Termination many years ago - Will God forgive me or will I go to hell?

[wishitwasdifferent]

I apologise in advance for if this topic offends anyone or if this is not the right please to put it. But I want to ask for advise and don't know where else to turn.

When I was 19 I had a termination and it is something I feel more and more guilty about with every passing year. I am now in my 40's.

My Mum and Dad didn't even discuss with me the option of keeping the baby and it was a case of "here is the money, sort the problem, what will our friends and neighbours think" etc etc. I know it was the wrong thing to have done, I lay in the hospital shaking and in fact I was put to the back of the queue by the nurses as they knew I was very unsure, But I knew my Mum in particular would have been very very angry and so I went through with it.

There is not a day goes by that I don't regret it. I have other children now, but I wish I had fought to keep my baby, I wish I had been stronger for him/her and that I had given that child a chance. I managed to get my feelings under control (although still always guilty) until a few years ago. At that time my now ex husband said in arquements with me (he was an alcoholic)said that I was a useless Mum as I allowed my baby to be murdered and how could I call mself a good Mum if thats what I had allowed in the past. I knew he was just being cruel but it hurt and still does.

Then a few years ago my brother and his wife had a miscarriage. She found out I had had a termination and there was a massive row in the family as she wouldn't speak to me for what I had done. When they did go on to have childen I was not allowed to be a godparent because of my evil past. My Mum has never stood up and said they put the pressure on me to do it, I have taken all the flack from some family members in order to protect my Mum and Dad and I am disgusted with myself that I did it. Why oh why did I let it happen??

I am the most devoted mother ever, I love being a Mum, always wanted to be a Mum right from being very young (and really can't believe I did what I did) I am petrified of dying because of what may happen to me and I used to love to go to church but since the godchild incident, when I have sat in a church it makes me feel like a really evil person and the dying fears etc get worse.

My DH (I re-married) knows everything, is very understanding and tries to support me when I am down over the subject, but I wish I could sort my thoughts out over it all. Any advice please. x

Namechanged. When I reluctantly had a termination many years ago, I was distraught and thought the same as the OP. Mt grand dad is a lay preacher and was v reassuring. Hope that helps.

Great advice & support already on this thread

As others have said you need to get to the position where you forgive yourself.

However I'll post this just in case it's of any help. The CofE do offer the "The Reconciliation of a Penitent" (similar idea to RC confession) - more info HERE Pg 21. If you feel that you need God's forgiveness to move forward then this may help you. You just need to contact your parish priest & they will arrange it all (don't worry, priests, like doctors, have heard it all before...)

I cannot possibly Thank you all enough for the kind words and support offered to me. I worried so much after putting my post on that I had opened myself up for more comments about what a bad person I am

I have taken on board everything written to me, If I could find the courage I prob should see my GP about counselling but firstly I will start with some of the ON line options.

I really would like to speak to a vicar but I am WAY too frightened to do that, I doubt I will ever be able to admit what I have done to someone like that. I never expected the reaction I got from my SIL and she has really put the wind up me of how cruel people can be if they know. The sad thing is my brother was one of my best friends as well as my brother and this has destroyed the relationship massively. I really understand his loyalty has to be to his wife etc etc but I miss him so much. I still see him occasionally at My Mums or family occasions but if she (SIL) is there it is a very forced politeness between us all. I am really conscious that although I talk to my nieces I never touch them or play with them for I know how my SIL feels about me. I could have been the most devoted, fun, Auntie but instead I sit politely on the settee and watch. What makes it worse is before he met her he and I were very close. He knew all about the termination and we talked about it to each other. My Son was born exactly the number of weeks early that my first baby was when I had the termination and my brother and I discussed that maybe my babies spirit had come back in my second child and had the chance of life but was born early as that made him 40 weeks in total. I loved that idea and comforted myself that maybe that was the case.

Then when his wife said all she did to me, he agreed with her that I was bad and in fact on the phone they said ?We will agree to put all this behind us, but we can never forgive you.? My now DH is really angry with them as he says they are worse Christians than I am if they cannot forgive someone who clearly is so repentant ( I think that?s the right word??)

What hurts is at the time of her miscarriage I was living in a very violent marriage and I had hardly any money. When I heard of her miscarriage I dug around to find all the coppers, silver I could. Walked to town (I had a car but no petrol in it) and cashed all the money into one of those machines where you can swap it for notes. Then I used that money to buy her flowers and a card. I found out from my brother that she threw the card in the bin and gave the flowers to her Mum as she couldn?t bare to look at them. I was very stupid I guess in that to me I feel and still feel that we both lost a baby we should have been able to have. Everything settled down after a bit til they had children and then it all came out again because of the Godmother thing. I think everyone in the family expected me to be as I really am baby/child devoted and were all stunned, so then the reasons why came out.

