All women to be given right to caesarean

[Sandra2011]

The NHS plans to make the operation available to healthy women capable of giving birth naturally for the first time in its history.

Although a quarter of all births are already currently carried out by caesarean, women do not have the automatic right to ask for one if there is no medical reason for it. However there have been cases where women have persuaded doctors to perform it as a matter of preference, though this has always been an exception to the rule.

www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/8858147/All-women-to-be-given-right-to-caesarean.html

What's your opinion?

Hear hear mum2be! Choice is the most important thing in life. Best of luck with your little one!

Mum2Be, has just it. This choice DOES affect others. It will change the dynamic of Antenatal and Postnatal care for ALL women and with the NHS is the current state that it is, I don't see how it's either fair or justifiable. I did say that CS is appropriate for some whether that reason maybe physical, medical or psychological but for your average straightforward pregnancy, it makes no sense. How is it the NHS told me I would not be issued with this infamous pregnancy book because of cuts in funding yet money can be allocated for surgery where it might not be necessary? I would argue that in the vast majority of cases, the surgeries you mentioned are also inappropriate allocations of NHS money but that's a separate thread all together.

I don't remember who said it but the most valid point so far is that this money is of far better use educating and counselling women about what our bodies go through during pregnancy and birth therefore having less women feel that CS is the only way they can cope with giving birth. If I didn't spend half the time I do reading and googling, I would know sweet FA about what's going on with my body right now because NOBODY in the NHS has bothered to provide this information for me. This speaks volumes to me about why there are women who are terrified of pregnancy and/or VB. I guess from my point of view, the choice to have elective major surgery is way down on the list of public service priories in comparison to education.

I'm not for denying choice. But, just saying "I don't want one" is a stupid reason to undergo serious surgery. Any doctor (nhs or private) confronted with a patient 'not wanting' a VB, when one is perfectly safe for mum and baby, should be questioning why, not just slicing open without questioning and trying to get said mum help. As I've said before, if birth is such an inconvenience, then frankly, don't have kids.

BUT having said that, if there's a reason - physical or psychological - to opt for an ELCS then I'm all for choice!

I also don't like the comparison to a sex change (sorry m2b love you) but that isn't a lifestyle choice at all 'mainly' or otherwise.

Plus, the NHS has limited resources, and they should fairly be distributed by need (think of all those we all know of that have had traumatic births before, and who are being denied ELCS due to lack of funds, yet they're going to have to fight for the same funds as some woman that just can't be bothered).

I personally thing its great that woman have the choise to have a caesarian if they want one

Oh thank the Lord, this is the best news I've heard in ages. I'm 12w pregnant with twins after recurrent miscarriage and really not sure if I'm up for a natural birth - for twins, natural vs caesarian is a tough call and depends very much on the individual circumstances and the position of the babies during labour. My ideal thing would be to find that I trust the consultant and the labour ward midwives to let me have a go at natural but not to waste any time if it fails to progress - but if I get bad vibes off the midwives it would be a tremendous relief to know I could sign up for a caesarian. It's such a different decision for each person. My other half and I are likely to have problems communicating with the midwives - we live in London, but I'm Scottish and he's a foreigner and sometimes we've been in clinics where one of us has spoken to a sonographer or receptionist and they've just stared at us completely uncomprehendingly because of our accents. Imagine that happens if you're in labour? Trying to get your husband to get the midwife's attention and convince them that something feels wrong? Imagine you don't speak much English at all, how much time it takes to get the message through. In that situation, the caesarian starts to look very good because you lie there and the medical professionals do their thing.

I personally wouldn't have one. It's a major surgery and recovery time is always much longer than in normal birth.

My friends have been suffering after caesarean for up to 6 weeks, I was up and going only few moments after my normal delivery.

If you're too posh to push you should pay for the difference which to my knowledge is £800.

It's different if you're having twins of have some medical reason for this surgery.

I think every woman should have the right to choose how her baby is delivered in a similar way to where. Her body = her choice. Especially as I would imagine they would be given appropriate information on the pro's and con's of both.

FWIW though I had a vaginal birth with DS and intend to again this time though I was fortunate not to have any complications. I was induced and the prospect terrified me to the point of asking if I could have a CS instead. Now though I see that thats what painkillers are for. I've written and underlined in red pen that I want an epidural.

Given NHS funding, I would be sad to see Trusts having to spend money on c-sections for every woman who wanted one rather than just every woman who needed one. You can need a c-section for various reasons (positioning, medical conditions of the mother, medical condition of the baby, psychological conditions of the mother and so on), so if a woman does have a real phobia of VB she would still get a section under current rules.

The NHS has to ration healthcare whether we like it or not. I, for example, can't get treatment on the NHS for my female pattern baldness, which I've had since my mid-20s. The NHS was happy to diagnose it, but I don't get any treatment. Allowing unnecessary and unneeded operations to go ahead seems a complete waste of money.

I am not anyti-section, just anti-unnecessary sections. I had a c-section with my son - it undoubtably saved his life and I had a very quick and painless recovery (the only one of my friends who have had sections to have no complications). I was off painkillers within 72 hours of surgery and going for 2 mile walks the next day - and I was not fit to start with. Yes a section would be far more convenient this time around with regards to childcare, but having educated myself on the risks and benefits, I'm going to try for a VBAC this time.

FWIW, I think it would be interesting to conduct a poll to find out how many women will actually elect for a c-section when offered the choice. A lot of people SAY they would when they're not pregnant, but I think the actual outcome would be far different.

