A Working class Mumsnet proposed!

[madhattershouse]

Frank Field has proposed some ideas for removing poverty by means other than just financial. One proposal is the setting up of a mumsnet type site for the working classes. Isn't mumsnet meant for all or am I missing something? Are the working classes really needing this or is it a gimmick? article [[http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2010/dec/03/frank-field-welfare-sacred-cows
here]]

Some people get Botox for migraines. Will they be denied access?

Actually, I will revise my message above and say, what a cunt Frank Field is!

'"By the age of three, a baby's brain is 80% formed, and his or her experiences before then shape the way the brain has grown and developed.'

BULLSHIT!

Neuroplasticity

Where do these people come from?

I agree that one of the great strengths of MN is being able to talk to people whose paths I might not otherwise cross.

If I have a 2 month old screaming down the house at 2am, I want to talk to other people who have experience of colic and it matters not what class they come from.

And it seems most people don't really know what class they belong to anyway.

DownyEmerald there is a survey from 2009 here.

Looking at that, the vast majority of us seem to have above average household incomes (compare with here), and are educated to at least degree level, so if somebody wanted to use those as simplistic indicators of class then yes, I'd say we're middle class (we also seem to be overwhelmingly white).

However, MN is open to anyone and I don't think the answer is to create a special MN-style site for 'poor' people - how patronising is that?

zapostrophe I don't know whether your suggestion was serious but actually I would appreciate some discounts from some less 'aspirational' brands and perhaps it would make the site more welcoming to those on lower incomes.

I'm with you, OP, I think this is just another way to blame the poor for their own misfortune.

What a wanker!

BTW, what's this thing about kitemarking kid's TV programmes for speech development? I thought they decided that TV is no good for these skills because it doesn't provide any feedback

I can't claim to be working class, but have disliked Frank Field for a long time - he supported the last Tory government's attacks on single mums (the Child Support Act) even though he was meant to be against child poverty (Child Poverty Action Group).

Then there's Nadine Dorries, the Tory MP who suggested a few weeks ago that anyone disabled who can send a few tweets on Twitter is clearly capable of going out and getting a job.

earwicga

From your link:

"According to the theory of neuroplasticity, experience can actually change both the brain's physical structure (anatomy) and functional organization (physiology) from top to bottom."

I think the crucial word is experience. Of course if you take a very deprived 4 year old and give them intense support and enrichment - it should be possible to change their brain's structure.

But it's still better to get is right in the first place - no?

What wi this website do? How will it help families with both parents working shifts, struggling to pay mortgage/heat homes?

Not everyone working class is on benefits. There are plenty who are, right now, out in the snow gritting roads, recovering broken down cars and treating people in hospital.

How is a stupid fucking website going yo help them?

Maybe you should look at giving back the benefits you took away Cameron, you upper class patronising cunt.

The early years are formative, when all the wee neural pathways are formed. Brain plasticity is a result of conditioning - like a muscle that is continually worked. I remember certain elements of my job required my brain to work in a certain way and it was a bit like flexing a muscle.

The early years are very important which is why pre school education is instrumental in raising achievement later in life.

Not ghat many needy kids will be getting it is Cameron gets his way. But hey! Parents can log on to some stupid fucking website instead!

Grrrrrrrrr

Surely the USP of Mumsnet is the level of intelligent discussion found here. Obviously there are plenty of posts on superficial topics, but I've been exposed to so many new ideas here. Thoughtful and articulate people of whatever class will feel at home on Mumsnet, others won't. I don't understand how you replicate Mumsnet for whatever group of people without that central theme.

WHAT!???

So working class people are somehow not considered able to take part in this site?

On what fucking basis has this prick made this anouncement>?>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>??????

I am working class and feel very at home here, thanks!

I'm getting a 404 Page Not Found on that link. Anyone else?

Hmm, yes...

Try this

Heheh- I was just reading this article and had to stop dead at that line "A working-class version of Mumsnet, the online forum for parents."

