Catholics - staying in unhappy marriage, or splitting up?

[sadandisolated]

Just wondered if anyone had ever had the courage to end an unhappy marriage?

Putting aside the issue I already have with the DC's - I know that if we split I won't be able to have another relationship again if I want to continue to practice as a Catholic.

Has anyone had the courage to do this? How do you feel about it? How do you manage knowing that you will be alone forever if you want to continue with your religion?

I do not love my H - am only in the marriage for the sake of my DC's and my commitment to my faith.

Do you really think that a loving deity would want you to waste your life tied to someone who makes you miserable?
Hopefully some other christian MNers will be able to guide you towards christian organisations/teachers/writers who will be able to help you reconcile your beliefs with your own wellbeing. Best of luck. Remember above all that religious organisations (particularly the catholic church) were set up by fallible human men and structured for men's benefit.

My parents are divorced and both are still practising, and communicant. My mum is in another relationship. She has certainly soul-searched over this, alone and with her priest.

SolidGoldBrass - thanks for answering me - you have said pretty much what my head does, however my heart is a different matter. It's easy in my head to justify my actions, but when it comes to a lifetime of the church, community, family, etc, it's a different matter. It's so hard to stick my head above the parapet - plus the thought of never being able to fully participate in mass again makes me very sad. If I want to do this I will have to be alone for the rest of my life, which makes me sad too.

I thought that it was impossible to take communion if you had broken the vows of your marriage?

SAI: while I am sorry for your distress I am not a catholic myself (I am an atheist) so can't give you proper advice on specifics of a faith. What I do know, generally, is that there are plenty of believers, including priests, who concentrate on the idea of a loving, understanding god rather than on a lot of outdated rules which are more about giving some groups of people privilege and power over others than about living a good life.
WHile I don't believe in any gods, it seems to me only fair and sensible that people who do should think of their gods as benevolent (and therefore be kind, compassionate and thoughtful themselves - as many people who believe in gods are), and be aware that the priests of those gods might and do get it wrong. My personal perspective on the catholic church is that, as an institution, it lost all right to lay down the law about human relationships when it institutionalised the protection of child abusers.

SGB gives some good advice there. From a Christian viewpoint (but not Catholic) the bible says that divorce is permitted on grounds of fornication (Matt 19:8,9). So technically you could get a legal divorce then if your H went on to be with someone else you would gave a scriptual divorce also which would allow you to remarry.

Really you have to weigh up what is best for you as we are all accountable for ourselves to God, not to a priest or a church.

I hope you are able to come to a decision that will bring you happiness

I am a divorced catholic and was told in front of the whole congregation that I should not be taking communion. I will probably never marry again and if I do it will be a civil ceremony so it will be meaningless. It causes me so much pain .

I refused to give my husband a divorce but gave in in the end.

It is hard to give someone else advice but gor me personally I would not walk away from a loveless marriage only an abusive one.

It is very hard, have you spoken to your priest,

I actually have grounds for an annullment but am not sure if I want to put myself through it.

It might be worth consulting your parish priest for advice - there may be grounds for an annullment through the church which will allow you to move on.

Should that not be possible, then there may be other things you can do that make your situation easier whether you remain with your husband or not.

I'm a devout and practising catholic and I can truly sympathise with the situation in which you find yourself. I always try to think that while God does not want us to use personal happiness as an excuse for sin (the "It makes me feel good, so it must be the right thing to do" excuse) neither does he want us to suffer in vain when there are things that you can do.

If you leave your husband, divorce per se does not make you non-communicant - that would only arise if you embarked on another (physically consummated) relationship. I think you'll find that your church and community will be more understanding and sympathetic than you might expect.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

My old church had a support group for divorced or separated Catholics. Your church may have something similar

I'm a former RC. My ex went off with another woman, and it was all pretty horrible. I was in my 20s at the time, no children. I DID meet someone else, I remarried in the C of E, and eventually ended up worshipping there too. My current church has very similar beliefs to the RCC, except I don't have to accept the pope as the head of the church, the beliefs of contraception are different, and we accept women priests - all of which I have no difficulty with! There are a few other differences, but the liturgy of the mass is pretty much the same, and the preaching's a lot better!

Please speak to your priest-our "head of catechists" (i.e. the one who organises all the courses, does general parish admin etc.) is a divorcee and takes communion.

Jcscot has it right. It's not divorce itself that excludes from communion but being in a sexual relationship without being married. Lots of Catholics are divorced.

There are times when lots of Catholics can't receive communion (eating an hour before, missing Mass, Easter duty and so on)...

I don't think you can apply for an annulment until the civil divorce has been granted though. For what it's worth, everyone I know who has applied for an annulment lately has been granted one.

Thanks everyone who took the time to reply - you are all very kind. I understand that I will be able to take communtion as a divorcee - but I won't if I am in another relationship, so I see a lonely life ahead of me if I want to stay true to my faith. I don't think that there would be any grounds for annulment.

I will see if I can pluck up the courage to talk to my priest.

This is the first time I have even admitted this, so I feel relieved to even do that.

You don't know if there will be grounds for annulment! That's up to the canon lawyers and the tribunal committees to decide. Even if you are granted one, you are never even told why!

Another option may be to contact marriage care who are apparently highly recommended (I am not married, and have no intention of being married or ever being in another relationship to be honest!) from other people I know.

www.marriagecare.org.uk/ may provide you with some information

I do hope that helps.

