Can't potty train / won't potty train

[notgoingpotty]

We've been potty training now 4 year old DC for over 18 months. They've been out of nappies since last Christmas I think so about 10 months, but still have accidents EVERY SINGLE DAY. Sometimes just once, other days 3 or 4 times. The problem we're up against is that they just have zero interest in not having accidents. They're not embarrassed, they don't seem to find it uncomfortable being in wet clothes, they don't care that it takes longer to clear up and get changed after an accident that just going to the loo in the first place...they just have absolutely zero desire to learn this skill. They very very rarely take themselves to the toilet - the times they use the toilet are when me, DH, teacher etc happen to remind them at the right time. But even when we do remind them, they often say they don't need to go / ignore the question, yet still have an accident moments later. I just don't know what to try next! Has anyone had similar with their LO? What did you try/ what worked?

Were they definitely ready to start? DD wasn’t ready to start till 3.5, and apparently boys can be later.

I wish I had the answer! We started potty training DS2 (then 3.5) at the start of the summer holidays. Exactly as you describe, no interest in learning, not bothered by accidents, fighting if put on toilet and then having an accident. I contacted Eric for some advice and they suggested constipation. I have a GP appointment on Wednesday. Meanwhile, I have put him back in nappies as the constant battle and neverending cleanups and laundry were starting to have a real impact on my relationship with him and my wellbeing. He now keeps asking if he will be in nappies again today (the washing machine broke shortly after so he thinks this is why he's in nappies again I think) and seems to massively prefer it. I have no clue what to do next or when to try again, as he is certainly old enough that he will remember this attempt. I feel like I am massively failing as a mum here, all the more so because every week brings another article about COVID babies starting school in nappies. His older brother was 2.5 and learned in about 10 days.

@AllTheChaos maybe not...it was a bit stop / start at first. So difficult to know what's for the best!

Ahh sorry to hear you're going through the same thing @Notparticularlywealthy ☹️ I too have an older DC who potty trained in about 3 days so I'm finding the difference between the 2 of them baffling. My younger DC started reception in September so no option to go back to nappies unfortunately (well perhaps I could for half term but would that be madness??) I spoke to the GP about possible constipation but they felt DC's tummy and didn't think it was that. Perhaps I'll ring Eric to see if they can suggest anything else!

Similar to the above poster, are you completely confident he isn't constipated? A full bowel can squish both the bladder (so it has a smaller capacity) and also the nerves (so the messages don't get through properly that they need to go)? It can also cause urge incontinence, so they can't hold it at all. Not seeming bothered by accidents can be a way of coping with something they actually have no control over.

Both Eric and Bowel and Bladder UK have helplines. Bowel and bladder is for adults as well, but once you call there is a menu option to say it's for a child, and they have pediatric continence nurses on that line. I've used both for DC3 and found them far more useful than my GP. Of the two I had more luck getting through to Bowel and Bladder UK.

It's baffling isn't it? I just do not understand how it doesn't bother them! I'd definitely call Eric, if nothing else it's nice to talk to someone who can give advice without sharing their own experience of potty training. I think that was why we stuck with it for as long as we did, the constant thought, "well surely it can't be that bad, maybe he'll crack it today??" which was definitely informed by well meaning comments from friends and family about persevering etc.

Wrt to school: if he needs nappies, he needs nappies. They can't argue with medical needs. Surely they'd rather change a nappy than a whole outfit and clean the floor? Have you sought medical advice/ contacted the HV/ GP btw?

I wonder if DC is neurodiverse. I have ADHD and difficulties processing bodily sensations (and therefore problems potty training) is a known thing with this. Nursery are concerned about his language and understanding but don't think he shows signs of neurodiversity. Aaargh, I just don't know! And there's me thinking my eldest was the one to worry about as he's so anxious and struggles to process his emotions🙈

Missed this!!! Thanking you!!! Eric were great a few weeks ago but I wasn't able to get through this week (I can only try one day a week due to work, and even then I have DC yapping in my ear😬) Will definitely try them this week!!! May I ask what kind of problems your DC had?

I suppose it's possible but they are pretty regular with the poos so don't have any classic constipation signs. Will try both helplines - thank you!

I'm wondering about neurodiversity too. TA mentioned about speaking with SENCO lead at school after half term so guess it's on their radar as a possibility.

The initial sign something was wrong was failure to potty train at just turned 3. We got him to the point he'd do wees on demand but wasn't self initiating them at all, or doing poos at all. It took ages to work out it might be constipation as he was doing what we eventually worked out were very soft rabbit pellets. The GPs started DS on movicol but it took a call to Eric to work out he actually needed disimpacting, and that turned out to be difficult, which is when I reached out to Bowel and Bladder. We eventually went private to see a pediatric gastroenterologist who identified the cause - food allergies causing gut dysmotility, constipation despite things being soft is apparently a big clue. It's complicated to manage as it's multiple foods, but at just turned 5 he is currently mostly there.

It's been a long and difficult journey though. Incontinence can be considered as a disability, and at its worst it certainly was life limiting for DS. There is also very limited NHS support, GPs don't seem to know much and waiting lists are bonkers. If your DC are at school but 4 you also fall into a weird gap where school nurses won't support as don't support until they are 5, but HV don't have a clue about school stuff.

We are in a similar situation. 3.5 yo out of nappies since the start of the year. Dc goes only if regularly prompted/physically led to the toilet. Can be a disaster at nursery in particular. We have been using movicol for a few weeks which has made pooing more regular but not helped with accidents.

Filled in a written form for eric and waiting to hear back. Would love to hear how everyone gets on. It's exhausting!

I would try a schedule of toilet time every 2hrs or so. Not asking but telling nicely that it's time to use the toilet. Maybe you go at the same time? And lots and lots of drinks to make lots of wee. Just to reinforce the habit of wee in the toilet.

Also does he help clean up? If he's too busy playing and just wees where he is and then you clean him/ everything up then it's not really inconveniencing him and you can see why it's easier than stopping and going to the loo. I'd be asking him to help clean up, wash him slowly, get him to fetch clean clothes and all the cleaning products for the floor. Not as punishment or in a "you've made a mess now clean it!" way. More just to make him realise 20 minutes cleaning up with you is less fun than 5 minutes in the bathroom and 15 minutes playing.

I had a friend who used a soap menu to encorage her dc when toilet training. They picked lots of fun soaps and then got to pick which one to use after using the toilet. Might help if that's the dort of thing he likes? She had glow in the dark, coloured one, foamy ones, glittery ones etc.

I would try a schedule of toilet time every 2hrs or so.

I am no expert but I know you can get a watch that will vibrate to tell your child it is time to go to the toilet.