said if I decide to keep the baby then I will have to cope with it on my own. She wants nothing to do with it (claimed health would prevent her from flying in).

It's clear that partner is a source of embarassment to my family (because of his skin colour, exacerbated by his background). I can't blame them for it because 1) he behaved obnoxiously when I took him to meet them in Asia 2 years ago and 2) racism against dark-skinned people is 'normal' where I come from. E.g. I recently took partner to a Chinese massage centre in London and the workers asked me directly (in Mandarin so he wouldn't understand) 'You're so pretty, why are you with a black? What a shame! Is he violent? etc') I laughed it off and said he takes very good care of me. But inside I was really sad - is this the kind of prejudice my baby would have to face?

Have had long discussions with partner about situation...each time increasingly frustrating. He has grand plans on how to improve his career (he wants to go back to college to learn an additional trade), but it all sounds very vague. He's lousy at maths whereas I have an ACA background, and when I press him for numbers they don't add up. It won't be an equal relationship at all from a financial standpoint. Although he says otherwise, I don't see him having an improvement in income for at least 3-4 years. In meantime, I would be contributing 80+% of the household income and on top of that he has no savings so I would be expected to contribute 100% of downpayment towards a new property. And because he knows nothing about finance, education etc, he expects me to be the one looking for a new place to live, looking for a mortgage, finding out about childcare/schools etc. I have to be at my desk at work every day by 6am and most days stay till 8pm or later (City job). Also frequent travel involved. Just feel this is all a bit much...it doesn't feel like an equal partnership..I have quite traditional views on men being able to provide for their family etc...is this unreasonable?)

On the other hand if I decide that because of the financial situation it's not worth me keeping the baby now...and I split up with him as well ...I'm worried I may never find someone as 'good' as him. For all his faults (e.g. temper, disorganized, not that ambitious, terrible at planning, lack of financial stability) what I treasure/appreciate most about my partner is that he is the sort of man that is not afraid to get his hands dirty (he can fix anything around the house, very practical - I am opposite), is willing to dig in when things are tough, is very loyal and hard-working, affectionate, loves his son/me very much, street smart and accepts me unconditionally despite my faults. Admittedly also a strong physical attraction (he's very tall/athletic). And on the positive side, being an own-business owner he has the luxury of managing his own working hours, and he has previous childcare experience, so he could do more than the fair share of nappy-changing, fetching to/from nursery etc!

The agony of indecision. I guess there is no right answer and I will just have to pick the lesser of two evils. Thanks again for all comments here.

PS: At the moment I couldn't imagine myself dating/meeting/going out with other men. I feel it would be a big betrayal of my partner. Family thinks I've been brainwashed by him. I don't agree - although I did meet him at a very vulnerable time. As someone rightly commented above I do suffer from low self-esteem and it feels 'safer' sticking with him despite his faults/some incompatibilities between us, rather than venturing out and risk getting hurt. As partner likes to say, 'better the devil you know'.
By the way partner's son is visiting and he has told son that I am expecting! Son has already thought of names if its a girl or boy. very awkward no?

Nee - reading the above it sounds like the confusion you have about your partner is more about your families concerns, your communities attitudes and what you were raised to expect.

Ok his education could be better and he's not faultless but he's a man you care about, who cares for you, that you are attracted to and who has managed to make something of his life despite fact that a number of factors seem to have been against him.

You went to the abortion clinic and it felt wrong to you. Obviously he is excited about being a father with you, but importantly it felt wrong to you.

You were raised to expect a man to provide for his wife, well there are many ways of providing - money is just one. Perhaps he does provide for you but financially you will always be the principal earner. If he's offering emotional, home management and other support does the earning differential matter as much? In a "traditional" relationship money might be there but time & emotional support not. So what matters more to you? And indeed is he supplying these things?

If you have this child they'll be mixed race. In your community that will be hard for them. But do you care about that? Or is a healthy, happy child what matters to you?

Your mother and your family sound unsupportive and cause of much insecurity for you. That's understandable. But if they really love you they want your happiness to be paramount. So is what they're demanding of you what will make you happy? Or is it just making you sad and confused?

Chat with counsellor sounds like a positive step and your partner sounds excited but perhaps a little insensitive to your inner turmoil. But then how much have you discussed how you feel with him?

Look after yourself and I hope you get a hold on what feels right to you soon. You're caught in an awful emotional whirlpool here. Being confused and unsure is understandable and don't listen to anyone who suggests otherwise no matter who they are.

Sounds like you're going to have the child, see how the relationship goes (with a lot of work to make the best of it but some things may just fall into place) and may or may not stay with him longer term. That's fine, you will have a lovely child but you're going to need to do some serious thinking about how you relate to your wider family and organise your own new family.

