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Politics

Is this a conspiracy theory or is there something in it?

119 replies

Friendproblem123 · 01/03/2025 13:20

Someone I know who has form for conspiracy theories just sent me this (in response to me posting sympathy to Zelenskyy after the row yesterday.

can anyone in the know please shed any light on whether this is true please?

x.com/BGatesIsaPyscho/status/1895751157651251687

OP posts:
Friendproblem123 · 01/03/2025 14:40

Crichel · 01/03/2025 14:39

So just say ‘Do put a sock in it, Doreen — we’re just trying to have a nice time here, not be subjected to the rundown on your latest tin-hattery’.

Love it. I do need to grow a pair I know

OP posts:
SnoozingFox · 01/03/2025 14:42

Seriously. You don't even have to click on the link to see that any post from username "BGatesisaPsycho" is going to be ridiculous.

Letstheriveranswer · 01/03/2025 14:43

I listened to about half the video, most of what is said up to that point I believe to be generally true.

However I think the guy portrayed as speaking is being lip synced so who knows if it is what he actually said or not.

I think Russia's view of what has been happening is very different to the West's view of what has been happening. How the west looks from where Russia sits is very different to how Russia looks from there the west sits.
We see NATO as a good thing, but if you are in Russia with the US/Russian arms race history and hostility, it is not going to be seen as a good thing.

As with anything to do with international politics, there are many complexities and nuances.

Ukraine were not snow white in the lead up to the war.

However, a brutal invasion is a brutal invasion, that much IS black and white.

Corinthiana · 01/03/2025 14:44

SnoozingFox · 01/03/2025 14:42

Seriously. You don't even have to click on the link to see that any post from username "BGatesisaPsycho" is going to be ridiculous.

Indeed! 😂

Corinthiana · 01/03/2025 14:45

Friendproblem123 · 01/03/2025 14:40

Love it. I do need to grow a pair I know

True, but it's difficult, no matter how batshit. Good luck 😄 🤞

Letstheriveranswer · 01/03/2025 14:53

I do think it's generally safest just to avoid the political conversations with friends at the moment. I've tried to give a reasoned response to a couple of people who were raging about Trump's actions along the lines of 'Well, the outcome could be this or that, an alternate view is x, but ultimately we have no choice but to sit and wait it out.'

And had angry text diatribes back, with the anger aimed at me for daring to suggest we wait it out.

I also have a family member who is suddenly, out of nowhere, convinced that Putin is a really nice guy. All I can do is question where their sudden change in view came from, encourage them to self reflect on what influences them, not to go down internet rabbit holes and to read from a range of objective sources.

Like everyone I have many concerns but there is a lot going on behind closed doors of governments we know nothing about.

HauntedBungalow · 01/03/2025 14:54

Letstheriveranswer · 01/03/2025 14:43

I listened to about half the video, most of what is said up to that point I believe to be generally true.

However I think the guy portrayed as speaking is being lip synced so who knows if it is what he actually said or not.

I think Russia's view of what has been happening is very different to the West's view of what has been happening. How the west looks from where Russia sits is very different to how Russia looks from there the west sits.
We see NATO as a good thing, but if you are in Russia with the US/Russian arms race history and hostility, it is not going to be seen as a good thing.

As with anything to do with international politics, there are many complexities and nuances.

Ukraine were not snow white in the lead up to the war.

However, a brutal invasion is a brutal invasion, that much IS black and white.

I'd agree with that and also add that for Russia, NATO is the USA. And the USA is the only country in history that has used atomic bombs on civilians, before aiming nuclear weapons at Russia, and keeping them aimed at Russia for over 70 years. From that point of view it isn't even a question of good and bad, but about protecting your country.

Kendodd · 01/03/2025 15:15

I'm not going to click on the link. Can anyone explain quickly what it is?

AquaPeer · 01/03/2025 15:21

SnoozingFox · 01/03/2025 14:42

Seriously. You don't even have to click on the link to see that any post from username "BGatesisaPsycho" is going to be ridiculous.

