I'm 7 months pregnant and STILL my DH won't stop smoking - help! ( sorry, long)

[Miffster]

DH and I, who are 42 and 39 respectively, both smoked before I got pg, we had sone so for years, since our late teens, both of us in denial about it, though we managed to stop occasionally. Then I got pregnant, after 2 years trying, which included cutting down and prioritising my health when TTC. I stopped immediately when I got BFP. It was hard - bloody hard - but I used an electric inhalator for the first week, had a few drags when I started jonesing beyond endurance, and just did it, out of love and anxiety for the unborn baby.

My DH carried on (always smoking outside, never indoors). The smell used to nauseate me, more and more as the 1st trimester progressed, clinging to his clothes, wafting in with him as he stepped back into the room ( the door outside to the garden is in our bedroom, I would lie in bed, looking grey with exhaustion and nausea and he would step in, along with a cloud of fumes). He would wash his hands and face before touching me, shower before going to bed with me - but he carried on smoking.

He said he would stop on holiday this August. He didn't.

He has cut down - a bit - but it creeps up when he stressed - and he is now smoking rollies at home. But despite the fact that he has had smoking-related tooth decay toothache for 3 weeks - which started on our holiday in August - and which will necessitate root canal work - and this is the third tooth he has had removed due to smoking-related gum disease - STILL he can't stop!

He has an incredibly stressful job.
He works stupid hours.
He is quitting the job to spend time with me and the baby and we are moving abroad to a less stressful lifestyle with him working fewer hours. All this is good - but it's for next year, not now.
I've let it go so far, mostly, though I have let it be known how much I hate the smoking - but I don't think I can bear it much longer.

The baby will be here in c.12 weeks, quite possibly earlier since my Mum had her babies early. I feel like we are at the end of the line.

In every other way he is a delighted, excited, responsible expectant dad-to-be.
I just don't know what to do, but I KNOW that I will not want him to touch or handle the baby if he has been smoking. I don't want him touching me in labour, smelling of smoke. And I also am frightened that smoking will kill him/cause him to have a stroke, and that the baby and I won't have him around to love any more or that I will have to look after him as an invalid not an active dad.

I am hurt that he can't see how much it upsets me and how disappointed I am that he won't try harder to break free of it.

I need to find some links to show him about smoke residue on clothes/hands, and babies, because he just does not get why I have an issue with this: he is in denial about how awful it smells and how it frightens me that he can't seem to break the addiction.

Has anyone got any info on dangers of smokers handling babies? Has anyone else managed to persuade their OH to quite for the baby's sake when pregnant?

Has anyone any ideas on what I can do? I thought the reality of the baby coming would be enough to make him stop, as I am now in the last trimester. I wnat him to stop before the baby comes, not after and IO am sorry to come on here and whinge and ask for help but I feel at my wits end.

Don't be sorry about whinging, its what MN is for . I don't have any of the info you want but just wanted to lend some support. I too gave up smoking as soon as I got pregnant but my DH hasn't either (yet)- I am 34+3. Like yours he doesnt smoke around me. I havent nagged him at all about giving up, not cos I don't think he should cos for all the same reasons as you I am worried about it, but because I know that method doesnt work with my DH. I definately have to just wait for him to work it out for himself and make the decision, then he is much more likely to stick to it. He has said a few times that he will give up on the day of the birth (I can't understand why he'd want the stress of giving up at the same time as the stress of a new baby, and not do it before then but hey ho, thats fellas for you!)

Like I said, no useful info for you, sorry, I'm just keeping my fingers crossed that the shock of becoming a daddy will change his priorities/give him a bit of motivation, after all, we have th emotivation of knowing we are growing our LO inside us, but I guess it all seems a bit distant to the DH?? I know I am being soft!!!

Gook luck!

Arrrrgghhh,... Gook???

Its annoying isnt it?

My dh is also a smoker. He gave up when our first DS was born, but he is 3 now and the smoking has started up again in the meantime. I have asked him to stop again this time round, but apparently my asking makes it even harder.....

