hypothyroid 7 wks - worried (again!) lack of major morning sickness

[Clarella]

Hi, I know a RIDICULOUS thing to worry about, but right now I could make worrying an olympic sport and win 3 gold medals!

It's the excruciating lack of info for early pregnant Hypothyroidism - I feel I'm circling the ramparts of the consultants fortress until the second trimester!

A lot of hypo ladies describe very bad m/s - unless as my levels were good at conception and then I was increased by 25 mcg my hormones are doing well?

Ive been off foods at times and sometimes get that 'i need to eat something dry and salty to avoid feeling queasy' but that's it. However most people with Hypothyroidism seem to get very bad ms.

Anyone else experienced this?

My booking will be at 8+5 wks and shes already said she doesnt know much about thyroid in Pregnancy but i'll be referred on.

Thanks in advance, sorry for the worrying!

I didn't have 'extremely bad' morning sickness. I felt nauseous and was occasionally sick up to 9 weeks, was sick once or twice most days from about 9 weeks to 18 weeks but I could eat other meals and snacks fine. I'm still occasionally sick at 25 weeks, but can go several days without, and it tends to be eat > throw up > clean up > finish eating and doesn't make me feel awful.

I hadn't heard that 'most' people with hypothyroidism have very bad morning sickness. Bear in mind that some women have hyperemesis or fairly bad morning sickness, others have it milder, and some feel nauseous without vomiting, whilst some lucky sods get away scot free. It really varies between women, and even between pregnancies. If some women with hypothyroidism suffer from hyperemesis, it might be just chance and unrelated to their thyroid.

I believe that women on adequate dosages of levothyroxine ought to have just as normal a pregnancy as anyone else. I'm not an expert, but I thought that as long as your levels are monitored and treated, that you are just the same as a woman without thyroid problems. The difficulty with the thyroid is when you aren't being treated adequately (either because it hasn't been diagnosed or because you aren't having your levels monitored and adjusted enough).

Enjoy your current lack of morning sickness, at seven weeks, its very early days, I can't remember exactly but I don't think my sickness started in earnest until after then. Sorry!

I have hypothyroidism, am on 175mcg of levothyroxine (up 25mcg from pre-preg dose) and I'm 25 weeks and everything so far (20week scan and 24 week antenatal appointment listening to heartbeat etc) seems to be well.

Worrying is a normal part of pregnancy, but I think as long as you have regular blood tests and your dosage is monitored, you don't have anything more to worry about than any other pregnant lady. I'm not a medical professional though, and feel free to get in touch with one if you are still concerned.

The only affect my thyroid has had on this pregnancy:

• regular blood tests
• early first scan at 10 weeks in addition to 12 week scan

I was told that the reason for the early scan was to check that I hadn't miscarried, which is apparently slightly more common in women with thyroid problems.

Sorry, don't mean to give you something else to worry about, as I said above, if your levels are under control and monitored then I can't see any reason for you not to have just as healthy a pregnancy as anyone else.

I seem to be. Despite me being surprised every time I get told that my baby seems to be healthy and coming along well (I have other health ishoos in addition to thyroid).

I'm hypo and had no morning sickness - everything was fine at my 12 week scan. I didn't get offered an early one, though

Just make sure you get your bloods tested about every 6 weeks by your GP. I've been referred on but don't get to see anybody til I'm 16 weeks, which would be leaving it a a bit late for my first blood test iyswim :)

P.s. Ta for this thread, you reminded me to call up for the results of the blood test I had last week. Apparently all is fine so I'm staying on current dosage.

:)

Hi peeps, thanks so much for your advice - I think I've had advice from both of you before over the last three weeks! (blush)

I had a horrid time when I was first diagnosed when I was 21 (now 35) - or rather not diagnosed for about a year and was put on antidepressants which i then reacted to and spend another 18 months being weaned off - it was fine when I changed docs but the experience definately affected me and seems to be fueling it now. I also work with sen which fuelled my initial anxieties after some silly googling when I got Pregnant - though now am fine about this too! Apologies again but thanks for being my guardian angels and setting my mind at ease!