The username is neither here nor there, it’s a real speech to the EU parliament by Jeffrey Sachs. It was broadcast at the time, and this is an accurate repost

AquaPeer · 01/03/2025 15:21

Kendodd · 01/03/2025 15:15

I'm not going to click on the link. Can anyone explain quickly what it is?

Google Jeffrey Sachs European Parliament and there are loads of links to his speech that aren’t x

HauntedBungalow · 01/03/2025 15:26

It's just a speech to the EU parliament by a US economic policy analyst. The full text is here.

https://johnmenadue.com/jeffrey-sachs-explosive-address-at-the-eu-parliament-sends-shockwaves-across-europe/

All the twitter user has done is add some graphics.

The speech is a (very) quick potted history of events leading to the Ukraine conflict and ideas about what to do next. It's not a conspiracy theory.

Circularmadness · 01/03/2025 16:19

The following is a link to an open letter signed by a large group of economists to Jeffrey Sachs, a Columbia University economist who is pushing the Putin's line on Ukraine. Sachs is a conspiracy loon and this letter debunks his claims

https://voxukraine.org/en/open-letter-to-jeffrey-sachs/

Friendproblem123 · 01/03/2025 16:39

@Circularmadness thank you so much!

OP posts:
Circularmadness · 01/03/2025 17:01

Aliceisagooddog · 01/03/2025 14:16

Jeffrey Sachs is 100% correct. Please don't watch mainstream media for the truth, you won't get it.

Sachs is a lying Russian asset. He is absolutely NOT correct in what he says

TheNoonBell · 01/03/2025 17:32

All true. Hope it has made a few on here look at things a bit differently.

TheNoonBell · 01/03/2025 17:34

Circularmadness · 01/03/2025 17:01

Sachs is a lying Russian asset. He is absolutely NOT correct in what he says

Which bits are wrong?

Circularmadness · 01/03/2025 17:47

TheNoonBell · 01/03/2025 17:34

Which bits are wrong?

voxukraine.org/en/open-letter-to-jeffrey-sachs

HauntedBungalow · 01/03/2025 21:42

@Circularmadness I'm sorry but I can't see where that paper - put together by a self-described "modern think tank that helps advance the modernization of Ukraine" - contradicts what Sachs is saying. It disagrees with his interpretation of events and views them from different contexts - sometimes wider, sometimes narrower.

But, nowhere does it say he is lying and it doesn't "debunk his claims ". That's not even what they say they're setting out to do. They themselves state that the purpose is to "address some of the historical misrepresentations and logical fallacies in your line of argument." Have you even read it? It's very interesting, drawing on history as far back as 1783 to examine the political conflict around nationality and ethnicism. But it isn't an exercise in debunking anything. Unlike you, these guys are debating.

nearlylovemyusername · 01/03/2025 21:49

I've never seen such heavy russian propaganda on MN as in the last few days, it's unbearable

HauntedBungalow · 01/03/2025 21:57

If you suspect propaganda, please report it.

Remember, not everyone will always agree with you.

DeadSpace3 · 01/03/2025 23:13

Friendproblem123 · 01/03/2025 13:20

Someone I know who has form for conspiracy theories just sent me this (in response to me posting sympathy to Zelenskyy after the row yesterday.

can anyone in the know please shed any light on whether this is true please?

x.com/BGatesIsaPyscho/status/1895751157651251687

Typical Russian misinformation. That's part of how Trump got the presidency both times.

nomoretoriesforme · 02/03/2025 01:07

HauntedBungalow · 01/03/2025 21:57

If you suspect propaganda, please report it.

Remember, not everyone will always agree with you.

Exactly this..

Sinuhe · 02/03/2025 01:24

I speak several languages, every time there is something fishy about a news item:I get the message: Due to geographical restrictions this item is unavailable.

Sometimes I am allowed to read / watch an item for a little bit before it's cut off.

Be wary, read up on your history (in the case of Ukraine & Russia) and take everything with a pinch of salt.

And don't get me started on the different perspectives things are reported, you'd be surprised how easily we are manipulated. Fact check or verify? Yeah right it's all about spinning a narrative to sway your opinion in the right direction.

Gosh, now I sound like a conspiracy theorist... but there is a lot of truth in what I have said.