Sorry, not got much time for a full reply, but Im sure google will come up with some useful links. The thing I wanted to say is that I was told by my HV last time, that if someone has just had a cigarette, then they shouldn't hold/cuddle baby for at least half an hour.... I stuck hard by this rule with svisitors who smoked etc, and I'll do it again this time with DH as well if he hasn't quit by then - 3 weeks!!!

You'd think that their new baby's health would be enough to make them stop - sadly this is not the case for many I'm sure. I have never been a smoker however, so perhaps cannot appreciate the difficulty in stopping, I just think it can be done:-)

Obviously there are the well known links to SIDS etc, and I think your DH needs to consider this especially when it comes to smoking outside your bedroom, if your new baby is going to be sleeping in your room.

Hope things work out for you, it is a definite worry for me too.

xxxx

I know how you feel. DD is 6 months old. When I got pregnant last year, I told DH he had to stop. He didn't. I told him when she was born, he had to stop. He didn't.

Only last month, has he decided for himself to quit. It's the most upsetting and frustrating thing in the world, when they are carrying on a habit that can potentially harm your baby, but seem not to care. It sounds like your DH is already prepared to make a change on the work/life front and I bet you the smoking will be the next thing. What I did learn is that it's something they have to do for themselves, no matter what you say or how often, the cigarettes have the stronger hold. I've never smoked so can't imagine having an addiction that I would put over my family, but there you go, many people do.

What worked for my DH was the Champix drug. He has to go to the clinic at least once a fortnight and get tested for carbon monoxide levels, if they show he has been smoking, he can't get any more tablets for 6 months.
In the last 2 weeks (you still smoke for approx the first 12 days) he hasn't touched a cigarette, it's the weirdest thing I have seen. He just doesn't want them. Could this work for your DH? It's just been painless. There is the risk of side effects (nausea, depression) but as the counseller at the smoking clinic pointed out, they pale in comparison when you look at what smoking does long term.

Sorry, no really constructive advice, but good luck x

I will try not to repeat lots of what has been said already. DH tried to stop when I was pregnant using the nicotine patches but started again after the pharmacy kept messing up the prescription so he was left without them every 2nd weekend. He also had to go to a support group which was really NOT for him. He has recently given up also using Champix and it has worked really well for him. He been stopped for nearly 4 months and is doing very well. (DD is now 3). All I can say is he knew how bad it was for himself to be doing it but he had to really want to stop FOR HIM, not me, not the baby. I used to think like you, why can't he stop now I'm pregnant but when all's said and done, he's a grown man, it's his body. I grew up in a house where both parent smoked, all their friends smoked and that was fairly normal. I'm not saying you need to put up with it but you know how hard it is to stop, when you don't have the incentive of a new life inside you I imagine its quite different, there's always an excuse not to stop. I think seeing DD put a straw in her mouth and pretend to be smoking was a real wake-up call. It's also very hard when lots of your family and friends are smokers, it really is a horrible addiction, not nice for any of you at all. Not sure any of that will help but I do sympathise.

Oops sorry no paragraphs..

interesting

just one example - just google the danger of smoking around babies.

I was in the same position as you - gave up cold turkey as soon as I got a positive pregnancy test. My dh would set dates to stop and they would pass. He finally stopped smoking about 2-3 months ago when my ds was about 9 months old.
He did it because he was ready to. In the mean time he would always smoke outside with an outdoor jacket on which he removed when he came inside and would thoroughly wash his hands, brush his teeth and use mouthwash after every cigarette. This doesn't remove all risk as breathing out releases particles for, I believe, up to 4 hours afterwards.
It did however make it a real hassle for him to have a cigarette so he ended up smoking less.
It depends on your dh but nagging would not have worked with mine. I did always mention to him when I could smell smoke and would make comments like "don't breath on the baby, you've just had a cigarette".
I hope he gives up soon.

Exactly the same for us Casmama, nagging would have been no good. I'm so proud of him now, I don't mention it until someone else asks and then I make a big deal of saying how well he has been doing, otherwise we just don't talk about it.

