has anyone started night training before having had dry nappies at night?

[CharlotteBronteSaurus]

dd is 4. reliably dry by day for a year.
potty training. before we trained she did not show many signs of readiness eg would not approach us with a wet/dirty nappy. however, she did really well, and it took about 5 days for wees, and 2 weeks for poos.

anyhow, she has NEVER had a dry nappy at night. they are always sodden in the morning. she wakes at 6-7, and then doesn't wee sometimes til 10am, which makes me wonder if she's weeing in her nappy on waking.

so i was wondering about having a 3 night nappy free trial? no pressure - back in pull-ups if wet. big chocolatey rewards if dry. has anyone tried this approach? I know the common wisdom is they will do it in there own time, but with day training she did need us to take the initiative.

leetle bump.
want to decide today as have got time to do extra laundry this weekend

Night dryness has nothing to do with being dry during the day. You cannot 'train' in the same way, as wetting while asleep is not under the childs control. Night dryness is achieved when a hormone is produced in the brain to slow urine production during sleep; this can happen at any time from 2yrs onwards, but up to 7yrs night wetting is still considered normal by the healthcare profession, so will not do anything medical until 7yrs.

The best thing is to wait. You can do some things to help such as

make sure dd drinks well during the day and limit drinks after tea time to water, no drinks during the night unless she goes to the loo at the same time,

no fizzy drinks (inc. fizzy water) after tea time, and no caffeinated drinks such as cola and hot choc, also milk and blackcurrant after this time as these all can stimulate urine production,

dd to go to the loo before bed and again just before going to sleep if there is a long time between the two, don't put pull-ups on until getting into bed,

wait until there are a few dry pull-ups in a row before going without, let her have a potty by her bed and a nightlight if this is easier than going to the loo in the dark.

Most children will become dry on their own, it isn't a process that can be hurried. It will happen eventually!

thanks for the advice girlywhirly. I am aware that a hormone is necessary, but could it perhaps be that this by itself is not sufficient ie a small degree of training might be required after development of whatever the hormone is?

and must we really not have bedtime milk?

Interested too Charlotte. Dd is nearly 4 but only just potty trained last summer, but being pg and now with a baby I could bear the though of being up in the night. She is never dry either but can't quite get from her when she is weeing.

Charlotte, some children are sensitive to milk, in that it stimulates the kidneys to produce more urine. There is the added problem of a large volume of it being consumed just before bed, which will be passed in the nappy during the night. The point is, that being well fed and hydrated during the day, the bedtime milk isn't really necessary, it tends to be something the child enjoys.

Drinking lots during the day stretches the bladder so that it can hold a good urine volume, important for when the hormone kicks in and reduced urine is produced, so that it can be held for many hours during sleep. Then the full bladder signals to the brain and hopefully wakes the child. The thing is, once the hormone kicks in and the urine production is less, the child still needs to feel the signals that their bladder is full. So drinking lots during the day and stretching the bladder will assist this. A child who is always thirsty in the afternoon and downs several drinks in the run up to bedtime will be at a bit of a disadvantage, in that they will wet not long after they have gone to sleep, and then again at another point during the night, possibly again just before waking.

You could feel inside her pull-up at intervals while she's asleep to see if you can ascertain when she tends to wet, or even how often. It may be that dd is wetting on waking because she has a pull-up, but it might be the fact that she is wetting as she wakes, or that causes her to wake. If by extra training you mean waking her to take her to the loo during the night, it isn't recommended, because you are teaching her to wee when woken, yes, but it won't teach her to wake herself when she feels the need. And sitting her on the loo while half asleep is even worse, as she is still wetting in her sleep which is not what you want.

I think making sure dd does a wee before going to sleep is a good habit to encourage, e.g. if she gets into bed and has a story or some other activity lasting more than half an hour before lights out, she should go to the loo before snuggling down.

thanks again girly.
by training, i just meant

1. more late afternoon and pre bed trips to the loo
2. not having a pull-up, so not feeling the safety net is there, IYSWIM and
3. a nice healthy dose of bribery positive reinforcement on the offchance that we get a dry bed

I can't see the point of "lifting". if they're not ready, they're not ready.

Yes, me. DD1 had been dry in the day for a good 6 months, but completely sodden in the mornings.

At almost 3 we decided to try getting her dry. Just took the nappy off and saw what happened. For a week it was limited success, half the time dry in the mornings, the other half very very soggy.

So I knew she was capable of holding it in all night - she was definately waking and then weeing.

On the advice from my mum I put a potty in her room - in a corner away from the bed and left a night light on.

Ta da, no wet beds ever since, and that was almost 3 years ago. She liked the security of knowing the potty was their should she need it. Got rid of the potty after 2 weeks as we knew she could make it to the toilet in the mornings.

Good luck - despite what others are telling you if she's holding it in until 10am some days I would say she's ready, just needs to be brave.
Others pop a nappy under the pillow - never intending to use it but it gives the child the security of knowing if they ever needed a wee they have it their.

Charlotte,

1. not sure about lots of pre bed trips to the loo, but make sure it happens as part of the bedtime routine. Going too often means emptying a part full bladder, not great for encouraging a good holding capacity. 2)if dd is soaked every morning without fail, you will just end up with a lot of laundry for possibly quite a long time. 3)praise when there is a dry pull-up, but I would be wary of treats and presents until you get to the no pull-up stage, when you could do a success chart, and after so many successes get a treat. Personally I'd reserve the treats for if you think she needs extra encouragement, or if there are a lot of relapses after lots of dry nights. I think you have to be very sure that a child is using the pull-up instead of the loo, and if you and dd have a trial run of say a week without pull-ups and she soaks the bed every night, clearly not ready it can be harder to withdraw treats once you've started them.

good to hear you cracked it, ilovejd. dd1 wants to have a go...

I have got 31/2 year old twin girls, one of them had several dry pull ups so we decided to try her without.

her twin sister decided on day 2 that she was not, under any circumstances, going wear a pull up if her sister wasnt, she had never had a dry pull up in the morning.

1 month on and the girl who had dry pull ups wets the bed aprox weekly, the girl that had never had a dry pull up has only ever had 1 wet bed!!

maybe not a very scientific experiment but does show it can be done without waiting for them to be dry, I can only presume she saw no point in holding on/ getting up with the pull up on! I have never lifted them and they have only once or twice got up in the night for a wee.

Give it a go!