Circularmadness · 02/03/2025 07:28

Sachs has appeared on state-controlled outlets like RT and Vladimir Solovyov’s show, platforms notorious for Kremlin propaganda. What he’s doing here is classic manipulation. He uses facts but they’re skewed

NATO's expansion was not a coercive act by the West but rather a voluntary choice by Eastern European countries seeking security guarantees after decades of Soviet domination. Countries like Poland and the Baltic states joined NATO to protect themselves from potential Russian aggression - a fear validated by Moscow's actions in Georgia (2008), Crimea (2014), and the current war in Ukraine. Framing NATO as the aggressor ignores the sovereignty and agency of these nations.

Russia's invasion of Ukraine aligns with its historical pattern of exerting dominance over neighbouring states, independent of NATO’s actions. Putin has openly lamented the dissolution of the Soviet Union and views Ukraine as a critical part of Russia’s sphere of influence. His 2021 essay on Ukraine's history made clear his intention to restore what he considers "historical Russia," regardless of NATO’s policies.

Suggesting that the US or NATO provoked Russia undermines Ukraine's sovereignty and its right to self-determination. Ukraine has repeatedly expressed its desire to align with the West, including aspirations to join NATO and the European Union. These choices reflect the will of the Ukrainian people, not Western imposition. Russia's response - an unprovoked invasion - violates international law and is ultimately a decision made by Russia, not NATO or the US

While Sachs criticizes the West for failing to implement the Minsk Agreements, the primary obstacle to their success was Russia's unwillingness to respect Ukraine's sovereignty. Russia armed and supported separatist movements in the Donbas while refusing to withdraw its forces, making genuine peace efforts nearly impossible. Blaming the US for this failure ignores Russia's role in destabilizing the region.

Diplomatic channels were not ignored. Western leaders engaged with Russia repeatedly to address its security concerns before the invasion. However, Russia's demands - including a legally binding commitment to halt NATO expansion and a return to pre-1997 NATO boundaries - were unreasonable and undermined other nations' sovereignty. Such demands suggest that Russia sought excuses for aggression, not genuine solutions.

Ultimately, Russia's invasion of Ukraine was a unilateral decision made by Vladimir Putin and his government. While geopolitical tensions and past actions by the West may have influenced the context, they do not absolve Russia of responsibility for launching a brutal war that has caused immense suffering and violated international norms.

Blaming the US for the Russia-Ukraine war shifts focus away from the core issue: Russia's blatant aggression and disregard for Ukraine's sovereignty. While it's important to reflect on how international policies can foster or mitigate tensions, this should not excuse actions that flagrantly violate international law and the principles of self-determination. Let's hold the real aggressor accountable and focus on supporting Ukraine's right to defend its independence.

Circularmadness · 02/03/2025 07:51

HauntedBungalow · 01/03/2025 21:42

@Circularmadness I'm sorry but I can't see where that paper - put together by a self-described "modern think tank that helps advance the modernization of Ukraine" - contradicts what Sachs is saying. It disagrees with his interpretation of events and views them from different contexts - sometimes wider, sometimes narrower.

But, nowhere does it say he is lying and it doesn't "debunk his claims ". That's not even what they say they're setting out to do. They themselves state that the purpose is to "address some of the historical misrepresentations and logical fallacies in your line of argument." Have you even read it? It's very interesting, drawing on history as far back as 1783 to examine the political conflict around nationality and ethnicism. But it isn't an exercise in debunking anything. Unlike you, these guys are debating.

The VoxUkraine open letter highlights Sach’s historical distortions, his neglect of Ukraine’s sovereignty, overreliance on Russia’s good faith, and alignment with Kremlin rhetoric. The most effective conspiracy theories often start with a kernel of truth—real facts, verifiable events, or documented oddities—because that’s what hooks people. A totally baseless story struggles to get traction, but something that sounds plausible? That’s the sweet spot. They take those facts and weave them into a narrative, cherry-picking what fits and conveniently ignoring anything that doesn’t. It’s less about outright lying and more about selective storytelling—omitting key context, exaggerating coincidences, or implying connections where there’s just noise.