I'm in a similar position. I'm 32 weeks pregnant. My DH gave up for about 5 weeks mid way through my pregnancy and then started smoking again about a month ago. I am really angry with him, but I don't think nagging will help. He knows he should give up, says that he wants to give up, but just can't seem to make the final step.

He smokes outside, but he stinks of smoke when he comes back in. I really don't want him coming near the baby like that. I think I shall have to instigate the post fag routine that Casmamma's DH used.

I'm just hoping that he'll get round to kicking the habit eventually. But it does make me really cross that he apparently doesn't care enough about our baby to make the effort.

Online sources that might be of interest include:

www.babyandpregnancy.co.uk/SmokingPregnancy.html

Risks of passive smikong on children are highlighted here

In summary, the GP guidance saya:

"Children are at particular risk from the effects of passive smoking because they have an increased risk of developing chest infections during their first five years. Babies who are exposed to cigarette smoke are also at a greater risk of sudden infant death syndrome (SIDS), which is also known as cot death.

As well as making children more vulnerable to ear infections, such as otitis media, passive smoking makes children more likely to develop asthma."

Hi ya,

I watched this earlier this year. news.bbc.co.uk/panorama/hi/front_page/newsid_8615000/8615795.stm

and i have refered back to it inmy head several times while trying to give up smoking with my prgnancy . My oh hasn't given up completly yet either and it is driving my a bit batty as it stinks (i can't believe i smelt that bad and hadn't realised it)

my dh smoked (outside the house) throughout my pregnancy, having been a heavy smoker for years. i hassled him a bit early on and said 'you're going to have to stop when the baby arrives so you'd better start now'. he promised he would and said i needed to stop hassling about it.

he had last fag about 42 hours into my labour (frankly i'd have had one too by that point). that was over 2 years ago and he's never had another one since... he just needed the motivation of the baby actually being here to make him do it.

"I thought the reality of the baby coming would be enough to make him stop, as I am now in the last trimester."

This might be the problem, even if you don't realise it. My friend who recently had a baby - smoked ten a day throughout pregnancy and gave up the day the baby was born. She said when she was pregnant she couldn't give up because, although she was pregnant, it never sank in that she was having a baby. I know lots of people would think it's a lame excuse, and sure, the thought crossed my mind from time to time, because the general consensus is "oh dear, she can't give up smoking, what a horrible selfish woman - she obviously doesn't love her baby". Nontheless, I think it's actually true in some cases that women (and their partners) really don't fully accept there's a real person in that belly which is going to come into the world.

And non-smokers, who've never smoked, will always be fast to jump on the wagon and say "FFS, it's really not that hard to give up such a disgusting habit" without realising just how hard it actually is. And even some ex-smokers will run around saying, "I DID IT! How hard can it be?! If I did it, I don't see why you're making such a big deal." As a point of reference, me and DP both smoked before we got pregnant. He quit the day we found out, it took me a week or two of "yeah, I'm definitely quitting today... No! It's too hard! Give me that cigarette!"

I think you'll struggle to get him to quit at any time. Where stress will definitely give him an "excuse" to smoke, moving away and having a more stress-free life might not have the desired effect either. You have to remember those times where you smoked more on one day simply out of boredom. And no matter how stress-free his work life is, he'll have a new baby, and a whole new reason to be stressed.

Some ideas though. In order to help the "I'm having a baby" thing definitely sink in:

1. A 3D scan might make it a bit more real than a little black and white blob (personally I never had one as I find they make the baby look a bit like a monster or Barry from EastEnders, but I know some people who said it was an amazing experience which really 'brought it home')

1. Caring for a friend's baby for a day together, constantly saying things like, "Soon, we'll have one of these. Really makes it all sink in, doesn't it?"

However, failing that, if he really can't quit, there are a couple of ways he can stop it being so offensive to you, as I'm not going to be all extreme and say, "God, if he can't give up smoking for you and the baby then leave him." Cause obviously it's not a valid reason to end a relationship.

