Is my cupboard bare? A boobs query.

[ifherbumwereabungalow]

Hi, am 36+3 with DS2 and am pretty convinced that, yet again, my breasts are not going to be producing any milk at all. With first child, I had a very painful left breast throughout the pregnancy, then a traumatic c-section. Following that, I tried very, very hard to breast feed, but my boobs were completely empty of anything, there wasn't even any Pre-milk in there. I got groped by a vast amount of people in the hospital, but they couldn't get anything out either. I felt like a huge failure when I had to rely on formula milk. During the post match analysis, most of the people I spoke to seemed to think that the trauma of the birth probably led to my inability to feed properly.
This time around, I have had horrible pains in my right nipple, and my breasts do hurt, but they haven't swollen, or feel any bigger than Pre-pregnancy.
So, my question is, can you tell before the birth if there is any milk being produced, or should I just go with my instinct and continue to assume that my udders are purely decorative? I have bought bottles and a steriliser, and plan to take cartons of formula into hospital with me, but is there anything I could actively be doing to promote the production of breast milk? The medical staff I have asked haven't really been able to help...

If you post this on the breast feeding forum in the Feed the world section you'll probably get some good advice.

Aha! Couldnt find the breast feeding one, hence posting here, thanks!

No, you can't tell in pregnancy.

I am now breastfeeding my 3rd child but have never been able to express so much as a drop in pregnancy.

I could never squeeze any colostrum out either. I just assumed it was there and let the baby suck for the first few days until my milk came in.

If you are happier formula feeding then that's what you should do. Don't set yourself up to fail by 'trying' to breastfeed when you don't really believe you can before you start.

On the other hand, if you really do want to breastfeed then there is masses of fantastic advice and hand holding on the BF boards and the chances are you very probably can.

Thanks Silent, I have reposted so hope that the breast feeding posse will get back to me with some top tips.

Don't know if this will help but I read that raspberry leaf tea will help with milk production. If you google herbal teas for breastfeeding I'm sure something will come up. Other than that, just drink loads and try not to stress. Hope something works for you and if not then there is nothing wrong with the formula route - don't hurt yourself flogging a dead horse!

First if all congratulations
If its any help my boobs didn't change at all during pregnancy and (after an admittedly difficult start) I bf DS until 19 months. My milk didn't come in until day 5 (also after CS), I put DS to the breast a lot and we finally got there.
However it could be the case that you just don't make any milk, it's not very common but my mum who bf 2 children successfully found this on her 3rd child. By the time number 4 came along she was determined to bf again and after lots of help and support from everyone with anything to do with breastfeeding they came to the conclusion she just wasn't producing any milk. It turns out she had developed a rare disorder where she doesn't produce prolactin or several other hormones and was actually very poorly. She is on treatment now and all is fine, but I just wanted to say that if you find you really are not producing any milk when baby arrives then I would strongly advise you get it investigated. Hugely unlikely you will have the same thing as my mum but worth checking out.

I didn't have any leakage before birth and due to EMCS my milk took four days to come in, but I did have premilk.

So you may well have milk this time round :-)

I was exactly the same. No milk at all while pregnant, not even a tiny drop. I did not see any colostrum either. I didnt realise for the first two pregnancies that some people did

I breastfed three babies and had plenty of milk for all of them. My youngest never had formula at all. Although breastfeeding was fine, I could never get much milk by expressing, so gave up on this alltogether after the first baby.

I also had 3 c sections

Thank you for your help ladies, I really hope it will work out this time, but am taking bottles and milk just in case - I have gestational diabetes and this is going to be a big baby, so want to make sure the giant has something to eat before he turns on the other babies on the maternity ward!

Not quite the same, but despite leaking copiously during pg & feeding my DD happily, I could barely express anything, by hand or pump. The only time I got more than a dribble out was when my DD dropped a feed & I used an electric pump at 5am, or when I used a nipple shield to collect the leakage during feeding. Obviously, you realised that baby wasn't being fed & formula was required, but, as with tooearly the lack of milk when being 'milked' by strangers shouldn't necessarily be the only sign - your boobs only want to give up their milk to your DC. Good luck with feeding this time, but formula isn't a failure...

how long did you try to breastfeed for?have you seen if there is a le leche league in your area?they are really helpful and hugely knowledgeable about all things bf,much better than the hospital staff,i found.

I didn't have any milk while pregnant, and once DD was born I tried to express and not a drop came out.

I kept latching her on and trying to keep her awake (she was sleepy because of the pain relief I had in labour), and about 48 hours in she came off after a half hour feed, I looked down and my boob was about 3 times its normal size! So I put her on the other side to even them up :), didn't have any problems with supply after that.

I guess they need to suckle to start the process off and make your milk come in. Really pulled my tummy in too! Good luck.

Hugely common BF myth that the milk is in your boobs prior to birth. IT IS NOT. You will have some colostrum which is made in tiny, tiny amounts and is rich, filling & packed full of all sorts of amazing things. They call it liquid gold. When born your baby will have a stomach the size of a marble; they will not be needing pints of milk shortly after birth, in fact they will be full after barely a tablespoon. They feed a lot in the first few days to stimulate your milk supply and bring the milk in.

Your milk should come in around day 3/4, possibly a day later if birth was traumatic or you had a CS.