I understand your concern about income but you can afford to give a child a good life, presumably even if you take some time out, continue at a more junior level than you'd have liked etc. Many Parents have big income disparities. I can see that you may have expected to settle down with a fellow high earner and compared to that lifestyle you won't be well off but compared to a lot of people you will be. As you say, your DP has aptitudes that others do not.

He should not be telling people about the pg, that's really silly (or a way of trying to ensure you can't abort?). Either way a bad move as for reasons you'll be aware of you really shouldn't spread the word before 12 weeks to anyone except those closest and most understanding and supportive, whatever happens.

P.s. good luck!

p.p.s please talk to someone about your self-esteem issues. You really need to work on this now, while you have time, before you get subsumed into the ongoing activity of family life. Before patterns are set about how that family will work, too. You need to be as strong,confident and assertive as possible, for your child as well as yourself.

This is horrid. I've lost 2 kids this year at 23&8 weeks, my baby boy was perfect and should be a week old now! The last thing half these woman want to hear is someone wanting to abort a baby! I believe everything happens for a reason if your pregnant its ment to be (I'm not religious). You don't have long left, culuture doesn't matter and if you tjink that maybe you should leave the relationship.

Riley I am so sorry for your loss, but in this country thankfully women have a right to choose, and only they can decide what it right for them. It is tragic when someone loses a child, but it does not mean that other people should be made to feel guilty about their choices.

I echo panics sentiments there Riley.

riley i'm very, very sorry to hear of your losses, but with all due respect you chose to click on the thread despite the title.

it's right that women should be able to choose whether or not to continue an unwanted pregnancy.

Neeliek reading through your posts I think the one thing missing is about whether you actually want to be a mother or not? Forget the rubbish situation you're in (uncertainty over relationship, unsupportive family, financial worries) - do you want to be a mother to the baby you are currently carrying? I get the impression from the fact you couldn't go ahead with the abortion that the answer is yes. That's the only thing you should really be thinking about. Everything else will fall into place. Will the relationship last forever? Maybe not but then many marriages don't even when people think they've met "The One" and they'll live happily ever after. Will your family accept the mixed race baby? Maybe not but then it's still half you, half your culture and fully their niece/nephew/grandson/daughter, isn't that enough? Will you struggle financially? Maybe but then so do most people with a new baby - crikey they're expensive! Yes it's a shame you might not make MD this year but having a baby doesn't mean your career is over, you'll still have your fabulous qualifications when the little one is old enough for you to go back to work. Will Mr Wrong but Right in Many Ways be a good dad? Of all things it sounds as though this is something he's already good at so even if the relationship doesn't work out (and many don't due to the stress of having a new baby so don't worry about crystal ball gazing too far) then you'll still be supported by him as a father to the little one.

Ask yourself, do I want to be a mother to this baby? Yes - try and put all of the other worries to oneside and start concentrating on growing a healthy baby. No - well, you know what you need to do. Take care and hope you choose whatever you feel is best for you and your baby, not your partner, not your family, YOU and YOUR baby.

I am right behind CalamityJ asking "do you want your baby?"

The rest of the stuff will sort itself out one way or another.

I agree, but what im trying to say is she shouldnt be with the man if she thinks like that about everything let alone have a child. I know its her choice and if she does it she obviously think its the right decision for her. I just don't like hearing about abortion which is understandable. I reacted badly I'm sorry.

You seem very proud of your academic and career achievements. I think you'll make a great provider for your family. I don't know about the 'abortion situation', but it's really important that you make this decision for you and not just to make other people happy otherwise you'll end up looking back and wondering.

Sorry (I'm a bit useless with relationshippy type stuff), but you should probably have a chat to your GP or the clinic about different types of contraception if your previous method didn't work for you. Good luck. You'll get lots of mumsnet support whatever your decision!

I can't comment on the baby side, but have been in a similar situation relationship wise. I would call myself an intellectual snob, similar background to yours, ACA, Oxbridge. Found myself about to tie myself to a very non academic man....as it was I was depressed and he exacerbated it by not treating me very nicely (only verbally). I didn't realise it was wrong until family members expressed their concern and I realised how unhappy I was and actually I'd rather be on my own for the rest of my life than settle for second best. I called it all off, although it meant losing my house, car and being in a place I knew no one, having moved there for him.

It was the best decision ever. A year later I met a man far more suited to me. No doubts whatsoever. I never knew it could be like this, I thought that settling for second best was just how life is.

I would do the same again, even if I knew I would never meet anyone else. I'd rather be alone and adopt if I wanted a child, than with a man I wasn't sure about.

And finally, I personally don't believe someone can truly love another if they have a list of big things that are issues about them. If you really really loved him, I think you wouldn't care what your family thought, you wouldn't care about his intellect etc. it just wouldn't matter.

Just my thoughts!!