I'm in support of the choice aspect, but totally agree with others on here who have suggested funding should also be provided to educate women about the reality of a vaginal delivery. I also believe there should be more money invested in supplying adequate pain relief because that's what a lot of this boils down to - being scared or intimidated by the pain anticipated during natural childbirth. One of my NCT friends was obsessed by whether or not she'd be 'allowed' to have an epidural - we've all heard the story about the mum crying and begging for one, only to be told it's too late. That may be the case for some, but I also believe there are too many midwives taking decisions about pain relief away from mothers assuming they don't know what they are talking about.

A large % of women ARE self-taught about pregnancy and childbirth and know far more than a lot of medical staff give them credit for. Empowering women is the way to go - I'm just not sure C-sections on demand is necessarily the first step.

I asked for one and was told theres no reason why I should have one as healthy etc didnt seem to be too worried that I was so nervous and anxious about giving birth actually were quite horrible to me and ended up in tears and felt silly so I think its a good thing decided to go for natural labour if possible still got fears about baby getting stuck and being out of control etc but going to not think about it too much,

I shouldn't have read this, I feel guilty now. I am booked in for a section in a few weeks time. I tried for a VB with dd, I tried for a very long time ending with a crash section whwn DD got into distress and I became ill. The consultant at the time told me the same thing was likely to happen again for me as an individual.

I figured that if I was going to end up with a section anyway I'd rather it was a planned one than the higher risk emergency one when both our lives are in danger.

minus - i don't know why you feel guilty. i had a terrible VB that was seconds from becoming a C-section but instead was forceps and episiotomy. For various reasons I've been advised to have a c-section this time and I'm nervous about it but trust that it is the right method. I too think this birth will otherwise probably end in emergency c-section even if i try VB. So a scheduled one seems relatively safe and predictable.
we can all dream of perfect VBs but reality is far different for most.

Minus, you shouldn't feel guilty. You are exactly the sort of person that C-sections ARE necessary for. I had my first daughter by emergency C-section after failed ventouse and I really hope with this pregnancy that I am 'allowed' another section. I know there's the recovery to consider but I'm not an idiot and I believe I will end up in the same boat again with no. 2 so I may as well go for the elective and save me - and my baby - a lot of stress.

Minus- You are the kind of woman that would be having a necessary CS as medical intervention to avoid harm and distress to you and your LO. No need to feel guilty at all! Very different from simply opting out of VB for a trivial reason.

Last night I ended up spending 5 hours and 45 minutes on the labour ward waiting to be checked out by a Dr after being in severe pain. I left hospital at 3.45 am due to the fact the the hospital only had TWO Dr's on duty to serve both the Labour Ward, the maternity ward and A&E. Does this sound like an NHS that can afford to implement this new CS policy? Not to me it doesn't.

By all means give a woman a ceasarian is she is genuinely terrified of vaginal birth.
But I don't agree with electric caesarian for all.
I believe it will encourage young mothers to be pressured into caesarian by the believe that men will prefer their vagina afterwards.
And there could be an attitude of 'ew you had a vaginal, you must have a right bucket'. Among teen mums. Might sound laughable but I can absolutely see that happening.

We know the risks of caesarian, it's a massively invasive surgery, that can affect how capable a woman is of caring for her baby afterwards and breastfeeding.

I think vaginal birth should be the norm, and don't believe there should be anything to encourage otherwise, like a >>>seemingly

It's not the easy way out and tbh its not something I feel more in control over. To me a VB that worked would be me being more in control. My personal feeling of control that is. Its just that as the chance of successful VB in me is less than 1% I want a section as preferable to death.

Maybe I am naive (yes I know but I can't type accents) but I am hoping that my recovery time will be shorter in relative terms this time. When I say shorter I don't mean in comparison to a complication free vaginal birth but in comparison to 4 days solid of regular contraction, haemorrahge, collapse and crash section IYSWIM. I certainly shouldn't be suffering from the same level of exhaustion on being wheeled into the theatre.

Sorry but given that the NHS don't have enough funding to give cancer patients treatment quickly enough to stop their cancer spreading further, I don't think funding should be used for luxuries when people in more dire need can't get the immediate life saving treament they need.

Seriously? You actually think my last birth when I tried to do it properly actually cost significantly less when you take into account the complications? Perhaps I should tell them just to let me die.

I think she means elective lockets that useless, selfish money grabbers like me have.

lol, electric, sorry. I meant 'elective'

Minus, I read isthis's comment to be about the right to an elective c-section as she couldn't possibly have meant she was against all elective sections as that would include scheduled sections for pre-e, placents previa, frank breach, history of haemorrhaging in previous labours etc etc. Surely she couldn't possibly have meant she disagreed with your upcoming scheduled section given it is scheduled on medical advice? Surely she's not that daft?

That said, she's right about the 'tightness' argument - when one of DH's friend's was talking to him about DS's birth, he commented to DH'S that at least I'd still be tight. Uck!

I meant elective as in by choice alone.

Such as the difference between elective abortion and abortion on medical grounds (medical grounds including mental and physical reasons).

I'm pretty amazed there are so many ill-informed pregnant women around (maybe due to the nhs' lack of funds for education? ).

At the moment, women can have an elcs for many reasons. I would think anyone that would choose an elcs would qualify for one at the moment for whatever reason. What reason could there be that you would want one and wouldn't currently be allowed one? This is a genuine question, the only one I can think of is this "bucket fanjo" thing (although I genuinely would never have thought of how tight or bucket like anyone's vagina was post birth! ).