Scotland's new income tax!

[mummyhaschangedhername]

Was this expected? What the general feeling about this?

The SNP are also plans to axe charity rates relief on private schools, landing them with a massive rates bill.

Now the reverse snobs might say "what's the problem", seeing it as another tax on the rich but many pupils at theses schools are either of scholarships (full or partial) or have parents who go without so send them there (DH being in this bracket).

It's a very badly thought out policy. Fees will likely rise as a result, placing it outwith the reach of parents on modest means - this will lead to a large number of children being withdrawn and out public school system, which is already crumbling, cannot cope with taking up the slack.

If the money from private school tax change is used to improve the state school system then I don't see the issue. It shouldn't be the case that you get the education your parents can afford but I do understand that after years of underfunding and cuts, the state schools are struggling.

Fairfax so you think it's fair and equitable that state schools have to pay rates, but private schools don't.

Given the choice of a doctors job in a hospital do you pick Scotland and be about £1000 a year worse off or England.

The NHS is in a better state here though. Doctor friends on my Facebook feed have all welcomed this as some of the money is set for the NHS.

cd - oh you're right, that was a shambles. However, it was caused by computer problems (not by ministers actively trying to get out of paying it) and there was a loan system set up to help farmers who were affected. Also the SNP apologised. It's not like they're sanctioning the farmers on purpose.

What 'powers' would they use to sort that out, as you suggest? I wanted to know what powers the scottish government have that they're not using to help the Scottish people, that you keep mentioning. Perhaps in this case it would be keeping us in the EU...oh, wait. Are you saying that farmers and their families are dying because they're not getting this payment on time (even though they can access a loan because of that)? Perhaps leaving the EU is not such a great idea.

But I am getting off the point. I am happy with the new income tax proposals. Also happy about the private schools paying rates since state schools already pay those, as itsall mentioned. And Fairfax, if this results in a large number of children being taken out of the private school system then this isn't all bad, surely - those children will enter the state schools, and their parents will have more money thus not going without. Those parents are invested in their childrens' future and that sort of child going to a state school will raise its standards, isn't that likely? I don't have experience with private schools so I am ready to be told that's rubbish, but the secondary school dd will go to next year is a good state school, has a good reputation, and the area is mixed - poor people and wealthy people all send their kids there.

Calyx I don't for a moment think you are lying, and I am shocked that the banding puts them below the average UK wage (depending on which figures you use). I do agree that missing breaks and holidays is wrong, and higher staffing levels are needed. Not sure that the SNP will use any additional monies raised to fund that though, as it will more likely go on their vanity projects and independence campaign.

You did, however, include yourself as being underpaid when you are paid more and can manage, so that was a little incongruous. The ironic thing is that your colleagues may be slightly better off from the tax changes, but you will possibly end up paying more tax depending on where you are in the band.

Let's just see how many more people take tax mitigation measures to avoid paying the extra tax.

many pupils at theses schools are either of scholarships

I think many might be an exaggeration. Some.

SNP are chasing votes and do not care that they are wasting money on baby boxes..... and a whole host of other things.

The removal of charitable status from private schools is not going to miraculously improve state schools, it will place more burden on them as people cannot afford to then send them to the private school. The families of those who go to private school already pay more tax (based on their earnings) and contribute to state schools, hospitals etc. It’s not like they get a refund on opting out of the state system.

SNP are all about independence and to hell with the consequences.

username, Calyx mentioned that she 'has no children and is coping', not that she is paid a fair whack and is therefore ok. As for tax mitigation measures to avoid the extra tax, I think that would be a bit much, given that the people who are earning most are being asked to pay just a little bit more, not a massive percentage jump or anything.

I’m happy to pay more. Earn over the £33k but aware most people earn under it so happy to pay more than them.
Happy to pay more than down south even if just for the free tertiary education (though prescriptions also).

Oh and I think private schools private nurseries and state schools should all pay the same business rates. It’s not “penalising” private schools - it’s equalising the situation.

Surely private schools are more able to pay a rates bill as they have more money anyway?

And I’m not a snp supporter but when half of parliament shouts “you’ve gone too far” and the other half shouts “not far enough” then I reckon you’ve probably done just right

Trickle down economics was never happening in Scotland. The economy is skewed towards the public sector already.

As for council tax - it was frozen for years. If you want better services most people will have to pay more tax. There aren't enough really high earners.

And if you tax very highly at the upper end a few unforeseen things will happen whereby peopled rearrange their payment or location: the usual end result will be a drop in tax take!

I think the current plan is conservative enough NOT to have those effects but time will tell.

usernamealreadytaken you may not feel underpaid but as a public sector worker your pay has been frozen which means a decrease in your actual income year after year. It’s not really what you expect is it? It would take a substantial increase to even get thinks back to where they were before.

If government remove incentives from private schools their influence over those schools end. So it won’t be fee payers that are removed but bursaries (some schools fund 20% kids with bursaries)

Isn't it the case that where we were before was an overpaid public sector. Not everyone in the private sector gets pay rises either.

Username my honours degree was in 2006 and I had done a year's access course to get on to it so 5 years of classes (working 2 part time jobs after hours to pay rent and food). No wage rise and inflation rising year on year. It's been effectively a pay cut every year since austerity started.

I am managing because I am band six and childless. My partner helps with Christmas etc. I still think I am 'underpaid' as is everyone else on my grade and especially under it.

I am glad that the income tax changes are coming in because they are progressive and show priorities which I am happy with. I look forward to getting a (still under inflation) wage rise.

On a side note I cannot wait until Scotland is independent.

I know people who have left already - if you work in software you can be anywhere. I will give one example I know personally - his employment is through and Edinburgh office with an English company but he moved to Madrid. Same job, just Spanish taxes.

Primal I said either on scholarships or have parents who go without to pay fees (ie on modest means).* Please don't quote half my sentence to try and reinforce your point of view.*

My point is that at many of the private schools (as not all are the Eton's or Fettes of the world) have a high proportion of pupils who are not really, really rich.**

Parents of private school kids are paying twice - once through taxes for the state system that they are not using, and once for their fees (and uniforms etc all of which have VAT)

DH was written off by the state system due to mild learning difficulties. He is only where he is, and paying more tax because he's in a higher paying job than he would have otherwise achieved) because the support in the private system is far superior to that in the state (who refused to recognise the professional diagnosis).

His DSis is also paying more tax as a result of the private school system, coupled with this SNP tax rise.

Do you agree fairfax that someone has to pay higher taxes? And if so, them surely that should be those who earn more money - for whatever reason or by whatever means? As I said before, it's not a massive amount more and the system is progressive and fairer imo.

Nyx it might seem fairer to you, but these people already pay more. People are already paying over 50p in the pound in tax.... At what point does it become unfair?

I agree higher earners should pay higher rates of tax than lower earners.

There isn't a 50% tax rate in Scotland Lichtie. The highest rate was 45% and it's gone up to 46%. That's for people earning over £150,000.

Given the choice of a doctors job in a hospital do you pick Scotland and be about £1000 a year worse off or England?

I think, as many are already doing, I'd choose to work where I would have more resources, not be afraid of ending up a Virgin employee, and be allowed to look after my patients. NHS Scotland is seriously stretched and underfunded, but my sister's English oncologist and neurologist both tell me she is getting far better treatment than she would if she lived south of the border.

I'm not a fan of the Gaelic signage (I come from a place where Norse is closer to the language than Gaelic) but can't get excited about it.

And probably worth saying I'm in the Labour Party, not an SNP supporter but I do admire some of the actions they have taken (just wish they went further).