FWIW I never leaked a drop in pregnancy, never had any obvious signs of milk being there & BF'ed DS1 to 18 months & am still BF'ing DS2 at 10 months.

Good luck regardless of what you decide to do. In the long run it makes very little difference; as long as you are feeding your baby something suitable nobody should make you feel bad or guilty for the things that happen.

Just as what has been said above. Leaking in pregnancy is zero indication to milk supply post birth. I had an emsc and it took 4 days for milk to come in and when it does u just gotta let baby feed and feed and feed some more to increase that supply. If ur struggling apparently fenugreek helps increases supply and ur gp can prescribe donperidone (sp?) to help

If it were me in this situation, I'd be booking some time with a certified Lactation Consultation ASAP before baby is born, and scheduling time with one soon after birth too.

I don't know how strongly you feel about breast feeding, but I would want to fully explore this issue and find out what was going on before I made any decisions regarding feeding my baby.

I agree it's important not to torture yourself emotionally over this, but to me, not truly exploring why I had such trouble (plus the symptoms you describe) would be torture in itself.

It is extremely rare for a woman to not make milk - what's far more common is for women to not get adequate support (that ends up disrupting their milk production).

Excellent, some fantastic info here, the hospital did offer for the breast feeding consultant to get in touch so I think I might take them up on that. I will be at Frimley Park this time, and they are apparently very hot on breast feeding so think I should get some better support this time.

Please be aware that not all 'breastfeeding consultants', 'lactation consultants' or 'infant feeding advisors' are equal in the UK and your bets bet would be to find an International Board Certified Lactation Consultant (IBCLC) if you want the most qualified breastfeeding help you can get. Breastfeeding counsellors/leaders from organisations such as La Leche league, NCT, Association Of Breastfeeding Mothers and the Breastfeeding Network are usually pretty good too and also usually more experienced and knowledgable than your average midwife/HV and some hospital Infant Feeding advisors etc too. Obviously experience and areas of expertise will vary from one person to the next, regardless of qualifications.

I have to say, my friend had her baby at Frimley Park and the breastfeeding support was shite, but that was almost 2 years ago now, so things might have changed since then. I do note they are working towards Baby Friendly status. However, she was in the not uncommon situation where she had GD and formula was practically forced on her for the baby after birth.

Has anyone discussed GD and what will happen post birth with you? I had GD with my DD (who actually turned out to be only 6lb15 1/2 when born at 37+6, DS2 was 10lb born at 38 weeks, and I didn't have GD then!) and despite having had her at a Baby Friendly hospital, had I not done my own research, things could have been very different.

Thanks midori. So far, the diabetics team at Frimley have been very pro-active about the breast feeding support, and my consultant told me that if any hospital in the world can get me breast feeding, its them, so maybe they have had an overhaul of their system in the last couple of years. Hearing other people's stories has really boosted my confidence, and I am optimistic that the operation will be far less traumatic, and therefore I will be feeling less hideous and more able to keep trying, despite the GD.

Hey OP- just wanted to write with my support. I did have drops of milk when pg, and a bit of colostrum when dd was born in March, but it vanished after a couple of days- I wasn't able to squeeze anything at all out by day 4 & my breasts which had only increased by about a cup size, but felt much fuller than normal, had completely deflated! Couldn't see a mw until day 5 afternoon, and she had us rushed to hospital as dd was severely dehydrated, nearly 20% less than her birth weight & v low blood sugar etc. She was put on a drip & formula fed, and stayed in hospital for 5 days, so all quite traumatic. I'd had a fairly straightforward VB, though things were very complicated with DP- I wasn't sure he'd be able to make the birth- so things were stressful on that front, which could have been a factor.

Anyway- I managed to express literally about 5 drops of milk on day 5 & kept putting dd on the breast to encourage supply, and I did get a bit of milk through by the end of the first week, though I was never properly engorged. I saw a bf councillor & various drs/ mws/ nurses and people came up with a variety of reasons why the milk didn't come in 'til so late. These included stress as you've mentioned, but also:

Part of the placenta may have been left behind, so the milk-producing hormone didn't kick in. I don't think this was the case for me.

Or the latch could have been wrong at the beginning (it was OK later on, but this may have got us off on the wrong foot). DD was a bit snuffly when she was born, and blowing bubbles. I've since heard that if the baby is stuffy they can find it hard to latch on. (Since then we've used simple saline drops to clear her nose as and when necessary).

I think mostly the problem was that it was my first child, I didn't know what to expect & we started off wrong, but it took me a while to realise- when the milk didn't come in everyone I spoke to including bf-ing friends, family, various mws said "oh, it will be here in a day or two!" and I just believed it would. In hindsight, I wish I'd checked my technique at the hospital before I left- staff looked in on me bf-ing & assumed I was doing ok.

Anyway, I've always topped up with formula since then (she's now just over 3 months old) but have managed to bf in combination too. I don't know if any of that is especially useful or pertinent to you, but don't give up hope & make use of any advice & help open to you is my advice. Good luck! X

no milk at all in pregnancy with either baby. First baby, nothing til day 3 then BOOM there was milk. I fed her for 10 months. Similar with DS, nothing obvious for several days. I fed him til 17 months.

I'm hypothyroid and have heard that can impact your milk supply; it might be worth getting this checked (I think about 34 weeks is recommended) if you're worried? It is easily treated with medication :)