Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Politics
Original poster

PM’s Wife

52 replies

Losingmyeverything · 07/02/2022 10:07

I do really feel for Carrie Johnson and the comments made in the press recently as it isn’t down to her what job her husband does, however I find this quote particularly interesting on the BBC website…

Her spokeswoman said allegations made by former Tory chairman Lord Ashcroft were "just the latest attempt by bitter ex-officials" to discredit her adding: "She is a private individual who plays no role in government."

-BBC News Website

How then can this be squared with the defence regarding the photos of Boris’ ‘work meeting’ in the garden where she was sat with him? I dont generally bring my DP along to work meetings and if she has no place in government then surely she shouldn’t be there.

OP posts:
TheWhalrus · 07/02/2022 10:50

Hmm, i'd say Carrie is definitely not responsible for her husband's moral failings.

This said, I think it would be naive to say she has no role in government. Several big decisions over the past few years certainly look like Carrie had a major role (Firing Cummings, hiring Allegra Stratton in the first place www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/dec/08/how-allegra-strattons-struggles-kept-press-briefing-project-off-air ) and I wouldn't be surprised if the Afghanistan doggie rescue wasn't her as well. And indeed, this does not stand up to scrutiny when Boris declares that many of his parties were in fact work meetings.

Finally, I would add that prime ministerial spouses having some sort of a role in politics isn't actually that rare. Theresa May, for example, used to discuss all major decisions (including the decision to call an election in 2017, with her husband Philip, for example). On the other hand, I don't think Samantha Cameron had much say in tory policy during the years her husband was in office (she was rumoured to be far more centrist than her husband, and may not even vote tory now). This said, if someone has a lot of influence, they probably should also be democratically accountable. I think Carrie probably has too much influence.

stairway · 07/02/2022 10:51

It’s hard to believe that Carry is with Johnson because she is in love with him. I suspect she was attracted by the power and ability to influence. We know that Johnson spends most of his time thinking about women and trying to keep his much younger newest squeeze happy has no doubt consumed most of his time and affected his decision making and ability to do his job. However clearly this is his fault and the people who voted for him knowing the person he is.

katienana · 07/02/2022 10:53

She already worked in politics. She would not have married BJ if he was say a postman probably not even if he was a rich lawyer. She's with him because he's a politician. She is very influential and the public has a right to know exactly what is going on in no 10.

CPL593H · 07/02/2022 11:13

@HalfShrunkMoreToGo

Ultimately she may be manipulative, a nag and trying to get Boris to do her will, I have no idea and I really dislike the whole Lady Macbeth 'evil women whispering in his ear' thing that's going on here.

BUT he is the leader of this country, he should not allow himself to be manipulated, he should not divulge any details to his wife that he is not allowed to divulge, he should maintain a separation between his work and his home life. That is HIS job.

If he is not capable of being professional (and I feel reasonably comfortable in saying that he is not) then he is not capable of fulfilling his role to an appropriate level.

Very much agree with all of this. Ultimately it is on him to ensure propriety, but as he seems to have little grasp of the concept generally, it is a big ask.
Original poster
Losingmyeverything · 07/02/2022 11:30

@HalfShrunkMoreToGo

Ultimately she may be manipulative, a nag and trying to get Boris to do her will, I have no idea and I really dislike the whole Lady Macbeth 'evil women whispering in his ear' thing that's going on here.

BUT he is the leader of this country, he should not allow himself to be manipulated, he should not divulge any details to his wife that he is not allowed to divulge, he should maintain a separation between his work and his home life. That is HIS job.

If he is not capable of being professional (and I feel reasonably comfortable in saying that he is not) then he is not capable of fulfilling his role to an appropriate level.

I completely agree. This is very much his job to do this.
OP posts:
FrontOfARobin · 07/02/2022 12:04

So you've changed your mind then OP?

ancientgran · 07/02/2022 12:07

@MajorCarolDanvers

I dont generally bring my DP along to work meetings

Most people don't live in their offices though.

I've worked in businesses where the boss lived on the premises. His wife didn't attend meetings even if we were in the garden, she might have been in the very big garden but she'd be off weeding or something.
ancientgran · 07/02/2022 12:09

I suspect the meeting in the garden was social not work but they used the excuse it was a work meeting without thinking about how it looked that she's sat right next to the PM. She's getting the flack that should be his for allowing the gathering, of course everyone at the gathering was personally responsible for breaking the rules so she's taking the flack for all of them.

Having said that I don't think she should have been sat at a govt meeting.

Original poster
Losingmyeverything · 07/02/2022 12:22

@FrontOfARobin

So you've changed your mind then OP?
No I didn’t give my opinion about her in the OP. All i said was surely she shouldnt be at the meeting and I agree the onus is on him to ensure that
OP posts:
stairway · 07/02/2022 12:35

Javid has stated that partners should be off limit for criticism as they are unelected. However surely we the public should be allowed to be both aware and able to criticise if someone unelected is having undue influence on the prime minister’s decisions, is calling it mysogeny a way of silencing criticism? I think so.

