Government drawing up plans to help relocate the unemployed

[fanjoforthemammaries7850]

Does anyone else find this a bit scary? Or is it a good idea?

toccatanfudge - yes, exactly those kinds of places.

"Their communities won't die, because there will still be people living in them."

exactly.

We are the sixth biggest manufacturing country in the world. Manufacturing no longer offers the kind of mass employment it once did. We need to find additional solutions. Keeping communities alive with state support, that could not survive without it is not sustainable in the long term, and doesn't help the people in those communities have fulfilling lives.

so what do you reckon - should we just let the town of redcar die a slow and paindful death and then just wipe it off the map now the last big employer has gone?

I don't think there are any palatable options. It IS going to die a slow and painful death. If it were possible that you wouldn't wait for it to happen you would wipe it off the map now. That is probably the best way to minimise suffering.

But it's not a solution that is going to be politically viable or acceptable to those who live there and have built there lives there.

So instead we have no choice but to prolong the agony.

• so you think it's acceptable to wipe off ex mining/manufacturing areas off the wipe rather than attempting to regenerate them?

You can only regenerate if businesses want to go there or if there is already places which can hire on mass there.

If no business wants to go there and no one is hiring then what else can you do whether you wipe or not the town will die

but they don't just die do they - look at all the ex mining communities, and ship building areas - many of those have been "dead" for nearly 30yrs and they're still there.

Whether is is acceptable or not is beside the point. It is inevitable. In some cases you might be able to regenerate them - and that would certainly be a good thing. But most of them are just simply in the wrong place, and there is nothing you can do about that.

30 years is not very long. Have they been nice places to live for much of that 30 years? Are they getting better or worse?

And is the population growing or shrinking in those areas?

Riven - No you can't, but equally people can't just stay where there is no work and no prospect of work indefinitely.

Population is still growing in many of the areas.

We're not talking about a few isolated areas - we're talking about vast swathes of some parts of the country.

We can just abandon those places and move everyone lock stock and barrel to the high tech parts of the country.

There are places in the North have undergone massive regeneration in recent years and are starting to thrive again.

Some of these places we're not talking about small mining villages - we're talking large towns

Over large enough areas you can hopefully get sufficent diversity and opportunity to do something. Cities and large towns have the depth of population and the breadth of skills to attract investment. But that isn't going to save all the communities, even where you do get regeneration.

If we didn't have the welfare state, a lot of these places would already have gone. But their going would have been pretty brutal. It's the law of unintended consequences - our laudable desire to minimise acute pain extends the chronic pain.

Exactly, dino! Several of the most deprived districts in the UK, with the highest unemployment, are in London, a place with so-called plentiful work.

[waits for someone to trot out the 'That's because immigrants do it as British think they are too good for these types of jobs' bollocks again]

Thats because the types of jobs available in certain parts of London tend to require certain skill sets/qualifications which many of the people in places with the highest unemployment do not have.

So jobs are available it's just that it is the wrong type of jobs for the local population there.

What are the jobs in London that are available but people can't do then?

bump

Anything temp, seasonal or under 16 hours/week is going to mean at the least debt and at the worst rent arrears/baillifs for most currently on JSA.

Because, depending on the council, the benefits are completely stopped from the first day of work, even if the pay doesn't come until a month later, meaning the HB and CTB stops, too, but the months' rent and council tax are automatically due.

The working person then has to re-apply for these and wait until these are processed, which, again, depending on the council, could be months.

Tax credits also terminate and you have to re-apply.

Then, when your temp contract ends, you have to re-apply for everything all over again.

If you are fortunate enough to be a council/HA tenant, there might be some leeway (of course, you'll likely also have to take out loans for essentials like food, electriciy and transport until you get paid).

But if you are in privately rented housing, unless you have magically managed to save about a thousand if not more, you will be looking at eviction.

You may also be looking at bailiffs and council demands for the full fiscal year's council tax.

And the GP surgeries, Riven, and other vital services.