To answer a couple of other points.

My Mum and Dad are actually really nice people, My Mum I know has said before that now she thinks they did the wrong thing in ?forcing? me to do it and has also said that as my then boyfriend drove away to take me to the clinic, she thought ?That?s my grandchild? but her snobbery stopped her stopping me going I feel!!!!!

I know someone mentioned maybe giving something back to another child/children ? I am a VERY devoted Stepmum to a child who lives with me and only visits there Mum so maybe that is the giving back to a child?

Religion ? Yes I believe I am religious, As a child I was very involved with the church, I was in a preaching group that travelled round churches helping to take services. I was the youngest in the group and did a lot of the childrens readings etc. I was also picked to be the churches mayqueen because of my dedication to the nursery/pre school age part of the church in that I helped in that dept every Sunday. I left this church with my Mum and Dad when they moved to live in another part of the country and haven?t since found a church that I feel part of in the same way.

I am interested in some people saying ?ask God to forgive me? how?? In prayer??

Also it hurts that my child has no existence to me. My Brother and his wife have a tree planted for their lost baby, everyone knows about it, everyone offers them sympathy still. I have been asked/told that mine is a taboo subject that causes ill feeling and basically not to mention it. My baby has a name, I chose one, he has a birthday (the day he was due) ironically the said SIL has her birthday on the same day!!! Bad coincidence. I have often over the years thought D?.. would have been 1,5, 10, 18 etc this birthday and wondered what he would have been like. I wondered if I should get a locket or something which I could wear but I know if my Mum found out what the significance was she would get all huffy with me and tell me I was bringing it up again and I need to forget about it.

Wow an essay. Thanks again to everyone. I really really appreciate all your kind words. x

Thanks for updating the thread, I don't understand how SIL can be so cruel and have this in her mind whenever she sees you! take care of yourself OP x

Your SIl is wrong on so many levels, I don't even know where to start.
She's being a bad Christian, there's no doubt and also it is not up to her to "forgive' you. You haven't done anything wrong to her, however devastated she is by her mc.
Please try to get some counselling.

I didn't answer your post originally as I didn't feel there was anything I could add to what others had already said, as I agreed so wholeheartedly with them. Reading this this morning though, and your update, makes me so angry on your behalf, especially the comment from your brother and sister in law that they 'cannot forgive you'. As winnybella said - there is nothing for her to forgive you for, and even if she did / does feel aggreived by your action her role as a Christian ought to be non-judgemental.

As for contacting a church / vicar - please do. 'Someone like that' is exactly the kind of person who you should be talking to. I would also urge you to read Philip Yancey's 'What's So Amazing About Grace?' - it could really help you to understand that however you feel about yourself, God has forgiven you - and all of us - and may, I hope, help you to find a way to forgive yourself.

And yes, counselling. Do see your GP, there must be something available to you.

As for remembering your lost baby - your DH sounds very supportive and understanding? I wonder if you and he together could do something of significance - plant a tree, release a balloon, have some kind of 'memorial' ceremony between the two of you that would enable you to mark and commemorate your loss? Wear a locket if you feel it would help- you don't have to tellanyone its significance - just say it was a gift from DH?

Much love to you xx

OP, your Mum may be lovely but she is seriously failing you in not holding her hands up and admitting to the world that she pressurised you into the termination, especially as she knows how your brother and SIL are treating you. In your position, I'm afraid I would have no hesitation in telling everyone the truth, your parents did not protect you, why should you now protect them?

As for your SIL, where to begin? Even if sbe regards a termination as a sin, it is not up to her to forgive you, it is between you and God. And your brother is a spineless twerp for not sticking up for you.

I think you should do something as a memorial for your lost baby, there is no reason in the world why you shouldn't plant a tree too, or maybe make up a little box of baby things and keep it in a a safe place.

Your baby may well have conme back as your ds by the way, I am convinced my Dad came back as ds3!

And of course God will forgive you, all you have to do is ask! Although to be perfectly honest, if God has any sense of justice, I'm quite sure you are not the one He will have seen as the "sinner" here.

justaboutkeepingawake

I am very saddened and upset having read your suggestion that the op should ' contact the C of E or another protestant denomination, as the Catholic church take an unusually hard line on this kind of thing'.

Are you really seriously suggesting that she would be , what, turned away, condemned ?

This is so profoundly ungrounded and false that I am and embarrased for you, an Anglican deacon, about the lack of very basic knowledge of other denomination.

