I think people should be careful doing Reiki

[lottieandmia22]

This post assumes a belief in spirituality so I'm not interested in debating that specifically. If you want to please start your own thread.

From what I can see, reiki is channeling occult energy through people's bodies and is therefore potentially risky. It seems to me that new age practitioners will repeatedly say they don't believe in malevolent entities but I think this is naive.

One of my friends told me that his dad was never the same after he became involved with reiki.

And also nearly everyone I've met who has done it was told by the reiki practitioner that they are 'special' have a 'gift' or could easily become a reiki master.

The fact that you refer to anything unknown as “science” shows that you have no understanding of the scientific method at all.

I don't think have done that. Could someone please show me where?

what about dowsing?
We are told that this is 'woo' but when my mum and I walked round her garden with L shaped bits of wire coat hanger in our hands, they definitely moved and crossed over water.

Yes, a result on something which is unproven by science may well be elusive and somewhat rare but that does not mean it is impossible. Science only shows what happens in most cases. Not saying that science is not an extremely useful way of understanding the world about us. However it cannot explain everything (yet)

Again, not something which is unproven by science, something which HAS BEEN DISPROVED BY SCIENCE. Somethings are impossible, not elusive.
Science is the only way to understand the world about us. Not everything has been explained yet, but a huge amount has and most woo can be easily and empirically disproved.

By your logic you should believe me when I tell you I can fly. After all, you think It doesn't become wholly irrefutable on an individual level. There are exceptions

so I'm an exception to the humans can't fly rule, right?

what about dowsing?We are told that this is 'woo' but when my mum and I walked round her garden with L shaped bits of wire coat hanger in our hands, they definitely moved and crossed over water

Is that a joke? Even people who beleive in dowsing (Which is nonsense, and has been proven to be nonsense) would laugh at that.

www.livescience.com/34486-dowsing-water-witching.html

meta HAS BEEN DISPROVED BY SCIENCE. Somethings are impossible, not elusive.

Now that is interesting, meta. Can you direct me to the studies which shows Reiki, specifically, is disproved along with the full scientific explanation? Can you actually scientifically disprove something which cannot be explained?

no it's not a joke, we did it and it worked.

Only you can tell me if you can fly meta. I have flown several times. Don't like the queues for luggage much, though.

“However it cannot explain everything (yet).”

No. It can’t I agree. Your point?

We can easily prove that the things reiki claims to do are not even real, or not helped at all by reiki "treatments". The laws of physics disprove the basis of reiki.
What makes you think it can't be explained? Reiki practitioners have no problem explaining it while charging people money to do things they cannot do.

sciencebasedmedicine.org/reiki-fraudulent-misrepresentation/
www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/reiki.html
edzardernst.com/2015/02/reiki-nonsense-on-stilts/
www.livescience.com/10594-alternative-therapies-debunked-denounced-2009.html

Here: even a child can easily disprove it, scientifically
www.psychologytoday.com/blog/homo-consumericus/201109/eleven-year-old-debunks-therapeutic-touch-the-case-emily-rosa

an eleven year old can manage it, I'm sure some of you could understand if you just channel the right energy!

meta I asked for scientific studies and not Mumsnet threads or psychology blogs. Do you know some scientists would argue whether psychology is even a science?

No. It can’t I agree. Your point?

My point is, Bertrand, some of what you don't know might surprise or even baffle you.

They aren't mn thread, and the sites describe the scientific studies. Did you not actually look at them at all?
Not very "open minded" is it?

My point is, Bertrand, some of what you don't know might surprise or even baffle you

Would baffle you, clearly. Basic science does.

“My point is, Bertrand, some of what you don't know might surprise or even baffle you”

Nope- still don’t understand.

The tests done on these practices are not intended to find out how they work but whether they work. And they don’t.

Acupuncture is not "woo". Evidence has shown it to be effective in treating a number of conditions. There are still those who dismiss it but this simply goes to show that sometimes belief trumps evidence.

I know quite a few HCPS who recommend homeopathic remedies and they are effective. Placebo can be powerful and useful, particularly where standard medication cannot be used because of other pre-existing conditions.

know quite a few HCPS who recommend homeopathic remedies and they are effective. Placebo can be powerful and useful, particularly where standard medication cannot be used because of other pre-existing conditions

If they are recommending them as placebo that is one thing. But they have serious ethical issues if they are recommending them as treatment while knowing that they will not do what they say they will do.

If the experiments had shown that they do work, then would be the time to start thinking about the “how”.

“Acupuncture is not "woo". Evidence has shown it to be effective in treating a number of conditions.There are still those who dismiss it but this simply goes to show that sometimes belief trumps evidence“

This is simply not true.

In 2009, the Web site of the International Centre for Reiki Training (Kent, England) stated: Reiki is both powerful and gentle. In its long history of use it has aided in healing virtually every known illness and injury including serious problems like: multiple sclerosis, heart disease, and cancer as well as skin problems, cuts, bruises, broken bones, headache, colds, flu, sore throat, sunburn, fatigue, insomnia, impotence, poor memory, lack of confidence, etc. It is always beneficial and works to improve the effectiveness of all other types of therapy. A treatment feels like a wonderful glowing radiance and has many benefits for both client and practitioner, including altered states of consciousness and spiritual experiences. . . . Reiki will improve the results of all medical treatment, acting to reduce negative side effects, shorten healing time, reduce or eliminate pain, reduce stress, and help create optimism [3]

Please tell me that you do not beleive that Reiki can cure broken bones and MS and cancer?
These people are fraudstes and charalatans. They should be in prison, not supported.

Belief does not trump evidence.

Freudian choice of words though, I know a man who also believes in "alternative facts"......

Excuse me, meta, I realise the first link is not a Mumsnet thread. However I still think the actual study or scientific explanation contained within it is severely lacking. Here is the sum of what it says:

Here is what we actually know about reiki:

There is no evidence that this “energy” exists or that it’s putative deficit or suboptimal movement is detrimental to health.
Physical effects such as tingling must be attributed to some other phenomena.
Reiki is ineffective, although it may evoke some sort of placebo response.
Detoxification” and “boosting the immune system,” are bogus.

Don't know much then do we? No referral to copious numbers of detailed Empirical studies. One 2011 study is referred to, through a link. They include the conclusion

"The existing research does not allow conclusions regarding the efficacy or effectiveness of energy healing. Future studies should adhere to existing standards of research on the efficacy and effectiveness of a treatment, and given the complex character of potential outcomes, cross-disciplinary methodologies may be relevant. To extend the scope of clinical trials, psychosocial processes should be taken into account and explored, rather than dismissed as placebo."

However the authors are not even named. No details of the study given. And all it says is no conclusions can be made. Not much disproving going on is there?

None of the links were MN threads, so why did you think they were? Did you not read any of them? There are loads of references, the studies are even linked to!

Would baffle you, clearly. Basic science does.

No shame in acknowledging you don't understand everything. However I am rarely baffled because I acknowledge this. I do think continuing to ask questions is more useful in science rather than thinking you know it all.

Nobody thinks they know it all, as has been said repeatedly. But why won't you admit what we do know?

And answer my question: the reiki society claims it can cure cancer and MS. Are you ok with that claim? Do you think that is acceptable?

X post meta. My 13:21 post refers to your first link better.