My daughter refuses to poo in toilet

[LuckyGoldDog]

Hi there
This is my first time using this platform but I have gotten some really good advice from mums asking similar questions over the years. So I am really hoping someone can help me.
I am really struggling to potty my daughter who is now 4.5 years old. She refuses to poo in the toilet, saying she is just 'absolutely not ready, but will let me know when she's 7'. She's had no issues going for a wee and hasn't had an accident for about a year now, but will only poo in a pull up.
We have tried using all sorts of rewards, showed her videos and books but we find if we push a bit too much she won't go at all and becomes constipated.
She did manage to do one at nursery a few weeks ago but only because she had no other choice. The nursery suggested refusing pull ups, which i did try by telling her that I can't get them from the shop anymore. She just became extremely distressed to the point where she almost made herself sick. So I gave in and told her I managed to find one.
I did see that some mums cut a hole in the pull ups, which I also tried but that also just made her very upset.
She told me the other day that she doesn't like the plop so I offered to put loo roll in before she sat down but she still said no. She then said she might go if I put a pull up in the toilet for her to poo into, when I explained that we couldn't she just said 'well, that's a problem '. We tried going back to an actual potty but she has really long legs and doesn't fit on it anymore.
This is becoming extremely stressful for me now as all her friends seem to be doing really well. Some mums are already talking about training at bedtime but I haven't even begun to think of that yet.
If anyone knows of something else I can try please can you let me know.

When you say she doesn't like the plop, is it the distance? The splash?
Could you just place the potty in the toilet bowl?

She just became extremely distressed to the point where she almost made herself sick.

And she realised that it worked.

Just take them away or make her clean it. She is old enough to speak so eloquently about it then, she is able to clean herself up. Tell her if she wants to poo herself she can clean it up.

Give her a packet of baby wipes charles, tell her to do it.And if she doesn't want to clean it, well, neither do you...

Yeah, you’re giving her way too much say! The teachers are going to hate her at school… sit down at story time… I don’t want to… I don’t want to hear a story…. I don’t care about anyone else….my needs are more important than anyone else! My mummy and daddy do what I want when I want.

I have severely disabled son but Christ I raised him better than this! Will you expect teacher to change her? Most kids are in school by that age. She is clearly articulate and ruling the roost. i hope she’s not in School

Thank you for the advice. I just needed reassurance that me wanting to take the tougher approach with her is okay. She is due to start school this year and i am incredibly stressed out about it. Other mums have made me feel bad about wanting to be firmer as the whole training experience should be seen as fun, which is why I have been giving in when she gets so upset.

There are a couple of horrible responses on here already. It sounds very much like the stubborness which is so familiar to me with autism and ADHD, or even PDA and you treat it with kindness and positivity as any sort of forcing only makes things much worse! She is having a difficulty and is not being bad or naughty.

Have you had any help from the GP? First of all you need to make sure that it isn't hurting her to poo. She needs help to not become constipated and sore.

My very normal 2yr old refused to poo on the toilet. It took such a long time for her to accept it and get on with it. She was normal and achieving in all other ways, she was potty trained from before 2.5yrs but just hated to poo on the loo.

We did insist. And had a long and complicated routine each time, that she needed. I just want to reassure you that it will pass.

We used lots of books about poo, and we insisted on the toilet, she knew she had no choice. We introduced a special toy that only appeared if she did one, made it a game, but we did firmly insist.

Eventually she made her peace with it. My eldest and youngest would poo without drama, it’s not something you’ve done, it’s just how she is.

Have you looked at a play therapist or child psychologist for her? They might be able to give you other ideas or get to the root cause. A friend used a therapist for her son with a similar issue and it resolved in a few weeks.

People saying go hard core and get rid of the pull up don't know your daughter as well as you do. I'd be asking advice from child specialist. I really hope it comes right. Once it clicks she'll be ok, it's just getting her to that place 🤗

I've seen it twice actually, and they were constipated because they were holding it in and because they refused to use the toilet. The more you hold it in the drier it gets, and the more backed up you get.

They Were stubborn held it in, and so got backed up because of that and yes, the gp said that.