1. Switching to roll-ups - considerably less stinky

1. Always have odour cover-ups to hand, e.g. chewing gum, handwash, body spray

1. Smoking outside and only at times where the baby definitely isn't going to be needing contact with him, e.g. immediately after the baby has been put down for a nap

1. Ground rules about not smoking at crucial times, e.g. when you are in labour or in the delivery ward

It's possible he'll give up when baby arrives for himself. He might see the baby and think, "To be a good dad, and to feel good about myself as a parent, I need to show my baby and my lady I can do this." But you can only give up for yourself, and trying to give up for someone else doesn't work.

I think that Bagpusstrees' suggestion of being really strict about not letting him handle the baby post-cigarette sounds like a good idea. If you are strict about not letting him handle his own child whenever he wants to, he might realise that his addiction that is a big problem.

Some really good ideas there. I just told him that I cried for 20 minutes on the way to work today because I was so worried that he wouldn't stop smoking.

He then said he would buy some patches and stop tomorrow! Tonight is someone's leaving do at his work, so I suppose he will get pissed and smoke loads - tomorrow he is seeing the dentist for root canal work and may well lose the tooth - the dentist has said no point trying to save it if he continues to smoke as gum will decay further. Maybe my desperation and the dentist will be enough of a catalyst for it to actually happen.

We shall see. I do not think it is fair that I should have to be the one who begs and nags and demands, and I agree that he has to want to do it, no amount of cajoling or haranguing will work.

In every other way he has shown me how excited he is about the baby...he is even changing his job to be around more for the baby. That's why it is so scary that he still hasn't stopped.

I can't bear to contemplate him still being a smoker when the baby is born and me having to face him down and refuse to let him hold his own baby until he has changed clothes and washed off the smoke...what an incredibly horrible situation for all 3 of us to be in.

Well, all I can do is hope and wish and thank everyone here for the links & advice, which I will pass on. I think that drug sounds a good idea - if he can;t quit with the patches, then he should get a prescription pronto. There is no way he will attend a stop smoking group though ( or even have the time for it given his hours) so if the drug is handed out as part of a programme which includes group work, he won't be able to have it.

Stop the nagging altogether, stop asking him to stop - it won't work. I don't think it would be helpful to deny him holding his baby etc if hsi clothes smell of smoke - you could end up making this drive a really big wedge in your relationship which will be more harmful to the baby than a smelly shirt or hair.

I don't nag.

Nagging is an incredibly sexist term in any case. But I haven't gone on and on at him to stop. I have bitten my tongue for months. I have however started showing my distress more instead of hiding it, hence telling him that i cried today.

I no longer think it is fair or helpful to either of us for me to pretend I don't mind when I do mind, so much, and when it is distressing me so much. I hoped that he would stop by himself

I don't see why I should have to ask him to wash off toxic smoke before cuddling a little baby but I don't see how I could stand back and let him do it either. It is quite honestly cruel to put me - or anyone - in the position where I have to choose between not upsetting my husband and protecting my baby: what kind of choice is that for a new mum to have to make?

It's not about the 'smell', as if that was just some kind of unpleasant thing like body odour, essentially harmless. Its about toxins, chemical residue, clinging to the skin, hair, clothes and the baby breathing them in and absorbing them through its skin.

This is what freaked me out.

Science Daily

'ScienceDaily (Feb. 9, 2010) ? Nicotine in third-hand smoke, the residue from tobacco smoke that clings to virtually all surfaces long after a cigarette has been extinguished, reacts with the common indoor air pollutant nitrous acid to produce dangerous carcinogens. This new potential health hazard was revealed in a multi-institutional study led by researchers with the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory (Berkeley Lab).

"The burning of tobacco releases nicotine in the form of a vapor that adsorbs strongly onto indoor surfaces, such as walls, floors, carpeting, drapes and furniture. Nicotine can persist on those materials for days, weeks and even months. Our study shows that when this residual nicotine reacts with ambient nitrous acid it forms carcinogenic tobacco-specific nitrosamines or TSNAs," says Hugo Destaillats, a chemist with the Indoor Environment Department of Berkeley Lab's Environmental Energy Technologies Division. "TSNAs are among the most broadly acting and potent carcinogens present in unburned tobacco and tobacco smoke."

