Reform

[Soigneur]

Interesting article about Reform's funding. It seems that neither Nigel Farage nor the party's vocal online supporters are interested in putting their hand in their pocket and poor old Richard Tice has had to stump up for 80% of their funding. I really fail to see what Farage gets out of being the nominal head of this party, he seems completely uninterested.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/may/13/reform-uk-richard-tice-loans-party-funding

Ah well. Hopefully Richard Tice will run out of money soon.

Oh, I hope not, he seems to be splitting the right wing vote very effectively.

@Soigneur

It's a fallacy to think splitting the right of centre vote is a good thing. I want to see a strong mild conservative right. We need a coherent opposition to question and put up challenging arguments. When a ruling party is against a split ineffective opposition, they become dictators. We need a largish opposition. Be very careful about wanting any MPs from Reform. They will attract the far right wing and that's a very bad idea. We do not want those sentiments to flourish.

It's interesting that former Labour Brexit voting areas might be most likely to vote Reform. The Red Wall seats.

My manager used to be a Conservative Party member. He says he's voting for Reform this time.
I don't always agree with his views but he's a decent manager on work stuff and doesn't shove politics or his political views down our throats. None of us tend to talk about politics much at work. We don't want arguments messing up teamwork but it came up as someone asked him if he was still a party member.

He says he's expecting Labour to win and he doesn't expect Reform to get any seats but he's voting for them to give the Tories "a bloody nose". He's unhappy with the current Tories and wants them to lose then rebuild after this election. According to my manager, this is Nigel Farage's plan too.

No idea if that's true or if their plan will work.

I also agree with TizerorFizz about needing a strong opposition.

Reform voters are really the old UKIP types. They probably won't get any seats but they do attract the right wing that go too far. The big issue is that right of centre is being sidelined by people like Suella Braverman and Kemi Badenoch who are leading lights in pulling up the drawbridge politics. The slightly right of centre people like Ken Clarke are being pushed out and there are still Truss supporters about. Many mild Conservatives aren't standing at the next election.

I think Starmer will find he cannot do what Labour voters want as there's no money. He wants to grow the economy but no obvious policies. Reform have limited policies and voting for them because you don't like Sunak is right wing and flawed logic. So Sunak isn't right wing enough?

It is bad for democracy to have a government with a supermassive majority, and despite what the Tories think that is where we are headed.

Ideally the Tories would have two Parliaments' worth in the wilderness and use that time to realise that they need to move back to the right of centre ground. I disagree with most aspects of conservatism, but I'm perfectly capable of recognising that the old school One Nation Tories were mostly decent, capable, intelligent people who understood that the UK is instinctively somewhat right of centre.

The problem is that what we have now in the Conservative party is a bunch of right wing incompetent loons who have been promoted far beyond their competence. I don't see them having the sense to move back to the centre, and they don't have the people to do it with. I envisage schism in the near future - and I hope that there will be some form of phoenix out of the ashes manifestation of sensible conservatism, because a democracy needs a decent opposition.

I am scared of Farage and his ilk. His staged gentle buffoonery doesn't hide the fact he consorts with the likes of Steve Bannon and Donald Trump, and ascribes to their Project 2025 agenda (removing non-loyal civil servants, dismantling the security forces etc).

He claims outrage that Rishi Sunak could even think of leaving the D-Day event (massive cock-up on Sunak's behalf), which gets people thinking he's a decent patriot standing up for the people of Britain. The soldiers on D-Day were fighting to stop the rise of the far right, so why does this perceived disrespect lead people to vote for the far right, it makes no sense?

Like Trump, Farage says the quiet part out loud and a section of people like that he gives them permission to think those vile thoughts about immigrants, especially brown ones. They will tie themselves in knots justifying why, citing policy agreements, how they've been forgotten, the other politicians are all the same etc, but ultimately they forgive them anything because they don't hold the likes of trump or Farage to any decent standard of behaviour so can overlook their character flaws.

@siblingrevelryagain I agree. We need a robust opposition. Farage is all about Farsge but you have to understand that many voters aren’t deep thinkers. They are easily lead by a loud mouth. As Brexit showed. The turkeys did vote for Christmas!