First of all catholic teachings on abortion is not one iota different to absolute majority of other christian denominations , ie. it is a great wrong in itself, unlawful ( in God's law ) taking of innocent sacred life.It is acceptable ,though, when mother's life is in danger.
But as to personal degree of responsibility, it is only for God to judge, every set of circumstances is different.

A remorseful woman would find nothing but total forgiveness in the Catholic church. She would be welcomed with open arms by any true catholic, to suggest otherwise is a travesty born of predjudice or ignorance.

I am 39 this week and have been a Catholic all my life. As I always took a great interest in my religion, I can say with confidence that I am very well read on it, have extensive experience on it and know it inside out. Once again, Catholic church believes and offers total forgiveness to any woman struggling with a guilt of abortion.

Also, I have many friends of protestant faith, mainly evangelicals and pentecoastal. Here and in Poland where I used to live years ago and where the ecumenical movement is a BIG thing, and can assure you that they their stance on abortion is exactly the same as us catholics, so your claim that catholics take some unusually hard line is false.

I am upset in a way that you would be if someone suggested, go and find christian compassion here and there but avoid justaboutkeepingawake... How would you feel like? Knowing how totally unfair and untrue this statement is.

Actually, the two websites I suggested, Rachel's Vineyard and Priests for Life are catholic, I invite you to check them out and see for yourself that the op would find toatal acceptance, compassion and lots of help , regardless also whether she herself is of a catholic faith or not.

Peace with you but please find out for sure next time before spreading predjudice against your fellow christians.

Wishitwasdifferent - have lurked for a while but I had to join to respond to your post, am so sorry for all the hurt you are carrying. Please know that grief and regret are not a barrier to God but exactly what he longs to deal with.

Whatever you've done, whoever you are, you are no better and no worse than any one else. Please don't let anyone make you feel unforgivable. Every single one of us has fallen far short of God's perfection and need to be forgiven, whether it's for pride or hypocrisy which we can try to hide or for more 'obvious' things. There is full and free forgiveness available - that's exactly what Jesus was doing on the cross, taking all the penalty on himself so that we can know God in unhindered relationship. He alone offers a way to know God that doesn't have anything to with how well or badly we perform - in the past, present or future - but relies entirely on something he has already done.

If you want a fairly brief and straightforward explanation, I'd strongly recommend 'Christianity Explored' by Rico Tice which is about a fiver on Amazon.

It sounds like counselling may be really helpful for you in dealing with your own feelings as a result of the termination, trying to pretend it can just be forgotten is clearly not working for you, whatever your family would like.

I pray you'll come to know the true and complete freedom that comes with God's forgiveness.

PS - sorry forgot to answer your question - yes, just talk to God and ask him. The book has an example prayer you could use if that would help.

The support shown to me has really made me think. I have sat and read through this whole thread with my DH (cried a fair bit!!) and he has discussed it all with me at length. One think I have learnt from you all is something my DH has been telling me for a long time and that is that my SIL views are not necc the views of the majority. I know there will be people out there who agree with her and prob people who read my thread and do believe I was wrong to do what I did (me too!!), but the difference is I guess they also have the compassion to think it but not to be so unkind as to hurt me even more by vocalising their thoughts and that makes them a far more christian person.

I do know I cannot change the past, I should have been stronger for my baby etc and if I could it would be different but I think I am beginning to understand that God knows that too. Maybe I am not carrying a big guilty secret that I will have to disclose to him as he already knows.

I am still going to look at all the websites etc people have suggested. I thought about the tree but because we rent our property I don't want to plant one here as I may have to leave it one day. I have seen the balloon idea before but I can't do that as I know I would then worry where the balloon is and I would feel I have let my baby go into the sky again without me to look after him.

So my DH and I have talked and I am going to make a memory box. I know there is one photograph of me where I am pregnant and I am going to put that in the box, if I could see inside the picture I know my baby is there. I will write a letter to him and put that in and collect a few things I feel should be in there. I can then put the box away but when the need arises get it out and gather myself again. I am also going to print this thread off and keep it so on a bad day I can re-read and sort the demons in my head out when neccesary.

justaboutkeepingawake - Thankyou.

To everyone who has responded a heartfelt thankyou. I really do appreciate your kindness.

God DOES forgive if we regret and ask for forgiveness! And you have regretted all your life. You sound like a very caring person. You even care for the feelings of the people who have hurt you so much that it has shaped our life!

In my eyes you are a saint!!!

If everyone who had done wrong things walked out of church, churches would be empty.

Sometimes (most of the time) churches can feel as if everyone in them are with it, happy, certain and sure of their faith and yet dig a bit deeper and you discover that everyone is a bit mixed up with many problems of their own.

