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Original poster

Going into a care home? to pay or not to pay..?

86 replies

onebadbaby · 22/04/2010 21:19

Following the election debate- was just wondering what others think about this- conservatives are proposing that old folk pay 8k upfront now and then pay nothing if they do need a care home later, Labour propose wave the fees after the first 2 years, God knows what the Lib Dem policy is- they don't appear to have one.

I think I like labours policy best- it seems the fairest.

OP posts:

expatinscotland · 23/04/2010 15:16

I couldn't sell every single asset of mine and theirs to get my parents the best quality care I could, tbh, rather than sit around relying on the state to provide it (which they can't and won't) so I could get my hands on assets and money I did not earn.

To do otherwise I'd find unbearably shameful.

southeastastra · 23/04/2010 15:18

the older generation now were promised care from the cradle to the grave, i know times have changed but can't blame them for being lied to.

expatinscotland · 23/04/2010 15:19

I meant to say, 'I couldn't sell every asset of theirs and mine fast enough . . . '

Truly, I think many persons' expectation of getting an inheritance (obviously situations like yours are exceptions, pagwatch, and actually a failure of the care system for the lifelong disabled) and expecting legislation to safeguard that at the expense of the taxpayer an extension of the entitlement culture.

expatinscotland · 23/04/2010 15:20

'the older generation now were promised care from the cradle to the grave, i know times have changed but can't blame them for being lied to.'

Well, true, but you can't get blood out of a stone.

Sadly, these promises were made on the premise that so many didn't live so long.

No one could have foreseen that.

pagwatch · 23/04/2010 15:25

You are missing my point I think expat.

In my post I was talking about carers (like me)who have already given up substantial tranches of their lives, their income, their employment prospects and sometimes their pensions in order to care for a relative.

I do it happily and willingly.
But it is a little rough that I and others like me, who would hope to leave some property to their children ( in my case to help to fund DS2's continuing care after I can no longer do it) will be expected to sell their home.

The arguement seems to be aimed at very rich people passing on estates butthose most negatively affected will be people like carers... not the most supported group of people in the first place...

As for your 'shameful' example - well I am my sons carer and pay for my mums care . So I guess we have a similar attitude

pagwatch · 23/04/2010 15:25

Expat X-posted ...

expatinscotland · 23/04/2010 15:26

'But it is a little rough that I and others like me, who would hope to leave some property to their children ( in my case to help to fund DS2's continuing care after I can no longer do it) will be expected to sell their home.'

Not missing it, just haven't addressed it.

See a solicitor. You can pass it on to them and rent it back from them long before you die.

Aristocratic and landed families do this often enough.

The catch is usually that you have to leave at least 7 years between your transferring it and the Grim REaper for it to work properly.

expatinscotland · 23/04/2010 15:28

Last I was home, my mom actually got a lot of her stuff out, that's worthless to all but us, and had my sister and I divy it up.

That kind of stuff isn't worth selling, but we know better than to expect an inheritance.

If and when one of them dies, the other will get everything, and why not? I didn't have to be married to them for 46 years+!

pagwatch · 23/04/2010 15:29

I assume you have tolike and trust your children...

See we have been told for ages that we should be seeing a solicitor to find ways to 'minimise the impact of tax etc'.
Dh and I have always refused as I feel we should pay what we should pay and I have little time for loop holes.
But it does seem to be accepted, that the system suposes that people will circumvent.

[sap]

StewieGriffinsMom · 23/04/2010 15:40

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

expatinscotland · 23/04/2010 16:02

I'm in line to inherit a lovely collection of paintings by my mother, some brilliant costume jewellry, seriously vintage clothing and accessories (including luggage), and a very cool selection of rosaries and other religious ornaments.

As I live abroad, my sister will get any furniture, tools, cars, etc. left over.

Sounds good to me!

pagwatch · 23/04/2010 16:38

" No one deserves an inheritance"

um. As Ds2 will never be able to work I really hope that isn't true

pagwatch · 23/04/2010 16:39

at cool rosaries

I hope to have a few things that important religious people have touched that mum is holding on to ....

StewieGriffinsMom · 23/04/2010 16:42

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

pagwatch · 23/04/2010 16:47

Oh stewie.
I would love the community to sort out DS2s care when I am dead or dithering.
But based upon the last 13 years That Isn't Going To Happen.
He is in a fantastic school for which I am grateful every single day. But the rest of his care is down to us and always will be.

