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Politics

Corbyn and the Labour Party

21 replies

littlebillie · 20/03/2018 06:38

Corbyn seems to be able to say what he likes especially over Russia and the party has a completely different view. Are we to assume he is pro Russia from his recent narrative?

OP posts:
meditrina · 20/03/2018 06:55

He's been pro-Russia all along, hasn't he?

This really shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone.

What has changed - if anything has - is the level of realisation of what a pro-Russia stance might mean in practice.

(Following some of the Russian rhetoric about 100% certainty, I was reminded of the antivaxxers who claim they won't use anything that's not 100% safe. Those are rhetorical devices, not good arguments)

littlebillie · 20/03/2018 07:39

He is not in the party control

OP posts:
SoloD · 20/03/2018 12:24

Corbyn has a very odd relationship with Russia, I mean he blamed NATO when Russia invaded Ukraine. Saying that

"Ukraine has been put under enormous pressure to come into the EU and Nato military orbit", but failing to mention it was put under pressure by its own people who were fed up with the horrific corruption.

www.ibtimes.co.uk/jeremy-corbyn-putins-latest-useful-idiot-europe-1515028

Heyduggeesflipflop · 15/04/2018 13:16

More from corbyn here

What he reallly seeks is a. A way to make himself seem relevant and b. A way to make sure the uk rolls over in future when his Russian friends demand it

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/syria-crisis-latest-air-strikes-bombing-attack-jeremy-corbyn-theresa-may-war-powers-act-parliament-a8305411.html

counterpoint · 15/04/2018 13:46

Corbyn is pro peace.

Putin has been very amenable to discussing world matters but idiots like Boris&May would rather keep selling weapons to the Saudis and Turkey and hence keep fuelling wars.

caroldecker · 15/04/2018 13:47

Dear old Diane Abbott couldn't bring herself to say that Russia was a bigger danger to world peace than the US.

Heyduggeesflipflop · 15/04/2018 14:35

Counterpoint,

‘Corbyn is pro peace.

Putin has been very amenable to discussing world matters but idiots like Boris&May would rather keep selling weapons to the Saudis and Turkey and hence keep fuelling wars.’

No - corbyn is pro dithering about and blaming everyone except his friends the Russians

And the Russians, incidentally, have vetoed un action on Syria a total of 6 times. Over the years they have also ringed Syria with sophisticated air defence systems to protect Assad and his murderous regime.

counterpoint · 15/04/2018 16:04

Russia is an ally of Syria and has every right to be in Syria as it was asked to be there by Assad. It has every right to veto when faced with invasions from the UK and USA. Vetoes are used all the time not just by Russia, as we jolly well know.

We were not asked to intervene in Syria, hence we are actually war criminals.

The bad guys in this are us! (Well, actually Boris&May as I didn't vote for a Tory and nor did the majority of the UK. Nor did she seek Parliamentary approval!)

And Corbyn is not to blame for wanting to give peace a chance. Nor is Putin to blame for being in Syria since he was asked by its legitimate government.

We are in the wrong here. We are on the wrong side - the side with the Saudis and Turks and with their Islamic factions that should have nothing to do with the UK.

Heyduggeesflipflop · 15/04/2018 17:11

Counterpoint (or should I call you mr v putin of the Kremlin) - stop drinking the Russian kool aide and keep taking the medicine

The prime minister is not required to seek parliamentary approval. She did nothing wrong

Your Russia admiration is at a worrying level.

Corbyn is indeed masterful - at achieving very little as evidenced by his ineffectual years as a backbencher. Even now he is little more than a grandfatherly stooge for the rather menacing (like McDonnell) waiting in the wings behind him

counterpoint · 15/04/2018 17:22

That's your response? A playground jibe? Do you now expect me to call you Boris Johnson? Or maybe you're his sister? Or maybe you're his brother? Or his dad that's been the media darling singing Boris' praises too. What a lot of Boris bores!

Bejazzled · 15/04/2018 17:24

Gosh that descended into personal abuse quickly. Some people can't take an opposite opinion.

Corbyn isn't pro peace, he's anti British and pro communist.

counterpoint · 15/04/2018 20:01

Corbyn isn't pro peace, he's anti British and pro communist.

What century are you living in?

Heyduggeesflipflop · 15/04/2018 20:56

Counterpoint

Fortunately we are in the 21st century having left behind the communist Stalin’s and maos of the 20th and all the death and cruelty they brought.

Unfortunately corbyn, McDonnell and all their momentum acolytes are trying to bring such days back. What century indeed!

Hoppinggreen · 15/04/2018 21:02

Corbyn was asked how he would deal with Russia over the Skripal poisoning. I listened to the radio interview.
Corbyn said he would write a robust letter to Putin asking him about his record on Gay rights
Corbyn has never had an actual job where he has needed to lead or achieve anything. He has been in The Public Sector all his career dealing with people similar to himself and has no clue how to deal with difficult issues other than sitting down to discuss it over a caffeine free matcha latte and a vegan brownie
Diplomacy is the best option but sometimes you need to show your teeth and Putin and his ilk probably find Corbyn laughable

Hoppinggreen · 15/04/2018 21:03

I would also like to point out that left wing does not necessarily equal benign
Left wing oppressive regimes have murdered as many as right wing ones but it’s still acceptable call yourself a Communist

caroldecker · 16/04/2018 00:48

Hopping I think the word is more, as in Communism has killed more people, deliberately and accidentally, than any other regime.
That also excludes Hitler, who was a National Socialist, and who's policies were very similar to Communism.

lucydogz · 16/04/2018 13:23

caroldecker my DH is Labour, but still astonished at how badly Abbott came over in that interview

Heyduggeesflipflop · 16/04/2018 18:02

Hoppinggreen

That’s a really interesting point - a colleague of mine often makes quips about his politically active wife being a full blooded communist.

Yet I can’t imagine anyone ever saying their significant other is a full blooded fascist in the same way

Heyduggeesflipflop · 16/04/2018 18:07

Interest article in the independent (a paper which to my mind usefully gives corbyns labour a pretty easy time)

The thrust is basically that he has never supported intervention - even where it has saved life and so he isn’t principled, just a zealot

www.independent.co.uk/voices/jeremy-corbyn-syria-strikes-oppose-theresa-may-military-action-vote-parliament-a8306666.html

Hoppinggreen · 16/04/2018 18:45

heyduggee
I did Politics at Uni many years ago and at the beginning of the course one Lecturer asked us for a list of Extreme Right wing regime “attributes” and then asked us to cross off any that couldn’t apply equally to Communist regimes - there were few if any.
I think it really shocked most of us right on 18 year olds who assumed Right wing =evil and Left wing = benign
The Lecturer suggested we stand up in the bar that evening and some of us announce we were Communists and the rest announce we were Nazis and see what reaction we got
I am of course neither but I find it very interesting that many people attribute different motivations for similar actions to groups on different sides of the political spectrum

Heyduggeesflipflop · 16/04/2018 19:14

Hoppinggreen

Interesting post - I wonder why communism isn’t perceived the same as fascism. Perhaps it’s because a great deal of western tradition is built upon the great victory over fascism in world war 2 whilst communism happened to those much further east and so is forgotten

I wonder how former Soviet countries feel about communism now. Your experiment might be worth trying in Eastern European countries - maybe you would get the reverse reaction!

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