Isn't this NM? Well we know what kind of parenting advice they gove out.

UQD- guardian site is having terrible problems atm- they are supposedly runnung a live Q&A with Julian Assuange, so I assume their servers cannot keep up after this morning's news on the wikileaks front.

Does that mean I have to erlave? ten bloody eyars on here and the fact that I grew up in a cou8ncil house emans I am off eh?

Actually I know what he thinks he emans but it is patronising.

And PMSL at duellingfanjo but honest I am guv- entitled to council tax benefit (don;t claim though, more pride than sense); Bridgwater council estate upbringing- even a child with a silly first name .

heck, I even get drunk and dance to the Wurzels: I am pure Bridgy no matter that I live elsewhere.

I think it's just bloody patronising to assume MN doesn't have a good proportion of working class contributers.

It's like saying that just because the vast majority of people on her are thoughtful, intelligent and opinionated, they couldn't possibly be working class

Why would I want to be MC I wonder?

I want financial independence yes, i;ve already got a degree, but I like being me and although my kids are very MC and i wouldn;t go back home for their sake, I miss it very much.

it's a definition thing I guess: if you mean WC = certain income, yes of course I'd like ours higher. If it means attitude I think we're probably MC. If it means where you feel at home and who you are then I am WC and happy with that. But then i always was an anomally that way: stand out like a sore thumb here for being common, and back home for being posh. Transition class I like to call it.

I have children,I work.

I have children a degree, maybe an MA soon, I don't work (carer)

I would absolutely lose it if someone referred to me as underclass though becuase to me that means those who amde a lifestyle choice of dependency.

It should be about upbringing attitude and belonging. And it needs to be clarified every time it is used.

SMA i like transition class, that's me too!

WC background, now MC life. I still revel in being able to shop in sainsbury's (i don't dare even think of waitrose....)

Sort of like moneysavingexpert's forum?

I had the pleasure of reading about this in the DM today (after trudging my way to Sainsbury's in the snow, boy asleep, no other paper yada yada) and apparently being Chinese is the answser.

If you are "ethnically Chinese", you will do better than all other poor and non-poor children with the exception of non-poor Chinese.

The answer to poverty - at last!

What a bloody stupid idea.

If you're working class, you post over there. If you're middle class, post over that way.

Some people are far to preoccupied with the idea of 'class'.

Claim they want to get rid of it, when all they really want to do is re-enforce it. Keep everyone in their place.

I grew up in the 70's and my parents are working class, dad a builder and mum worked in a shop, in fact they they still are an I am extremley proud. They worked hard and brought me up very well, I have gone on to do a 'professional' job and still consider myself working class (although my husband thinks we are middle class!!). I think this because my roots are working class and that is what I want to be!

Hec you are right of course.

One of the best things the surestart I was allied to acheived was to get kids from all social backgrounds mixing: a sharing of aspirations, experiences that may both drive the child's ambition and empathy as he or she grows up.

Segregation throughs chools, catchments, social means is a bad idea.

I learned so much from the people I mixed with later on- am totally dismissive of this perversion of neuroplasticity therory. At college, when my friends were MC and had famillies with cars and professional jobs; from my ex fiance whose lack of general intelligence and a degree showed me that actually, I could do it after all ([wink[), from the Phd holdi9ng employer whose hubby I nursed who always amde sure there was a copy of The Times for me to read, taught me to cook really good food and left me £1000 towards studying in her will.

Had I not had the chance to get outside my childhood estate I would, like som many whom I no doubt have far higher ability, have spent that time cutting ribbons in the now closed lingerie factory or packing fruit in the about-to-close warehouse. Noble, decent jobs but far from life affirming. And when teh caring responsibiltiies hit i;d have been looking at it for a lifetime instead of trying to turn the qualifications and skills I have into a ladder out- because I woudln't have those skills.

It's a stupid idea because it assumes that working class people all have access to the internet and a computer.

Yeah, let's have a site to help people out of poverty. Of course, they have to have the time and means and know-how to access the internet.