You've got it the wrong way round.

f it hurts to take a poo, it's going to hurt whether or not you do it in a nappy or on the toilet. So that shouldn't make a difference either.

Add to that armchair diagnosis of autism... Is every child who doesn't want to do what they're told autistic?

Using the toilet is a lifeskill and telling your parents you're going to keep pooing yourself in a nappy, until youre seven is unacceptable, and you're not doing her any favours.

It's not actually bullying and brow beating a child to say calmly and in a normal tone if you want to keep going to the toilet in nappies, you're going to have to clean it yourself then.She's school age.

Put her in the bathroom, give her a changing mat and a pile of wipes and let her get on with it. I opened this thread.I thought it was going to be about a two to three year old, not a child who is eloquent enough to argue with her parents to that extent.

But you know, carry on your gentle parenting.Where you're not allowed to say a single thing to them in case you upset them and they are all autistic, of course or have pda. Excuses excuses excuses excuses.

DD said this and I just said "Oh I don't like that either but it's over quick and you wash you hands and forget it"
We all do things we don't like all the time, I found helping my child accept they had to do lots of things they'd prefer not to was part of being a big girl and getting all the big girl fun things :)

You've changed your tune from your first post. And I'm not a gentle parenting advocate, but someone who has had to seek alternatives and canny solutions when the child has not read the parenting manual or one child is very different from the other.

Yes tough love basically, she is completely capable from your post so time to bite the bullet. Make sure nursery is aware, and use whatever you have in your arsenal, complete bribery - what is her passion currently? I bribed one with mr men books and the other with cars, a friend bribed a very stubborn dd with Disneyland Paris, but do whatever it takes and if it sound related try ear defenders

By the way, because every child is different we need different approaches, and gentle is not a one size fits all approach

We have been told that she may have sensory issues as we had a similar problem a couple of years ago when she refused to have a bath. We were advised to see an occupational health therapist and they said we were doing everything right. They said in her eyes she saw being in the bath is the same as being trapped since she wasn't big enough to get out on her own. Especially since we were able to get her to go in the shower, where she liked to be close to the door. After some months she one day decided on her own that it was okay to get into the bath.
I don't like to force these big milestones on her and I think I'm starting to let my frustration get the better of me. I just can't think of another way to get her to poo in the toilet

We have tried bribery but she won't fall for it. I'm going to give tough love a go and hopefully get through to her.

This is a topic where an overly firm approach won't work because she won't be able to go and will get constipated, as others have said. For my son, covering himself up with loads of toilet paper helped (then reducing the amount of paper each time), but I think it was because being uncovered felt wrong somehow. We also talked a lot about the poos going for swimming lessons and diving in off the board. For your daughter it sounds like the problem is slightly different. I would be trying to work out how you can put the pullup into the toilet just to get her sitting on there and relaxing, even if there's a risk you end up having to fish it out.

I’m watching this with interest and sympathy - my 3.5 year old is a dream with wees but will only poo in a pull up. My next step is to get her the toy she wants and have it visible but inaccessible - see if some major motivation works. She says she just doesn’t like pooing on the toilet/potty, but can’t or won’t explain further. It’s really tough!

We followed advice from the ERIC website and I would recommend you do similar.

It was a long winded process that made me feel a bit mad at times but the absolute last thing you want to do is give your child fucking bowel problems and constipation for life because some posters here can’t find any empathy for a little kid.

https://eric.org.uk/children-who-will-only-poo-in-a-nappy-and-other-toilet-avoiders/

Thank you so much for this. There is a similar example on this site. Hopefully, it works.

@LuckyGoldDog It will. No NT child poos in a nappy forever!
It might take longer than is ideal, it might make you feel insane (I was cutting holes in quite expensive pull ups for a few weeks!) but you will get there.

You said she would go if the pull-up was in the toilet, well you could open up the pull-up (or use a nappy if you've got any around), open it up so it's flat, lift up the toilet seat put the nappy/pull-up on the toilet lying over the hole, then put the toilet seat down sandwiching the nappy down and she can then poo onto the pull-up - this avoids the drop/splash she maybe doesn't like. If this works, you can then transition to toilet paper at the bottom of the toilet.