I know about the increased miscarriage rate but feel confident now my levels are ok - will ask for a test at the booking appt as it will have been 4 weeks since I was on a higher dose
and I know ill be referred on then. As for scans - will have to see!

I hope you both continue to do well xxx

That's great spirited! :) best wishes x

Ah Clarella I could have written that post myself, I really do sympathise - I also got diagnosed with depression which turned out to be a side-effect of feeling so bloody tired all the time from the hypothyroidism. It then took 3 years for them to get my thyroid under control, and when I then came off the antidepressants the withdrawl gave me palpitations!

Good luck and don't feel bad about posting for advice :)

Hi Clarella, I am in a similar boat - 6 weeks pg, hypothyroid and no real nausea or sickness to speak of. I just feel the need to eat quite often (though that could be natural greed taking over ).

I had an early scan yesterday (due to having a bit of bleeding) and all looked fine - right size pregnancy sac and yolk - so lack of nausea clearly doesn't necessarily mean things aren't developing. Hope that helps a little bit.

Hi - another one here, hypothyroid and now 17 weeks. I didn't get v. bad morning sickness - slightly nauseous for the first few weeks which built up to permanent nausea around 10'ish weeks and is now starting to ease, was never actually sick though.

I am under the endocrinologist at the hospital and have to have blood tests about 6 weekly - I have my second appt with her next week and after that, she said she'd probably just call me once blood test results are in, no need to keep dragging me in.

Pregnancy is a worrying time and adding in dodgy thyroids does add to that worry but most of what you read on-line is worst case for un-diagnosed thyroid problems - as long as you are well monitored, your pregnancy should be no different than someone with a lovely, functioning thyroid.

I know it's easier said than done but try to relax and enjoy your pregnancy (and be happy no sickness yet, it may catch up with you!)

McPopcorn, snap! I got put on beta blockers for the palpitations (which felt like headrushes) which were great (and later in life have been great again as a stressed out teacher!) but am off them for now for the pregnancy. I feel for you, three years is a stupid long time.

I know lots of people go on about hypothyroidism and are anti the medical establishment but I really don't think many doctors realise the effect even a slightly low thyroid has as a wider impact especially in younger people - a few years ago when it went a bit low I almost developed a phobia of tireness that crept towards agoraphobia! I have just joined the British thyroid foundation and am impressed with their support.

Every time my thyroid has wobbled under I have experienced anxiety (for not being able to cope at work and having to spend more time thinking) and then depression but things always begin to improve once the thyroid does - though Ive been left with underlying anxieties linked to thyroid and work which was bloody hard when I was under as I refused to let it affect work, but it really affected social life. I've worked bloody hard to get control of / manage my energy levels and now have become quite fit but could only begin when thyroid was better.

Hi Minipie, yeay similar due dates, think Ive seen you on a dec or nov preg thread! Glad bleed all is well and progressing well too. I too seem to be needing to eat quite often and am dithering over food alot - just dont feel exactly sick, but you all are setting mind at ease!

Thank you Debs, very sensible and mind easing advice, congratulations and glad all is well with you.

I really had better stop letting the worry get to me and concentrate on planning stuff for next week - wonder if I'll be able to cope with cookery as easily?! At least we all sit and eat digestives for snack :) (Autistic children rarely do fruit!)

Sorry stupid long post. I never thought there could be such a wealth of very supportive and sensible people on Mumsnet thank you, thank you, thank you!

Hi all, some really good advice on here already and everyone seems to know their stuff. I think as thyroid patients we really have to arm ourselves with as much info as possible, it sounds awful but I feel like I know a lot more about thyroid issues than my GP will ever do.

Clarella not sure where you got the idea from that hypothyroid means increased morning sickness, I have never heard that at all and like to class myself as a bit of a thyroid expert (as I am sure we all do) having had to take my thyroid treatment into my own hands. I too had a horrible time pre-diagnosis at the same age, 21, and it took me a good few years to get it balanced and get rid of the anxiety and also weight gain. All good now though, thank goodness. I find I work better if my TSH is around 1.

