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Christian evangelical feminism

16 replies

KayHarkerTheHeraldAngelsSing · 18/12/2008 10:10

Right, well, I've been sorting through some old books and came across some of the most jaw-dropping sexism, which I just blogged about.

But now I'm interested in finding something to replace this collection of horror with something that isn't shot through with neanderthal views. Anyone got any recommendations?

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AMIStletoekiss · 18/12/2008 10:42

It's a long while since I read any, and I couldn't swear to them being evangelicals, but the names I know are Phyllis Trible and Elisabeth Schussler-Fiorenza. I'll have a dig round the bookshelf later, but most of the feminist theology I've read came from a college library and I'm not sure I remember any specifics....

Clockface · 18/12/2008 16:56

Michele Guinness is a good start, esp. "Woman - A Celebration of fReedoms". I personally don't agree with ever word she says (or her emphases) but it's a good starting-off point. here

Also, Elaine STorkey's books are usually worth reading. I have only got "What's right about Feminism" which is a bit dated but still pretty thought provoking. It maks me realise how far we have come in gender issues (yet how far we have still to go).

Rosie Ward's book "Growing Women Leaders" is on my to-read list (esp. as I have met her and chatted at length about such issues). And of course there are loads of specifically Anglican books talking about women in leadership. Actually I'm afraid that this list is distinctly Angliacn - sorry! Maybe someone else can offer something a bit broader.

DeckTheHallsWithBling · 18/12/2008 16:58

I am sorry, i didn't understand your blog or the reference? Do you agree or disagree with the sentiments in the book you referenced in the blog?

revjustaboutbelievesinsanta · 18/12/2008 17:04

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

KayHarkerTheHeraldAngelsSing · 18/12/2008 17:55

Michelle Guinness, of course, good call. I might even have something of hers already in the loft somewhere.

Blog address is in my profilem Justa, but as it's you here's the direct link.

DeckTheHallsWithBling, disagree mostly. But it's not been that straightforward.

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Clockface · 18/12/2008 20:06

here's another good one.

Umlellala · 18/12/2008 20:22

I found your blog hard to understand, you used to accept sexism, but now question it?

As a teenager (when I was an evangelical Christian) I went to a party at Elaine Storkey's son's house once. Fancied him rotten. Hmmm... not really relevant...

but her book looks v interesting.

Fivesetsofschoolfees · 18/12/2008 20:22

Evangelical usually means that it is taken straight from the bible.

Are there particular passages that you are struggling with?

KayHarkerTheHeraldAngelsSing · 18/12/2008 20:34

It appears my powers of communication are lacking The blogpost itself probably won't make an awful lot of sense in isolation - I only mentioned it because it had the quotes from one of the books, to illustrate what I was trying to move away from.

(If anyone is desperately keen to fill in the blanks this is where it all started, which might help it make more sense)

Fivesetsofschoolfees, lots of passages, certainly, but it's a bit wider than just specific passages, it's more about trying to get to grips with evangelical thinking that is very different from 'Biblical patriarchy' beliefs, which aren't mainstream evangelical at all.

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revjustaboutbelievesinsanta · 18/12/2008 21:48

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

KayHarkerTheHeraldAngelsSing · 18/12/2008 22:03

justa, I'm sure you did It wasn't a trick entry!

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revjustaboutbelievesinsanta · 18/12/2008 22:06

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Habbibu · 18/12/2008 22:09

KH - just dashing in to give you a very un-MN hug - read your blog and think it's amazing. Man, you can write. Wish I could be more constructive for you, but the sentiment is there, at least.

Umlellala · 18/12/2008 22:16

Hello, will read more tomorrowe as i really should get to bed but fascinating!

It makes total sense now - it's just that the OP seemed to contradict your opening paragraph... but if I'd read more... [blush anyway...

v interesting thoughts

AMIStletoekiss · 19/12/2008 09:31

Hi, I've looked and can't actually find the books I was talking about, so they must have been college ones. Now you know I wouldn't count myself as an evangelical, but it was an evangelical college so I expect they're in that line....

One was definitely Phyllis Trible "God and the Rhetoric of Sexuality" - "Focusing on texts in the Hebrew Bible, and using feminist hermeneutics, Phyllis Trible brings out what she considers to be neglected themes and counter literature. After outlining her method in more detail, she begins by highlighting the feminist imagery used for God; then she moves on to traditions embodying male and female within the context of the goodness of creation. If Genesis 2-3 is a love story gone awry, the Song of Songs is about sexuality redeemed in joy. In between lies the book of Ruth, with its picture of the struggles of everyday life."

And there was one by Elisabeth Schussler-Fiorenza, but I can't work out if it was "In memory of her" or another one, I was sure it had a title like "Towards a feminist hermeneutic of the Bible" but that might have been the tagline rather than the title IYSWIM.

Anyway, happy reading.... AMIS

DeckTheHallsWithBling · 19/12/2008 10:54

I am not religious so feel I should put that up front! but this is of real interest to me. I come from a semi religious family with my brother and sister in particular both strong christians and I grew up in a very conservative Christian environment (not at home so much, but at school and church etc).

There is a woman whose blog I read who completely and totally subscribes to the view of "a christian woman must subjugate herself to her husband" and in one of her recent posts, she went on at some length about why a woman working when she has a family is entirely against god's teaching. Her writing is in no way offensive but nonetheless it made me think.

For reasons that I am not entirely clear on, these issues are real to me. Very real. Perhaps partly because DP and I live a "back to front" life by traditional standards with me earning the vast majority of our income and with that likely to continue when we have children. And i'm finding that while I don't believe women should stay home, I do believe children need a full time parent if possible. What I can't get right in my own head is how much of my modern approach to careers and money etc, are selfish and how much are genuine beliefs? Does that make sense? Whether you question the role of women from a religious or non religious point of view, I find that I am nonetheless torn because I tell myself it is better for my children to have a mother who is happy and fulfilled and a life that can be paid for, than to have a full time mother, but am I saying that for the right reasons? In our case, DP will probably do the bulk of childcare and we're happy with that. But... the control freak woman in me, wonders if that's right?

And so, even without the aspect of religious, I find I am drawn to these religious debates. Which I also find interesting - I have wondered in the past if my lack of religioun is about me being selfish and lazy, more than about any real lack of belief? Which also scares me.

Sorry. I hope this isn't inappropriate on this thread. But in a nutshell, Kay, I would be very interested in seeing and reading about your journey.

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