Dave's cuts are going be deep and they will hurt

[FellatioNelson]

I've been hearing this all day on the radio. I can't take the suspense any longer. They are going to affect the lives of 'every one of us'

I feel like a person wincing and clenching my teeth in anticipation of the big fuck-off needle the school nurse is wielding, and I'm next in the queue....

Come on then, what's it going to be?

I'm saying that often talent and drive aren't enough to guarantee a good career, in some areas.

As far as I know the eu subsidizes the uk farming quite significantly. Or at least that's what's reported here in the continent.

You are also paying for diplomats children to go to International schools all over the world, but that's ok I suppose?

Xenia - I agree with you actually to a point, but I think you may have just said the insayable! I'm sure there is still room for greater social mobility but to suggest that anyone who hasn't come good just isn't up to it? Tsk Tsk!!!! We were aiming for 50% of kids going to university until 5 minutes ago!

It was the fonctionnaires and clerical grades threatening to go on strike if they didn't get their 8% that pissed me off, especially when countries like Latvia and Ireland have has to make swingeing cuts. It is also the waste in Brussels that irritates me and the 'non things' that the money gets spent on.

I think that French agriculture (and I understand that term to mean anyone with a lettuce in a window box can claim to be a farmer in La Belle France) is greatly subsidised by the CAP, and that Sarkozy said the CAP would be reformed over his dead body.

I don't mind dip or Forces kids going to International schools, but most of them go to schools to which everyone else can have access in theory. The European schools aren't available to everyone, there is a very strict pecking order.

Many diplomat's/forces children actually go to expensive boarding schools in the UK, funded by le tax payer! I know this is something the FCO (and I presume the MOD) are looking at but there often isn't much alternative. I was one of them and would love not to have been sent away to school!

fellationelson I think we should invite xenia for cocktails coffee we have the monopoly on saying the unsayable. I keep getting people assuming I'm taking the piss half the time.

. No I actually mean it

To pick up on Xenia,s last point...I think it's more that IQ that enables a person in life. I know some people with an average IQ who have done well for themselves, and those with a high IQ who claim benefits.

Emotional intelligence (or other factors in a persons life) contribute to whether a person ends up on the top of the social pile or the bottom. Not just intelligence.

St's point is good

HRP is attached to CB; unless they attach that to carer's instead i'd be stuffed!.

Xenia once we get to that point you will of course be right- it won't just be low IQ though, it will be people who are not amterialistic though (of course I admit having specialised briefly in Buddhism I probably have more direct ebcounters and therfore more obvious mindfulness of a quite rare sector)

However we will never achieve full social mobility for people below say 40; it can easily take until someone is that age to rework the effects of a bad childhood / restricted opportunities etc.

Well, obviously it won't happen anyway but YKWIM. before evern judging people with less luck earlier on would need time to redress.

And of course there will always be others nearer the lower strata income wise- part time workers. people in vocations, people who ahve had a carreer break for a number of reasons (parenthood, illness, caring resp). So it's perhaps a good thing it won't happen, othweriwse people will be judged for their validity by their job which would be awful. I certainly have at least as much personal admiration for a great nurse than a great sales exec earning three times more.

Riv, in fairness Xenia difd qualifyy that with her last line that we have not reached that stage yet.

I can provev that; being top of claa in my MA but unable to fund last part surely shows that is circumstance rather than ability getting in my way?

Riv, in fairness Xenia difd qualifyy that with her last line that we have not reached that stage yet.

I can provev that; being top of claa in my MA but unable to fund last part surely shows that is circumstance rather than ability getting in my way?

I often wonder if I'm bringing my son up right, to consider others, to share, to be honest. It seems that the most succesful people in life have to be pretty ruthless in order to get to the top. As it is, I don't necessarily judge financial wealth as the sole indicator of success.

During my career, I offered to give up my annual pay rise in order to enable my underpaid junior staff to benefit from a good pay raise and a reasonable salary. I had enough to get by on, as a single woman and they were paid a pittance. It didn't work. I didn't get a rise as agreed, the juniors got yet another insultingly low increase, my boss took the rest for himself.