MarchFourth · 07/02/2022 12:41

'We the public' are aware and are free to criticize. Doesn't seem to be a problem there - we're doing that.
It seems like there's plenty of press coverage and Cummings stuff trying to shift the focus on to Johnson's Mrs and that does have a whiff of misogyny and it's good to notice it.

Original poster
Losingmyeverything · 07/02/2022 12:42

I agree. I’d say exactly the same if Nicola Sturgeon’s husband was attending ‘official meetings’ and having influence. Its nothing to do with her being female but again it is her husband’s responsibility to ensure she doesn’t have undue influence.

OP posts:
stairway · 07/02/2022 12:49

MarchFourth we are only aware of somethings due to leaks. We don’t really know how far her influence has been. It is ultimately the prime minister’s problem that he is easily influenced but how does one address this issue without mentioning Carrie.

MarchFourth · 07/02/2022 13:12

Quite, we don't know. Maybe she is an interferer, I don't know, but all we have is weasley leaks from the Barnard-Castle-visiting nutter. He seems obsessed and vengeful and similar to how the Morgan bloke is with Megan Markle.

MarchFourth · 07/02/2022 13:26

I don't know what I'm talking about though, I'm just speculating :)

KellyABC · 07/02/2022 13:27

It wasn't a work meeting.

bluechinavase · 07/02/2022 13:28

One of the key discrepancies in recent times from no. 10 is the redecorating of the flat. I would bet that Boris had no effing clue who Lulu Lytle was and if he was acting properly then he would be telling his spouse that there was a budget to be adhered to and not sponged off rich Tory donors to appease a spouse with expensive tastes. So generally I would agree that spouses should be off limits but if they are clearly in it up to their neck then sorry, it's naive to think folk won't have a pop at you.

MarchFourth · 07/02/2022 13:34

Yes, the amount spent on that was crazy. Offensive, really.

CandyLeBonBon · 07/02/2022 13:53

@MajorCarolDanvers

I dont generally bring my DP along to work meetings

Most people don't live in their offices though.

I sleep in my office. Does that count? Grin
Orchid876 · 07/02/2022 14:56

She doesn't deserve the stick that she's getting. That doesn't mean she isn't influencing him, she worked for the Conservation party, she obviously has a keen interest in policy so she probably is influencing him more than spouses have in the past. But that's because Johnson is a weak man, if he wasn't so easily influenced it would not be a problem. But he's the one who has been elected, if she's persuading him to rescue dogs from Afghans rather than women and children, the buck stops with him, the decisions are his. He's so demonstrably unsuited to leadership, I suspect anyone could persuade him to take their desired course of action without trying very hard. If it'll result in a easier life for Johnson, I imagine he capitulates every time.

Orchid876 · 07/02/2022 14:57

*Afghanistan

CandyLeBonBon · 07/02/2022 15:52

@Orchid876

She doesn't deserve the stick that she's getting. That doesn't mean she isn't influencing him, she worked for the Conservation party, she obviously has a keen interest in policy so she probably is influencing him more than spouses have in the past. But that's because Johnson is a weak man, if he wasn't so easily influenced it would not be a problem. But he's the one who has been elected, if she's persuading him to rescue dogs from Afghans rather than women and children, the buck stops with him, the decisions are his. He's so demonstrably unsuited to leadership, I suspect anyone could persuade him to take their desired course of action without trying very hard. If it'll result in a easier life for Johnson, I imagine he capitulates every time.
Exactly this. I agree that the whole 'lady Macbeth' trope is a lazy attempt at blaming her but she is not apolitical and has taken an active role by Boris Johnson's side both as his wife and as a media official.

I think she deserves some scrutiny just as Dominic Cummings did.

She is not a passive partner with a separate career, she has actively involved herself in wider Conservative party affairs and as such her involvement is potentially less benign than other spouses have been.

GrendelsGrandma · 07/02/2022 16:05

Nah, fuck that. She got heavily involved and has brought loads of her mates into important roles. She had a party when Dominic Cummings left because it meant she got to hold sway. She got the No 10 flat decorated by dodgy Tory donor money.

If she didn't want to be drawn into publicity, she'd have played it like Sam Cam and kept to her job and the odd photo shoot with worthy causes. She wouldn'd be holding parties in the Cabinet Office and joining work sessions in the garden or whatever other bollocks they try to fob us off with.

She's in PR. She should know that if you put yourself in the public eye, people are going to make their minds up about you.

SantaClawsServiette · 08/02/2022 22:44

I always assume that the spouse of a PM or party leader for that matter will probably have some real influence on her (or his) spouse. Maybe even more so if the PM is not a jerk and respects his wife. (Where does that leave BJ, ?)

I guess if I thought a leader would allow that to be an undue or inappropriate influence, or that the spouse was a complete loose canon or whatever, it would mean I would not want to vote for that person. I can't say that CS has struck me that way though I don't like her much for no particular reason - she just rubs me the wrong way.

Curiousmouse · 08/02/2022 22:48

I'm really sure Johnson was the one who was really desperate to raise the interior design cash. Not.