Let's give Polly Toynbee the Britain she wants

[ariadneoliver]

blogs.telegraph.co.uk/finance/timworstall/100016459/lets-give-polly-toynbee-the-britain-she-wants/ Interesting take on the 'we must be more like Scandinavia' meme.

Good article. I look forward to the responses from the left.

Polly Toynbee, over inflated windbag.

Excellent article.

'We should copy the Finnish education system, for example ? it is, after all, the number one such system in the world. There they divide into academic and vocational at 16 and there's none of this nonsense that all must go to university ? that's reserved for the small fraction that are indeed academic.'

that sounds eminently reasonable to me

'From Denmark we'll take a couple of policies. Privatise the ambulance and fire services certainly. They've been working well there for nigh on 90 years.'

how does that work in practise?

Amen to that - Tim Worstall is a genius.

Don't see what's wrong with the education ideas. He's obviously picked and chosen taxes from different countries- basic rate income tax in Sweden is 15%, not the Danish figure, and if taxes are collected locally that is effectively the same as income tax. The Tories are in fact supposedly all about local control of services so that's more Tory than Toynbee. Systems work as a whole, if you pick individual bits of the worst of each obviously that is not going to end up the same as the whole system of the best ones. It's lazy, disingenuous political commentary at best. If he's a genius, so is the average potato.

I agree with Trilobiteontoast.

All Scandanavian countries excel educationally, they have a higher standard of living, there is more equality, people are more engaged politically, they are far more community minded, they have higher levels of trust, and by and large they have far higher well-being.

I have been a regular visitor to Denmark for the past 30 years and have family living there, and have friends in other Nordic countries.

Denmark is an organised country, but of course it's less than a 10th the size of the UK. It's much easier to manage a small country well.

BDonna, could you enlarge on his claim 'From all of them we'll take the abolition of the national minimum wage, for none of the EU Nordics has one' please?

(I'm wondering if it's safe to assume that the reason they don't have one is because employers pay a decent living wage without the need for legislation to force them to do so? )

Ponders, I believe that a high percentage of the Swedish workforce belong to a union - something like 75% of workers - and minimum salaries for specific jobs are established through collective bargaining.

Thanks, Disputandum - so there are minimum wage agreements, just not a national one.

What happens with the 25% not in unions though, do you know?

I think the other 25% are at the mercy of unscrupulous employers, as in many other countries, Ponders. My friend works in a restaurant for 50krona per hour (about £4.50 I think) and is on the breadline; he is expected to make this up to a living wage with tips. I've never been but he says the cost of living in his city is similar to London.

oh dear, poor bloke

I believe there are still employers here who do that, even with minimum wage legislation, eg when employing immigrants without proper legal status.

There are others though who definitely would if they could, but are prevented, thank god.

Tim Worstall is a massive bellend whose idea of taking in a broad range of economic views is attending a wine and cheese party at the Adam Smith Institute.