I am actually a recurrent miscarriage sufferer (4 miscarriages, no baby as yet but currently 25 weeks pregnant) and there is often thought to be no direct connection with hypothyroidism and miscarriage IF your levels are ok. There is also no need to take the extra thyroxine if your levels are normal. By normal I mean to keep your TSH under 2, preferably around 1. Make sure you get your levels tested regularly. I was on 125mcg of thyroxine pre-pregnancy and am still on this as my levels don't seem to have been affected.

My problem was relating to thyroid (high natural killer cells) but it is very rare and having been treated with steroid medication and immune modulators am now 25 weeks pregnant. I've been queasy in all pregnancies (previous mcs) but never had really bad sickness at all. Don't start worrying about high natural killer cells though just because I have mentioned them! I am sure you will be fine.

You are going to worry of course, we all are! But as long as your thyroid levels are fine then you should be too.

Hi freelance thanks for your reply and also congratulations!

A mumsnetter I emailed last week said she had suffered with ms and her consultant had said it was quite common, also saw it somewhere else and happened to be in the frame of mind to panic! Not very scientific I know.

Sorry to hear you had bad experiences when you were young too.

Here again is the misunderstanding of the docs- I went several times preconception and then when I first got bpf to get clear indications of what would happen. My usual doc said I might not need to go up and at Xmas my tsh was below 1 which he was pleased with. I went again as I felt levels were diff in Feb and asked for a check again as I had wobbled a lot last year which another doc I saw (usual one unavailable) was happy to do and it was 1.5 then I must have conceived a week later!

When I got confirmation at the docs, doc no 2 said go up 25 (now 150 ) which is what nice guidelines seem to be... BUT first doc would have tested bloods before/ if putting up if at all. I seemed a little hyper at first but then crashed the week later (possibly end of term stress then exhaustion).

From what u say free, I may not have needed to go up - but to be honest its probably drops in ocean and I feel well - its just very very frustrating that there is inconsistency not for me but generally for all. My midwife admitted she knew nothing and a nurse on the thyroid foundation did some research (only leicstershire - sp?) That showed quite a lack of knowledge amongst gps about the guidelines in early Preg.

I'm not an anti establishment political raver just really want to trust the docs who have been so good with my work stress over the years and treating my thyroid but now really doubt their judgements.

Moan moan! Sorry sorry!

Watching a recording of OBEM where the poor woman had a Major Poo Incident with her child made me quite confident as that's a frequent occurance in my class, bless them!

Yeah, unfortunately GPs are just that, pretty general in terms of knowledge. I have even seen endocrinologists that dismiss new research in the thyroid world - such as refusing to acknowledge that if you might be slightly under unless your TSH is above 5 (new guidelines often say it should be treated if above 3). I know myself that when I had a dip of a tsh of around 2.85 a couple of years ago, I felt like I was walking through treacle! Of course everyone is different.

I do however think it is now refreshing that some docs acknowledge that preganncy does often necessitate a rise in thyroxine dosage but it is a shame that this seems to be applied across the board - before actual levels are checked - as some people might be in danger of going over active. And I am sure you know that feels crap too. Realisically, if you were slightly over it probably wouldn't have any effect at all on the pregnancy.

Oh and my midwife called me up the other week after a TSH test and said my levels were a bit low (I think they were 0.45) and she says this means I needed to take MORE thyroxine! I gently pointed out to her that no, it would actually mean I needed to take less. I left my dose the same for the time being but thank goodness I knew that what she was saying wasn't right.

I have not been able to watch OBEM so you are a braver woman than I :)

Its really interesting to read what you ladies are saying about thyroid problems.

It took us a long time to conceive with long and irregular periods. I don't know if that was directly caused by my thyroid or whether it was more to do with having a high BMI or whether we were just unlucky.

