How to make forgiveness seem easier?!

[LitPearl]

I read just now in the comments under a video on youtube about forgiving somebody who isnt sorry; that if you're struggling to forgive, view forgivenesd as meaning "you didnt break me".

I really found that helpful and felt for the first time in years like forgiving them might be possible.

Any other ways of interpreting forgiveness?!

I don't find forgiveness always necessary to heal and forget.

Yes, this was true for my narc x. When i realised that i was no longer behind the starting block and i had friends, a job, a home, contentment, i felt like the way he treated me no longer matters , but my mother! It's all still ongoing, the way she simply will not acknowledge that she hurt me. I do not expect an apology but even just an acknowl3dgement that i am the judge of when i am hurt, that would be something. But her guilt tripping martyred manner is like "respect my right to treat you how i want to". This is the hill she wants to die on. Literally. Not sure how much longer she has left. Ive tried to talk to her but she stonewalls me.

I want to be able to just accept that she wants to hurt me and for me to not have a reaction to that..

Its hard. I do love her sort of.

I just view the person who needs forgiving as damaged / flawed in their thinking / actions. So whatever they did was a bit stupid. I feel sorry for them if they are not sorry themselves. It'll catch up with them sooner or later if they don't see their error. Not my job or responsibility to punish them which is a relief.

Yes thank you that also helps.

She did not break me
She is damaged.

Really does sound that way to me @LitPearl. Unfortunately, we can't always fix people. It's good that you've recognised this to stop the damage spreading further and affecting you too much.

All I need to be able to do is to talk about the weather and the garden.

But I feel like it weakens me or devalues me to just walk back in to the fold, but I read something else that helps a bit, ''what happened to me was nothing to do with me''. I like that. Like I'm just the audience for their crazy now. Not an interactive audience. Just sitting there eating popcorn. I must visualise this.

And as mentioned, it's not my responsibility to punish them, a job I don't want.

So, instead of ''forgive them!'' I have:\

What happened to me was nothing to do with me.

It did not break me.
She / they are so damaged/weak.

It's not my job to fix this dynamic.

But I feel like it weakens me or devalues me to just walk back in to the fold

No, it shows great endurance! It shows you are strong enough to be able to do it. But equally you don't have to do this. You don't need to prove strength in this way.

But why do you want to forgive, OP? If it comes naturally, fair enough, but I don’t think it’s necessary to forgive in order to forget, for instance.

@grasstreeleaf

But I feel like it weakens me or devalues me to just walk back in to the fold

No, it shows great endurance! It shows you are strong enough to be able to do it. But equally you don't have to do this. You don't need to prove strength in this way.

You"re right. Because i could not have even contemplated it 18 months ago but after 18 months of therapy and a stack of books about self compassion, and hours and hours of watching helpful videos about family dynamics, im now strong enough to consider it.
Thank you for that

I always think forgiveness is for you, not the other person. It is about letting go of your feelings, it’s about showing yourself compassion and not allowing your life to be ruled by the action of others.

You have no control over what the other person is doing, thinking or whether they are moving on. The only person who can forgive them is themselves and that is between themselves and their conscience/god/higher power

They're not sorry, they haven't asked for your forgiveness, you don't need to forgive them.

What would be helpful for you is to realise this and start to focus on the important people in your life, the ones who are there for you, no matter what.

Holding grudges towards people who have caused us harm only harms us.

Try counselling, it really helped me to move on and let go of hurt, anger and resentment.

Also realise that some ppl are just twats and / or are less socially aware and this is not a reflection on you personally.

I always think forgiveness is for you, not the other person. It is about letting go of your feelings, it’s about showing yourself compassion and not allowing your life to be ruled by the action of others.

Why does it take forgiveness to achieve that?

I truly don't get it.
Forgiveness is an old idea and a fashionable concept. Fuelled by several influences, including heavily by christianity.

I do agree that it is healthy to move on and let go, but to forgive? Nah.

It isn't always necessary.
I was abused, beaten and raped by my ex. I don't forgive him, he was a nasty twisted person full of hate.

My life is full and happy now. I am strong and live a joyful life.
I can count on the fingers of one hand the times that my ex has even crossed my mind in the past 5 years.
I have no need to forgive him.

'You did not break me' might be a powerful and helpful feeling, but I don't see how it could be interpreted as a form of forgiveness tbh.

As other posters have said, why forgive someone who isn't sorry? You can instead accept what happened and make the decision to move on.

Something that someone explained to me that really helped is this:

There are different types of forgiveness.

One type of forgiveness happens when someone wrongs someone else. realises what they have done, sincerely apologises, does their best to make improve the situation and make amends and genuinely makes a big effort to change so it doesn’t happen again.

As part of that they admit their guilt and ask for forgiveness. It is then up to the wronged person to decide whether or not to forgive them, and whether or not to have the transgressors in their life and to what degree.

This is a very rich and meaningful type of forgiveness. With this type of forgiveness often it is possible for some type of relationship to continue.

But there is another type of forgiveness. It’s like forgiving a debt in financial terms. Which basically means writing it off. So accepting that it can’t be changed, it was hurtful, nothing can turn back time or make it like it never happened. Basically accepting a loss, in the same way a debtor might accept that money isn’t going to be paid back.

And debtors generally don’t lend again to people when they’ve had to forgive debts. So this type of forgiveness doesn’t need any involvement from the transgressors. They don’t need to admit it they’ve done something wrong nor ask for forgiveness not make amends. The person who has been hurt can experience this type of forgiveness with no contact with the person who hurt them at all. It is very much for the peace of mind of the person who has been hurt.

This is a much thinner type of forgiveness. It is more about accepting, grieving, learning, adjusting and moving in.

Basically the second type involves not trying to make the situation right, or pursue redress or revenge. It is about coming to terms with things so that emotionally it no longer causes you distress.

PhoenixFreesias why does the second type of "forgiveness" need to even be called forgiveness?
And why is it "thinner"?

Are we actually talking semantics here?

@speakout It doesn’t have to be, but that’s is one of the common, long/established usages of the word. As in “forgive a debt”. Many words have ranges of meaning.

It’s thinner because it’s narrower/involves less.

By all means tie yourself up in semantic knits to try to pick a fight, but it’s pretty pointless.

PhoenixFreesias

Please don't think I am trying to pick a fight- I am sorry if you feel that way.
The idea of forgiveness in all situations is a step too far for me.
I don't release or give abdication to my abuser. I have already given too much. Forgiveness feels like giving more.
I don't know or care is he is even stilll alive and that is fine.

I understand @PhoenixFreesias
I might be able to muster up that "thin" forgiveness but there"ll be less warmth, less love, less connection. Ill go through the motions and act the part of daughter that ive been summonsed to play (while denied respect or connection or VOICE) until she dies.

But if she could understand that she hurt me it would be SO EASY to forgive. My bar is low here.

(while denied respect or connection or VOICE)

Please remember it is not within your mother's power to deny you these things, OP. You already have them!. And because she won't make room for them in your interactions she is the fool, the one in denial refusing to acknowledge qualities you already have.

And equally you don't have to 'act the part of daughter'. You are her daughter, acting or no acting.

Just be yourself. And treating someone who behaves very oddly in a humane fashion because you have goodness in you it's a strength.

Thank you. It's hard. But I"m getting there. I can feel my thinking changing gradually.