Time-course measurements revealed fast TSNA formation, up to 0.4 percent conversion of nicotine within the first hour," says lead author Sleiman. "Given the rapid sorption and persistence of high levels of nicotine on indoor surfaces, including clothing and human skin, our findings indicate that third-hand smoke represents an unappreciated health hazard through dermal exposure, dust inhalation and ingestion."
Since the most likely human exposure to these TSNAs is through either inhalation of dust or the contact of skin with carpet or clothes, third-hand smoke would seem to pose the greatest hazard to infants and toddlers. The study's findings indicate that opening a window or deploying a fan to ventilate the room while a cigarette burns does not eliminate the hazard of third-hand smoke. Smoking outdoors is not much of an improvement, as co-author Gundel explains.
"Smoking outside is better than smoking indoors but nicotine residues will stick to a smoker's skin and clothing," she says. "Those residues follow a smoker back inside and get spread everywhere. The biggest risk is to young children. Dermal uptake of the nicotine through a child's skin is likely to occur when the smoker returns and if nitrous acid is in the air, which it usually is, then TSNAs will be formed."

full srticle

I agree with you and think he should quit - especially for his own health and out of respect for you.

However, if he ONLY EVER smokes outside I imagine it won't effect the baby's health very much. Or at least, no more than all the other chemicals we encounter in daily life such as car fumes, soaps, shampoos, the additives in our food, in our furniture etc.

The more important issue is the emotional effect his smoking is having. Perhaps you need to find a way to discuss this in a calm, honest way together. Perhaps he needs to explain himself without you getting upset, and perhaps you need to try not to 'let go' of the issue, just for a while.

I hope that doesn't sound mean - I'm really on your side and OF COURSE he should quit. But I'd just hate to see this tear you apart or stress you out even more.

Good luck, though. I know this is a really hard issue!

Miffster, I have explained to DP that if either of us smoke we can't sleep in our bedroom as it is dangerous for the baby. Neither of us want to spend nights on the sofa this winter, so it should stop us lapsing back into our smoking ways.

"I can't bear to contemplate him still being a smoker when the baby is born and me having to face him down and refuse to let him hold his own baby until he has changed clothes and washed off the smoke...what an incredibly horrible situation for all 3 of us to be in."

Miffster that sums up pretty neatly how I feel. I don't want to have to deny my DH free access to his own child at any time, but if he is still smoking when baby is here, then he will have to wash, clean his teeth, remove outer layers of clothing and wait 30 minutes post fag before he can come near, cos I really don't want the toxins that linger about his person to be transfered to our baby. Our job as parents is to protect and nurture, it seems wrong that DH is likely to present a risk to our baby, rather than being its fiercest protector.

So sorry Miffster. You must be at your wits end. My DH is not a smoker, but is a stubborn so-and-so, so I know how frustrating it is when you need to get them to do something they don't want to or try to get them to see an alternative point of view. Haven't yet found a workable tactic with my DH, so can't give much practical advice in that direction I'm afraid. But I do have a link for you - the Foundation for the Study of Infant Deaths has a section on smoking and risk of cot death and covers the risk of your partner smoking. Short answer: there's an increased risk of cot death.
fsid.org.uk/Page.aspx?pid=409#question4
Hope this provides you with some useful ammunition. Good luck!

Cheers ladies.
Well, he has just returned from the dentist having had the root canal work and is in really appalling pain (and he is capable of taking quite a lot of pain: I have never seen him like this, he didn't get enough anaesthetic and is white with it).

The fact that he is in this state because of smoking...I am not even going to mention it to him. I am not saying a word.

I don't think I need to.

Please God, let this be the tipping point when he realises that he just has to stop smoking.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaand...he's just gone outside for a rollie.

FFS.

FFS.
FFS