I also have agoraphobia and depression/anxiety. This hasn't disappeared since my thyroid levels have been under control, but I am finding things a bit more manageable and haven't gotten worse. I think there maybe still are underlying emotional/thinking errors that I need to deal with as well as whatever the situation with my body chemistry was.

Will have a look at the British Thyroid Foundation's website. Thanks :)

It is great to hear from you, wishing you all the best with your pregnancies.

Hello, all this sounds VERY familiar! My thyroid went hypo during my last pregnancy 8 years ago, after a year they diagnosed me (and 5 doctors later) and 2 years after that I felt somewhere near myself.

I remember that during the dark times of living in bed, if there was a special occasion looming and I had to actually go for a night out, it would take 2 weeks to recover from it.

I went to see my doctor about my thyroid before easter, he told me he didn't know much about it during pregnancy and that my specialist would answer any questions, it wasn't until Tuesday this week that my dosage was upped by 25mcg and only because I went armed with this thyroid link

I have suffered terribly with nausea constantly this time, but looking at my test results my TSH was 4.50 so that could be one reason. Sometimes Googling can be the devils work! Give yourself a break :)

On the up side, I've felt just as shitty as I normally do and I told the doctor that, he looked a bit peeved. I'm 9 weeks now and not as worried as I was even at weekend, I've had some terrible thoughts.

Hope you feel better about it all soon, we all know how you feel.

All sounds very familiar - sorry to hear about your difficulties sprited. I have to say (didn't want to go on) that my anxiety / depression persisted long after my levels adjusted and I developed such bad anxiety attacks and leaning towards self harm (due to self hatred at being 'useless') I had to seek a higher level if help. The kids got me through at work as I felt so needed but at home I was a pressure cooker. I knew if I stopped work I'd go under but in reality work was the main issue and what my panic was all about. The doc was great and made me take slow betablockers all the time, which helped balance me a bit and then a year with a psychiatrist doing cbt began to give me the control over the thought patterns.

Ironically, I was doing some intensive training about autism when I was badly under (monthly essays on top of the 9 reports for the kids each 6000 words + hypo resulted in a hell of a lot of thought whilst brain was full of treacle!) - I really likened being hypo to how they appeared to feel daily - very lethargic and slow thought processing or assimilation which results in extreme anxiety as they try to unmuddle the world. They rely on signs, symbols, routines and structures to help them progress and any change to my routine at that time freaked me out - a common anxiety thing. Some of them are slightly agrophobic as they never know what to expect with new things and the fear takes over.

When I then went on to learn about methods to help lessen anxiety in autistic children: visuals, 'social stories' outlining what to expect and how to act in social situations - lots of 'this is ok' and we do a lot of work on points of view, and seeing the bigger picture, not catastrophising and debriefing. It really isn't a million miles off what my cbt stuff was. I now seem to be put with the most autistic and fragile classes and easing their anxiety and building confididence is my main objective ( stuff u ofsted) as it is their main disability.

I think what I'm trying to say is that patterned thoughts plus adrenaline equal ingrained thought patterns equal behaviour patterns and bloody depression (and exhaustion) for anyone. There is no quick fix and feeling physically well makes no difference. I think routines help a lot both in what we do and how we think - neither are at all easy to develop and I needed someone to tell me how to think correctly. She gave me a book the nhs recommended which helped and some panic breakdown worksheets to identify the main issues 'hot thoughts.' Slowly I could do it myself and really began to finally get better (first time in 8 years).

Sorry long post again! I just want to help anyone who might be experiencing anything like this. Theres probably a phd research project there for someone but I can't be bothered and just want my baby to care about now - the education systems had 11 years of me, time for something that really matters!

Ps well done for your patience with m/w freelance!

Congratulations shellybob, and hope you begin to feel better soon too.

Google + internet access on phone is the devils work!

clarella for the very first time today, no sickness! I feel like dancing :)

Woop woop!