I guess I'll never be a big financial success.

scaryteacher - "so every other member of HM Forces is a burden on the exchequer as well?"

I think the income that the Princes receive from the treasury, as well as the costs of security etc. might be a LITTLE higher than for your average helicopter pilot.

Xenia - the problem with assuming that social mobility will stop once you've had a period of perfect equality of opportunity is that you then end up with a new load of entrenched elites with an assumption that no one else has anything to offer and that they can be trusted to run everything. So you have to start all over again.

wubbly - please don't assume that all successful people are ruthless. And don't impress that on your DS.He might really fancy a career in the city or the law or in films or whatever

I know loads of lovely, yet,successful people in the arts and in business.
It takes drive, ambition, bags of confidence. None of those are bad charcterisitics are they?

I don't think all succesful people are ruthless, anymore than I think all unsuccesful people are kind and considerate. I do think that an element of entitlement and putting yourself first helps to get you to the top.

It is my personal experiences that have led me to believe this. I've sat in endless meetings where people with great responsibility pass the buck and blame others for their own mistakes. Call it the gift of the gab maybe?

Actually, the Prices are funded by their Dad via the Duchy of Cornwall, so no civil list money for them, and afaik the Duchy money odes not come from the Treasury. Security only necessary in civvy street, as not needed on a base really or when flying. I don't suppose Harry's personal protection officer went to Afghanistan with him, he would have been in the way.

Stranded at sea; being Forces from birth up I know all about Forces kids education - point being I don't mind paying for it when there is a continuity of education problem, and my ds benefits at the moment, but why are we paying for fonctionnaires kids when they have long term jobs in Brussels and do not have the mobility issues that HM Forces have?

Wubbly - I was just about to post exactly what Litchick has said. Nasty ruthless people do not have the monopoly on being financially successful - far from it. The bottom line is this - if you have a vocation or a creative talent you will get great job satisfaction from doing something you feel born to do, and you will make an adequate living or possibly more. Some people excel at creating money for others or themselves. It is just the way it is. It's not a crime! As I've said on here many times before, it's open to anyone who wants to have a bash. There is no private club, or special entrance criteria. If you go into nursing or teaching or the forces or local government or any of a thousand other things you many have a great career, and in many cases, a very respectable salary. But to make very good money you need to break out on your own with a good idea, alot of balls and nerves of steel. OR: you need to learn how to create money for a company, as an employee.

They are not bad people. Just people with a specific skill, is all.

to you he may appear and be lovely - but when he is at work that may be a diffent case altogether

Alouiseg I have just emailed you BTW!

Has anyone mentioned Prince William using a military helicopter to buzz Kate wotsit's parents on his way to a stag weekend on the Isle of Wight? I suspect that set the taxpayer back a few bob.

Someone at the time pointed out it would only have been a valid use of the chopper if Kate's parents had been armed with AK47s...

You see MintHumbug, I'm sure your friend is a lovely person, but they do sound rather ruthless. I simply couldn't imagine being prepared to sacrifice what I consider to be the most important things in life, my family and friends for cold hard cash. It just isn't that important in the scheme of things.

Nor would I particularly like to work for someone who didn't value those things as at least equal to money.

I am sorry to say this, as I have DS1 is at Uni but I would cut the number of university courses with Media studies at the heart.

IMO Youngsters would be better to run a farm, become a chef, do a degree in zoology or anything else to work in TV. I've heard that 40,000 people get a media studies degree each year but there aren't 40,000 new jobs in media each year. I think this is setting young people up for failure.

My mum told me there is a course in the news that teaches under 18s to strut catwalks paid for by the taxpayer. I'm all for life skills - I think everyone should learn NLP for free but NO WAY! I'm hoping this is just a daily express exaggeration.

seeking inspiration. I couldn't agree more.

So many jobs simply have no need for 3 years of study punctuated by obscenely long holidays.

Sadly the previous govt decided that getting the majority of kids to pay to go to university would be a quick cure all to clearing "dole" queues. Whilst simultaneously forcing them and their parents into a debt situation.

I really would like half an hour with Tony Blair and Brownfinger sometimes