Jesus always approached those people who were outcasts (prostitutes, tax collectors, women!) His preaching was of inclusivity.

I am sure that most vicars/priests/ministers would be able to offer comfort.

Dear wishitwasdifferent

I'm glad that you are moving forward with this. I'm fortunate not to have been in the same situation as you - we are very different people in our 40s to when we were just teenagers. If I had got pregnant at that age I'm sure I would have rushed off for a termination with barely a 2nd thought... that sounds terrible doesn't it?

It's only once we have children of our own that we truly appreciate their value. I know that if I'd ever had a termination I would now be suffering the same anguish as you. Your DH is great. Work through this together and as others have said - you only need to learn to forgive yourself.

wishit, I'm so glad this thread has helped you to find a "plan" to move forward

Just remember that we are all sinners, everyone has done things that with hindsight they aren't very proud of (yes even your SIL )

If you feel the need, perhaps one day you could think about talking to your priest, I'm sure s/he would be more than happy for you to share the story of your memory box & then say some prayers together.

I hope you find peace within yourself soon, you are in my thoughts & prayers

You don't say what your religion is, and this is not really relevant, only in so far as how you go about getting the peace that you need.

I am RC - in my view, abortion is wrong, but the amount of culpability from what you say is less your own, and more your parents. You have lived in regret ever since, and this happens to so many women afterwards. Your parents seem quite happy to pass the burden of blame onto you. They need to seek God's forgiveness more than you do in my view. I think that when it comes to blame, they pushed you into something that you didn't want to do, that you knew was wrong. In that case, I think that your level of culpability is less than theirs - I would never presume to know what God's thoughts are, but in RC terms, the degree of sin is often down to the circumstances - and I think this is one of those occassions.

You need to pray for the strength to come to terms with your past actions, and you definitely need some counselling. Continue to pray for forgiveness - God's or your own!

If you are a person of faith, you should go and speak to your priest/minister - you clearly regret what happened, and he will help you to come to terms with the guilt you so obviously feel. If you are RC, you can receive the sacrament of reconciliation - maybe this then will put your mind at rest about Hell.

God never condemns those who truly repent, and you clearly do - you need to come to terms with this in your own mind now. He will have forgiven you - you need to do the same. I am so very sorry for your pain and the loss of your child.

May God bless you, and give you peace. I will pray for you as well. x

Oh my love I don't know what to say.

I only saw this tonight.

All I can think of is that Jesus prayer on the cross "Father, forgive them, they don't know what they are doing". He prayed for the forgiveness of those who were killing the holy son of God.

So how much, how much more would He be able to forgive a scared, traumatised, pressurised 19 year old child who did something she now regrets.

God can forgive anything. He most certainly forgives you, and also holds your child close to His heart.

The love you have for this child and the children you have shines through : you are a good Mum. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

My dh (infinitely more wise than me in theology and understanding God, as well in understanding humanity) says to read the story of the Prodigal Son (Luke 15:11-31). I see what he means.

take care.

I've only just come to this thread. And I can only say that I am very, very sorry for what yoy have been through.

The only thing I would add is that you don't appear to have chosen the abortion... you were very much pressured into it. So the moral responsibility, I believe, lies with your mother, not you.

I really hope that you can learn to forgive yourself...

I am RC, and like many of the other respondents my eyes are filled with tears for your loss, cheesy though that might sound to some.

Because it is a loss. You lost a baby, just like your annoying in-law. And you've also lost your ability to love and forgive yourself.

God can forgive ANY sin. Mass murder, or crazed racism, or anything you can't even imagine. And ALL of us are sinners. None of us are ALWAYS the people we might have been ideally.

You know how you probably feel when your child comes to you and says with a big gulp, 'Mum, I'm so sorry but I broke the jar?' You probably want to pick up said kid and hug her to bits. Our Lord says a lot in his preaching about us beocming like children, and that means trusting God to love us.

I don't want to wrestle with whether what you did was wrong. I think most of us would say that you weren't very greatly helped by your family, but they were probably doing their best too. I used to work for a pregnancy advisory service, and most parents react this way. They mean well, but it can close down discussin prematurely.

The thing is that YOU feel miserable about it.

I think the best thing is just to say to God that you loved that baby and ask him to help you love yourself. You don't have to say it aloud Some people like to write a letter and throw it into the sea or burn it - let it go, and with it the hurt of the past.

Ok, I'm very Catholic, and this may not comfort, but remember that your baby is in Paradise. S/he is already wrapped in God's love. I think you'll see her/him one day and have a chance to love each other all over again.