Hi all,

I am currently 19 wks pregnant with my second child. I had my thyroid gland removed when I was 20 as had hyperthyroidism. At the present time both of my pregnancies have been very similar in relation to experience with hypothyroidism. My levels are well monitored pre pregnancy and very steady and then the minute I am pregnant everything goes a bit mental. Obviously this is worrying on both occasions as for the first 8 weeks of pregnancy there is very little input from professionals, even though the documentation states that there is increased miscarriage. However, as evidenced that has not happened to me (for which I am grateful) and when I spoke to the consultant she felt that if we go into pregnancy with stable results that the risk of problems are low. I asked her about increased risk of brain development problems and again she said the risk was low. Obviously this is only my account of my experiences and I am no doctor, but I really do understand the anxiety and worry in the first 12 weeks, whilst you are waiting for a scan and a consultants appt.

I have not suffered from terrible morning sickness and my actual pregnancy symptoms have been mild. My symptoms have been more linked to myself, feeling incredibly cold until my medication increased to a 'normal level', excessive tiredness and totally emotional but I feel so much better now my meds have increased.

I hardest part of having a thyroid problem in pregnancy for me was having to wait for my placenta to be checked after birth and then my dd having blood taken to check that she did not have any thyroid problems. I felt anxious about that, but she was fine :)

Good luck to all of you. I strongly feel that there is not enough information for women in early stages of pregnancy with thyroid disorders and this does lead to increased anxiety.

Custard You are so right about lack of information, I was quite baffled about how much of an issue the midwife was making about my thyroid until I came home and Googled, then I was really worried! I was convinced from my test results that I would miscarry :( It's disgraceful.

Clarella Another clear day without any feeling of sickness, I don't know if the thyroxine would take effect from being upped on Tuesday but I now feel fine, so maybe your levels were spot on.

Hope you are all well :)

Gosh you've all been through the mill a bit, haven't you?

My GP's have been clueless (tbf I didn't expect the MW to know too much). I've spoken to 2 GPs, and they've refused to test my blood more than once a trimester - I've not had my TSH done since I was 5 weeks (now 15) and I have been freaking out on and off since about 12 weeks. When I started to feel symptomatic at about 12 weeks I increased my dose myself by 25mcg as I knew most women are advised to do from the off - naughty I know, but what can you do when GPs refuse to test?? I'd have never stopped beating myself up if I'd miscarried (we've been ttc a long time). My first consultant appointment is this week - I'll be almost 16 weeks when I see them. I don't mean to GP-bash as on the whole my thyroid care has been very good over the years - but I do feel I've been abandoned by them in pregnancy.

Completely, completely OT but clarella why don't kids with autism like fruit? :o

Popcorn I thought my GP was great about my thyroid and quite on the ball, but the blank look and admittance that he knew nothing about pregnancy and hypothyroidism blew me away! They are WRONG about testing you once a trimester, I've posted a link above that I took to my GP, here's an extract

.
Monitor TSH and FT4 levels:
Every 4 weeks during titration of levothyroxine.
Every 4 weeks during the first trimester, and again at 16 weeks and at 28 weeks of gestation, in a woman who is on a stable dose of levothyroxine.
More frequent tests may be appropriate on specialist advice.

You are not GP bashing, but they have a phone and a computer on their desk, they should use it to check with a specialist if they aren't sure about things. I made sure mine kept all the print outs to read, if only in passing that day, at least he would know for the next pregnant girl (lol) who was hypo.

Can you let us know how your appointment with your consultant goes? I've got an appointment with mine of 25th, I've already got a long list of questions for him lol.

Shelly I saw an endocrine consultant last week about my thyroid and she said blood tests every trimester. I said "isn't it every 4 weeks" and she said no, every trimester was fine

So specialists get it wrong too... I'll be asking my GP for blood tests every 4 weeks until 16 weeks anyway (luckily I have a friendly GP)

Wow, is there anyone out there that knows about it, it's not like it's a rare thing! My GP said he is quite happy testing me every 4 weeks right the way through but that may be because he doesn't know any better.

You're having your scan next Wednesday too aren't you Minipie?