Definitely talk to your priest or another priest - they'd be able to give you advice.

Someone many many threads / moons ago spoke about how the Church doesn't expect you to stay in a loveless marriage..... wish I could remember the phrase they used as it seemed really apt. Can someone help me out here??

I know (via my RC parents) a number of RC's who still attend church and play a full and active part in their church.
Don't abandon hope.

Err what I meant to say is ;this:
I know (via my RC parents) a number of RC's who still attend church and play a full and active part in their church despite being divorced.

Don't abandon hope.

Pinkfluffy are they divorced and in new relationships? I know for me divorce is not the problem but the fact that I "live in sin"

Yes for me it's the thought of never being in a relationship again. I can see a lonely life ahead of me.

I really empathise with you. I am in the same boat although in my situation my non-catholic dh is the one who is sticking around for the sake of the dc. He has said he doesn't love me and constantly acts in a cold and deadpan manner towards me.

I am constantly torn between being the one to actually instigate a split and a divorce (I would then go for an annullment as I believe I have grounds)and trying to make something of the marriage by behaving well and trying to win back his love (badly worded and not quite what I mean but .....). I hope my dh will change back to the person he used to be so we can be happy again but it's hard and the thought of being on my own with just the dc is extremely tempting.

My main concern in how the dc would perceive a split as I want them to grow up to be practising observant catholics who believe in the sanctity and permanence of marriage - but I guess I would find a way to explain things to them particularly if an annullment were to be possible.

Is your H a Catholic? Would he be derailed if you were to instigate a split? Have you considered marriage guidance or other methods to regain something of what you used to have?

I think of nothing else these days although have no-one to discuss these things with!

Insanelyunhappy thanks ford telling me your story. My H is not a catholic. He claims he still loves me and does not want to split. I see no evidence of this in his day to day behaviour. I think it's more to do with the money issues we will face if we split.

I don't think that there is any point in marriage guidance - I just don't love him anymore and I really don't think that I can make it work.

The shock that this would cause my family is another huge reason for me carrying on in the marriage. They have no reason to believe that we are anything other than happy - and it would be very difficult for me to tell them. My parents endured many ups and downs in their marriage and have managed somehow to weather the storm - they are happier together now than ever.

I should add that I could continue like this for the sake of the children and I suppose I probably will. It's just so upsetting to realise that I have to give up my own self in order to do it. That I will never be in a loving relationship again, and that when my children are grown up and away from home I will have to live with little or no love of affection in my life.

this is sooo difficult because you say you want to model a catholic life of faith for your children and want them to copy your behaviour and embrace the catholic church.

but what you are actually modelling is a loveless marriage which you certainly don't want them to copy.

i am tempted to say deal with the situation now and worry about what happens with any potential new relationship in the future.

think about the medium term not the long term, i strongly believe people should take time to get over a marriage, how you will feel/be over the next few years as a single parent? if you will be happier than you are in the marriage then that's telling.

in a few years time if you meet someone else and if you want a new relationship, THEN you can decide wither that relationship means more to you than your church's beliefs or if there's someway to combine the two.

I am so sad for you it sounds a nightmare although I would give short shrift to a religion that meant you could never experience the happiness of a great relationship.How old are you?

sadandisolated, you said "I have to give up my own self in order to do it. That I will never be in a loving relationship again, and that when my children are grown up and away from home I will have to live with little or no love of affection in my life."

Please talk to your priest; tell him exactly that.

You'd be amazed how understanding and kind the church has become.

Please, please, please talk to your priest.

I've ummmed and ah-ed about whether to post on this thread, as I am not a Catholic and have to admit that there is much about Catholicism that I just don't 'get'. You have been in my thoughts and prayers, though, and I thought I would share with you some things that were discussed in my bible study group yesterday which, coincidentally, was on the subject of divorce. If it is not helpful to you, please ignore it - the last thing I want to do is cause offence on top of what is already a desperately difficult situation for you.

For reference, we were looking at Mark 10: 1-16, where the Pharisees ask Jesus outright on his opinions about divorce.

Jesus response was (in summary) that there was God's divine law - that a man and a woman, once joined, should not be parted. However, Moses wrote a law that allowed for divorce 'because you are so hard to teach' (in some versions, the passage read 'because your hearts were hardened').

We've been working through Mark's gospel from the beginning and this idea of our hearts being hardened comes up again and again. God / Jesus over and over again make concessions to human weakness (our 'hard hearts' which make it difficult / impossible to follow God's divine law) acknowledging that we weak humans will never meet God's high standards, and so concessions to our sin are made.

Of course, the ultimate concession to this sin is Jesus' sacrifice on the cross. He died so that the effects of our sin could be erased - so that we could live freely. Sin must be avoided of course and we must always seek to live our lives as free from sin as we can manage - but through Jesus our sins, both past and future, are forgiven.

On this basis, I cannot see how the 'sin' of divorce, or even the sin of adultery, ought to preclude you from taking an active part in your faith and particularly in communion. In fact, if you were free from sin, you wouldn't need it, would you? It is because of our sins that we need Jesus. He came because of our sins, and because we were unable to live up to God's ideals. That is the whole point.

As I said, I really hope I am not speaking out of turn. I also hope and pray that you will find peace with your situation, whatever you decide.