Wet at 5 + 1/2 health visitor won't refer

[tghrmum]

My DD has never really been dry. She would often have damp knickers but since she started full time school is wet through when she comes home. She believes no one notices (Cares) but I worry she will get teased if it goes on much longer.
I have been to the health visitor who gives good advice which so far has not worked. She says she can not refer her to a specialist until she is 7.
I have asked her teacher, teaching assistants and even dinner nannies to remind her to go to the toilet at certain times of the day. They say they will "try", I know they are busy and this probably doesnt happen often. It has become a pattern, which by 7 will be hard to turn around. We are all worn down with it. Her older brother was easy and boys arent suposed to be.
Have any of you experienced this or have any advise? PLEASE!

stop seeing the HV and go to the GP. explain that you want a referral and that you are not willing to wait until she is 7

i think if it was something like bedwetting then the 7 thing is fine because a lot of children just don't do it before then (it' a chemical thing)
but this is different. this is when she is awake nd she ought to be able to control it, and you are right that if it goes on much longer she may be picked on and to me it sounds like something tha treally needs further investigation

Take her to see the doctor as this could be a health problem, maybe she is unaware of doing it..

Frankly I think it's pretty crap of the school not to remind her. I think this is potentially a problem for your dd becasue the other kids will notice and it could become a social issue for her.

If you don't get a decent response from the class teacher I would go and see the SENCO (special needs co-ordinator) and ask for your dd to have an IEP (individual education plan) to help her to stay dry during the day. This would probably be very simple. For example, the target could be "X to do all her wees in the loo for three days in a row". Obviouslly the target would change over time and could either be eaiser initially and get harder as she improves. School would then have to say how they would go about doing helping your dd to achieve this target. It could be as simple as TA reminding her to go at break and lunchtime. They might even introduce a little reward chart or encourage her to fill in her own self-monitoring chart. They might think about her being able to leave the classroom without having to ask the teacher's permission to go to the loo if she needs to go urgently. The target should be reviewed with you every term.

Provided there is no underlying medical reason for your dd's incontinence (which I assume has been investigated) this kind of programme should deal with the problem quickly in school.

It's a complete cop out for the school to have such a weak response. Go back in and get arsey if you have to! Actually, don't get arsey (it rarely works in the first instance). Go in and very nicely, but assertively say the school needs to have a proper plan.

Oh, forgot. School should also have a plan in place for when she has wet herself. E.g. Your dd should know where she can go or who she can go to get herself cleaned up. Also, where she can get spare pants / trousers etc. It's completely not on for her to be sitting wet for long periods of time.

I would definitely discuss this with your gp. She could have a bladder infection which would exacerbate the problem.

Does she manage to stay dry when she is at home with you?

Does she drink enough? Sometimes children can leak wee because they do not fill up their bladders enough to get a signal that they need to go.

Thank God I found this thread, its actually made me feel better -- I am going through exactly the same thing as you tghrmum its so awful isn't it. I have DTD's who are 5 and have both been dry for ages, but in the last couple of months the older one (but smaller at birth) has been wetting herself and pooing in her pants at school, when we are out, and also at home. Its making me so cross and upset, not helped by the fact I am 19 weeks pg (it started before we found out) I have tried bribery, threats of going back into nappies, reward charts and nothing helps. I have been on the eric website to read other people's stories. Today I got a phone call from the school at lunchtime to say she had had 2 wees in the last hour (same as yesterday) and was she ill? Did I want to go and get her? Well, no, I don't - she isn't ill. So I've made us an appt at the GP for after school in the hope that they can shed some light on it. Sometimes she says she can't feel it coming, there was a spider in the loo, the toilets were all busy etc etc....

Sorry to hijack, but you are not alone, and I am relieved to see that neither am I - hope you get some resolution to your situation, and will update as to GP's thoughts

Thank God someone else is going through it as well, DD is so bad, she needs to be changed sometimes up to 4 times a day, was OK until she became constipated last November, I think it is an enotional issue but the Paediatrician is not agreeing with me. I am very concerned that this is going to continue when she starts school and that she is going to be bullied/teased about it.

I know, I don't want her to become "the smelly kid" mine isn't constipated, infact will sometimes have two normal poos a day!

They took a urine sample that showed a teeny trace of blood, and sent it off to the lab. I have to keep a diary of events for the next couple of weeks, to note accidents, successes and events preceding both. After doing this they will refer to a specialist.

those who are soiling as well.... did it start after a tummy bug or similar? only things like gastroenteritis can result in a secondary intolerance to things

my cousin had this. nasty bout of gastro. followed by regression (it seemed) in the toileting dept.
finally discovered she was intolerant to lactose and gluten. cut both out and she was fine. the soiling was the result of the faeces impacting in the bowel and runnier stuff leaking round it, which is why she couldn't feel it happening

do keep keeping on at the GP/paed all of you, this is a problem that no child should have to suffer with

The school nurse can really help with this and will refer your daughter. You can access them via the school reception if you are still at school or contact the local health centre, you may have to do some ringing about though, you don't need to say what it's regarding.

for FiveGoMadInDorset

I spotted you on another thread, and have a little experience in what you talked about, no idea if it's relevant, butI thought I'd stick my oar in, sorry to hijack, and I hope you don't mind me interfering.
I think you should insist that your dd is given Paediatric movicol rather than senna and lactulose, and start her on something like 4 sachets a day. The movicol draws liquid in to the bowel and makes the stools loose. It could take some time for your dd to unlearn the withholding, but she will once she has had a sustained period of soft stools.
The damp knickers could well be because she is afraid of going to the toilet because of her fear of painful constipation, and is also trying to withhold wee. So, hopefully sorting the constipation/withholding issues out will sort out the wee issues.
The movicol is not a quick fix, it apparently takes twice as long as you've had the problem to solve the problem! My dd was on movicol for a year. She is unfortunately prone to constipation so we need to keep on top of things like diet and fluid intake, but this won't make a jot of difference to you in the immediate term if your dd is withholding.

Sorry for waffling. I would really really reccommend this book.

Good luck