Dh and I save hard to try and leave enough money behind so that DS1 and DD can pay for what he needs when we are gone.
I would make a pact with the devil now if I could be sure that he will not be left to the vagaries of state support/care when I am gone

pagwatch · 23/04/2010 16:50

BTW
I am sorry if I am seeming a bit twatty talking about the position of carers. I know it sounds like I am invoking my situation which is specific onto a general issue.
But actually the position of carers is interesting to me and as there are
a huge number of carers it is not irrelevent

StewieGriffinsMom · 23/04/2010 17:28

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

Portofino · 23/04/2010 21:30

I think the trouble is, that at the time the system was set up, people tended to look after their own family. No one ever forsaw long term care home needs in the wonderful NHS - at least not for the majority of elderly people.

Fair enough, most people have to work these days. If you are not available to look after Granny and she needs looking after, someone else must be paid to do so. Therefore it is reasonable that if Granny has money, and you are not prepared or able to do the necessary, then the care home gets the cash, and not you. You can't have it both ways!

Portofino · 23/04/2010 21:34

The position of carers for CHILDREN though is totally different. It does sound as if there should be a way to make a legal provision in these cases. Something for a new MN campaign?

expatinscotland · 23/04/2010 21:36

True, Porto, and also, people didn't live so long as they do now.

Again, when the system was set up, I don't think it was possible to foresee so many living for so long.

gomez · 23/04/2010 21:52

Funding your own care gives you choice (as having money does in most aspects of life). We have some distant relatives who are in their late 80's/early 90's both frail and wandered who until recently lived at home with some support - which they have paid for, as I understand the LA provision was woeful. They now can't do that so have moved into residential care - an apparently wonderful twin en-suite room was all bells and whistles. If they had been dependent on Social Services providing this care they would apparently have been luck to be placed in the same home never mind the same room. Their house has just been sold for the cost of their care, monthly £3k I think. Their family are delighted. Money has given them the option of longer at home and a happier end to their days.

I know how I would prefer my parents and ils to end their days. And whilst it would be wonderful there is no way the State could provide this level of care for all.

alypaly · 24/04/2010 00:45

it is 7 years that social services can go back into a clients bank account and believe me every penny spent has to be accounted for ( hence 7 files over 5 years of heart wrenching....emotional timewasting).

On a previous point about the british emigrating for their retirement. I know alot of british people who have "emigrated" but dont stay out their the full 12 months so that they can come back for the NHS and i have also dispensed many a free 6 month prescription so that they can then take their medication to spain for the next 6 cosy months. PLease please....if you want to emgigrate dont hang on to our NHS ....if you choose a country where you have to pay,then so be it but please dont come back for free meds. best of both worlds comes to mind

SuziKettles · 24/04/2010 01:02

My grandparents went into a care home for the last 3 years of their lives because my gran had Alzheimers.

It was funded by their savings, their house and finally when all that was gone, the state paid.

It was a lovely place. They were as happy as they could have been somewhere other than their own home.

NO WAY would they have got in there if they couldn't have funded it themselves.

A friend was looking for a care home for her mother. Again, it was lovely. No smell of wee and stuck infront of MTV 12 hours a day on plastic chairs there. They needed evidence of at least £1 million in assets before they'd consider her - luckily her mother had a big house to sell.

Don't worry "scrimpers and savers". The poor will get the shitty end of the stick again. Your money will continue to buy you a better life.

MissAnneElk · 24/04/2010 07:47

longfingernails

I have only just come back to this after posting yesterday and just wanted to respond to your patronising reply. I do fully understand what an insurance policy is but I still fail to see how this will work.

Even if the take up rate is 1 in 5, and I suspect it would be higher (I've paid for it so I'll use it comes to mind) that £40,000 pot plus interest is not going to go very far if care homes currently cost up to £53,000 per year.

Original poster

onebadbaby · 24/04/2010 08:00

Well it looks like my parents will get the "shitty end if the stick" then because despite 'scrimping and saving' their assets are worth nowhere near a million!!! If there comes a time I am afraid they will be stuck in the state funded care home- but paying for it.

OP posts:

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