So why don't women cover their heads in church then?

[needmorecoffee]

When Paul in Corinthians clearly says its a must?

They used to until very recently and soem ladies still wear hats and veils to church.

Nuns do (well all the time, obviously).

so why not now? Just curious cos surely if the Bible says one must, then its obligatory and ordered by God?

They just don't

but they don't do half the stuff in the Bible either- have you read Leviticus?! The food alws clearly don't stand it is thought (eating with the gentiles etc) but the rest just didnt carry on I guess.

'cos it was a particular instruction to one church as the women were getting uppity and using speaking in church to berate their husbands

The Bible isn't considered like the Qur'an (by most- Evangelicals would differ)as the word of God; for most its the message passed through witnesses / important poeple / scribes etc

I can understand the OT being disregarded (except choice bits cherry picked by US fundies) but not the new. Paul clearly says women shouldn't speak in church and should cover their heads and while he is writing to the Corinthians it seems a general message.

it's not a general message though it was taken as thus (to keep wimmin down) by a lot of people over the centuries

it's also metaphorical (about having humility) and historical (about the patriarchal times it was written in)

Leviticus, Book of Revelation...

This is precisely why I also feel able to differ with, for example, our Minister about how the bit, also by Paul, about how wives should obey their husbands should be interpreted.

Interestingly, I (almost) had an interesting discussion with our elder about a sermon the Minister had preached about that every passage. I think she would have liked to persuade me that obedience to my husband is the only Christian model of marriage but, if you get right to it, her being an elder conflicts with how much of the same stuff that Paul wrote has traditionally been interpreted.

I agree with you that it seems like a general message to all, not just to Corinthians. I can't reject the Bible but I do reject those interpretations of such passages as being of a time now past.

The only ccover their heads if taking the role of a man in the congregation ie. teaching

Women vicars don't cover their heads.

Because St Paul was a raving loony?

Near as I can tell no one believes they should obey one word of the bible. They just believe that other people should.

They will say "god doesnt want YOU to do what you're doing"

And if you say "but you work on the sabbath, you cheat at cards and you're shagging the vicar" they say "oh those rules were just metaphors"

How do you get that, onager?

In our context, it means that women should act with decorum in church, and more importantly to be truthful about the image you portray in public. Women should act like women, basically.

Are you serious? So if I go now and again because I fancy taking my children and watching the fireworks afterwards (as is planned for next Sunday afternoon) I should also obey everything in the bible? Very bizarre. Do you put on a headscarf or bonnet?

I don't think their is a christian woman on earth that obeys everything in the bible including OT> If so she must have her own pidgeon supplier

With reference to when woman has her period.

"On the eighth day she must take two doves or two young pigeons and bring them to the priest at the entrance to the Tent of Meeting. The priest is to sacrifice one for a sin offering and the other for a burnt offering. In this way he will make atonement for her before the LORD for the uncleanness of her discharge.
leviticus 15:19-30"

But apparently as Jesus was the ultimate sacrifice its OK you don't have to do that now.

the bible says loads and loads of weird shit.

its about humility as other posters have said.

its guidence that was written in a specific time in history and we must try and interpret that the best way we can - st augustine was a fucker for instance - loads of them were.

this makes those who fololow the bible literally ( adam and eve wasn't a story that people made up to try and make sense of how things started - its literal!! and evolution is made up ffs) tell the rest of us that we are 'fair weather'

oooh i', a better more devout christian that YOU ner ner ner ner ner, thats well.....really christian of you pmsl

SqueakyPop, "Women should act like women".

But what does that actually mean? I act like a women but a Christian of the hellfire and damnation persuasion would not think so. I don't cover my head, I wear trousers, I have short hair and my husband is NOT the boss in our household (neither am I, I hasten to add; we are partners). I have no interest in acting like the kind of women that someone like that would recognise and approve of. But I'm still a Christian.

And everyone should act with decorum all the time, not just in church, imho.

women = woman, obviously.

Non-Jew christians aren't required to follow the old testament rules - after Paul got the vision 3 times of all sorts of unclean animals coming down in the sheet, and God telling him to kill and eat. He objected, being a Jew, saying he could not eat unclean animals. God told him "do not call unclean that which i have made clean". This, combined with other NT passages about not requiring Gentiles to follow Jewish law if they wanted to become followers of Jesus, is generally taken to mean the modern church does not have to follow Rabbinical law.

As for covering heads - I have heard this argued for and against. In the same passage (1 Corinthians 11 I think) that the Bible says women should cover their heads, it says man is the head of woman. So, there is confusion over whether the passage means cover the head literally, or cover the man i.e. be supportive of her husband. In chapter 16 later on the passage says that the church has no such custom, i.e. that this is not a rule found elsewhere in the church outside Corinth. Some scholars say that verses 3 to 11 are a quote from a letter received from the Corinthians which is asking the questions (including should women cover their heads), and from verse 12 onwars Paul is giving a response (i.e. that woman comes from man and man comes from woman but both are under God - and headcovering is not a custom in the church)

its a difficult passage though, I wonder how it comes across in the original language as it feels like one of those pieces where the translation is difficult....?

I came across a church where hats were expected. I looked into it and came to believe that decent dress is what is required. In that day it seems prostitutes flaunted their hair rather rhan their boobs and legs. I understand it as an item needing interpretation with regard to the culture of the day. I don't cover my head but I wouldn't strip down to a bikini in church either and I think that is relevant if men of the time linked hair and sex.

Paul spouts a lot of stuff about women that are clearly unacceptable in this day and age and therefore are not followed - just read 1 timothy. You have to remember this was written by a man, not God, in a different time, for a different audience, as is all the NT and, for that matter, the OT too. I have never taken the bible to be the literal Truth as it clearly isn't.

And, yes, i think it should be interpreted in this culture as dressing appropriately ie not waering a bikini as rlp said.