Spending Cust - Why are we spending £33 BILLION ON A USELESS TRAIN THEN?

[decaf]

Can anyone tell me why, when we have no money, we are about to spend a minimum of £33 BILLION..........YES £33 BILLION....... on a high speed train - it's not environmentally friendly (although the government keeps pretending that it is - despite independent findings clearly showing that is won't be) it will take nearly 20 years until it is up and running - by which time we will all be driving electric cars and broadband will be widespread across the UK - resulting in reduced need for business travel and whilst it might reduce the number of internal UK fligts (but not necessarily) any spare capacity it creates at Heathrow will be used up as it will encourage people from up north to come to Heathrow for more long haul flights - increasing C02 emissions. Neither is there a strong or sound business case - again independent research has challenged the governments unfounded claims - but the government just arrogantly brushes them aside. Just think what the UK could do with that money instead......FOR THE SAKE OF YOUR CHILDREN AND FUTURE GENERATIONS PROTEST NOW - go to www.hs2actionalliance.org/

Don't let the government get away with this....they say the train will only go ahead if it is supported by the British people .....it will be "consulting" before it makes a final decision - SO COME ON MUMS MAKE YOUR VIEWS HEARD - because at the moment the government is showing every sign of going ahead with this - to them it must look like a done deal .......WE CAN CHANGE THAT!!!!!!!!!

We need modern infrastructure and our train system is years out of date, its the main reason its so expensive.

Did you register with MN just to post this?

The cuts seem to have brought a lot of political activists to MN recently, or am I imagining it?

No I've been on MN for the last 3-4 months

Not you, Huddspur, I have seen you around. The OP.

The wording of the OP "Come on Mums, make your views heard" makes me think that this is not a MNetter. Could be wrong, and it is regular namechanging though.

I think infrastructure spending is the best sort of public spending. It really does lead to economic growth, unlike most other public spending.

£33bn seems far too high a price to me though. Why does it cost that much? I reckon it should cost at most £20bn to build the whole thing, from Inverness to the South Cost.

We need a better rail infastructure in the country and building new lines will create jobs.

I think it is more scandalous that in hard times money is still being spent on widening roads. How about filling in the pot holes from last winter first?

I'm also cross that commuters are going to have 10% annual increases to their season ticket cost when railway journeys are already more expensive here than elsewhere in Europe and most people's pay is being frozen (has already been in private sector). If they want more people to get out of their cars and use the train they need to make it cheaper to travel by rail.

Updating and improving Infrastructure is vital to ensure our economic competitiveness in the future, this is particular true now with the processes of globalisazion moving as quickly as they are.

The UK is entering a period of spending cuts which will affect every person in the country, yet the Government is pressing ahead, at speed with a massive infrastructure project with no business case, and one which will cause untold environmental damage ? and against the advice of experts in this field.

It is inexplicable that a project with such a poor business case could possibly be thought better value for money than the benefits that this country is being forced to give up.

Longfingernails - bade on what? I reckon it should cost £1.50 and a packet of chilli mccoys.

Hi - I started this thread - and just for info I am not a political activist - I have just joined mumsnet and I'm not really into the swing of how it works - sorry if I don't strike the right tone - I'm sure I'll get the hang of it - it's just something I feel very strongly about - the country is in dire straights and we are about to be sold a pup.....and the government seems to be acting on bad advice, so it seems to me the only chance we have to stop this is to get enough people to shout that it's not needed and the benefits they claim it will bring just won't materialise

According to Google Maps, driving from John O'Groats to Land's End is about 1400km.

The cost of construction for high-speed rail in France (admittedly several years ago) was about 10 million euros per km - or at current exchange rates, about £9m.

That would make the total cost approximately £12.6bn.

Now, of course the rail route wouldn't follow road routes, and there has been lots of inflation, and Britain might just be more expensive than France. No doubt the cost of dealing with the militant RMT members who will be involved in the construction pushes up the price in Britain too.

Counter to that, though, construction should have become cheaper as technology improves.

I think £20bn sounds more or less reasonable, based on the above. You are of course right, though - it is difficult to come up with a fair value. £38bn sounds too much instinctively to me though. The £18bn difference would be better spent in cutting taxes, or just paying off some debt.

Surely though by investing in our infrastructure we are also creating jobs around the country - rather than just in the south east which has been the complaint in the past. I am not totally up on it but won't this be cheaper in the long run getting people off jsa/some benefits whilst increasing employment and also tax revenue from this employment throughout the countryside?

Our lack of modern, reliable transport infrastructure is shameful. Especially when compared to the rest of Europe.
I'm very, very glad this is going ahead.
Not at all happy about the cost though - as ever with public spending, the figures are just ridiculous.

The poor quality of our rail infrastructure is one of the reasons why our trains are so expensive.

A big reason our trains are so expensive is because of the RMT.

Bob Crowe needs to be taken down a peg. He is the Scargill of our times, and needs exactly the same treatment. The RMT needs to be smashed - but sadly, Boris is too congenial and Cameron has more than enough on his plate. I reckon fares could halve if LU staff were paid what they were worth, instead of what they can get away with.

I would happily go without the Tube for 3 months, if it meant that the Reagan Air Traffic Controller solution could be administered to underground staff.

I can't be arsed to research it but I would be interested to see which company has been awarded the contract to build the link.

Would imagine one of Dave or George's mates is connected somehow.

You do realise that the HSR project was originally announced in March by the Labour Minister Lord Adonis?

The UK urgently needs better rail infrastructure.

One of the reasons France and Germany have a much superior high speed rail system than the UK is because during WW2 the allies bombed pretty much all of their rail infrastructure. Therefore we should all blame the luftwaffe (& Goering) for not having the foresight to bomb all of ours and thus giving the UK to the opportunity to re-build a High Speed network fit for the 21st Century! However, they didn't and so the UK faces spending billions to recreate one.

Surely better to spend on our own works than increasing spending in overseas aid for goodness sake.