Non Catholics Taking First Holy Communion....

[CooeeeMrShifter]

Can anyone give me some insight please?

My DD is due to take her First Holy Communion this school year with the school and there are a lot of families that are members of the local Pentecostal Church that are putting their children in to take their FHC within the Catholic Church. In conversations recently, it also seems to be that a number of the non Catholic parents have produced some dodgy looking Catholic Baptismal certificates (friends saw these).

I was wondering: if they are non Catholics, are they actually allowed to take their FHC in a Catholic Church.

Does anyone know?

Thanks in advance.

Thanks Francis, I understand your last post more and agree we may not always feel God's presence but can trust it is there.

So why are believers, who are not Roman Catholic, not allowed to partake in Holy Communion in a Roman Catholic Church?

Or at least sometimes, because a Roman Catholic priest once actually showed visible shock when I asked to be blessed, rather than take Communion at a funeral. I have no problems believing but did not want to offend anyone, because I am not a confirmed Roman Catholic. This happened even though he said we could ask for a blessing. It was a strange moment of clumsy gestures, which sent shivers down my spine...

Ah x posts again.

I was partly thinking about the people that dropped dead in Acts because they lied regarding giving up all their property. I often think this was because somehow they could not accept the forgiveness Christ bought for us and without this, when their sinful nature was bought to light, their hearts could not take it.

Similarly partaking in the Sacrament of Communion, without believing in Christ, could be harmful, if it brings our own sins to light, which condemn us (without forgiveness).

DD2 converted to Catholicism at 11 after i sent her to a Catholic primary school. i was asked if i objected to this, since i am not a Catholic. I had no problem with it. DD2 had been baptised when a baby and that certificate was fine and she did not need to be baptised as a Catholic. I was under the impression that to take Holy Communion and be confirmed, you had to take confirmation classes. DD2 took them with the adults, not the children from the school, who were several years younger. she took classes in school, and also in the evening with the adults and was confirmed with the adults at the Easter Vigil.

Anyone is welcome in a Catholic church at anytime, anyone can come in and pray and attend Mass. And just as you describe anyone can join the communion line, cross their hands across their chests and therefore indicate that they would like to receive a blessing.

I think it is also clear that in the vast majority of what we believe Christians share the same faith.

Following from that here is what the CCC has to say;
Ecclesial communities derived from the Reformation and separated from the Catholic church "have not preserved the proper reality of the Eucharistic mystery in its fullness especially because of the absence of the sacrament of Holy Orders". It is for this reason that Eucharistic intercommunion with these communities is not possible for the Catholic Church. However these ecclesial communities "when they commemorate the Lord's death and resurrection in the Holy Supper...profess that it signifies life in communion with Christ and await his coming in glory" 1400

From this passage it is clear that as well as believing different things about the Eucharist itself, it is also the absence of another Sacrament (Holy Orders or the Priesthood) in other churches that prevents our union at communion. Holy Orders is not considered a job but a sacrament in the CC and I don't believe many Protestants share that belief.

"Holy Communion augments our union with Christ. The principal fruit of receiving the Eucharist in Holy Communion is an intimate union with Christ Jesus. Indeed, the Lord said: "He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him." Life in Christ has its foundations in the Eucharistic banquet: "As the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so he who eats me will live because of me" 1391

Francis I see. Whilst I think many Roman Catholic priests are lovely, I do have to admit I have a fear that if I were Roman Catholic, the need for the presence of a priest, would probably be the cause of much worry to me.

Well there is no need for a priest for a relationship with Christ. The sacraments are for the whole Body of Christ (the church) to build us up and sustain us until Christ comes again. But we all have a personal relationship with Jesus. We nourish that in prayer, fellowship, reading and sharing the scriptures and sharing Christ's love with everyone around us. I don't think Catholics in the west have much cause to worry about access to a priest. In the global south the church is expanding so rapidly it is hard for vocations to the priesthood to keep up. I'm sure it won't be too long before we have a pope from one of the nations in Africa.

I think I will need to get some sleep, so God bless and goodnight - pray for me capsium! :)

I will. Goodnight and God bless FrancisdeSales.

As far as I know you must be baptised by a Catholic priest before you can take communion in a catholic church.

My DC are baptised RC. Our priest does not see the need for certificates. Ours are on A4 recycled paper and I could have done better myself

The Roman Catholic Church recognises baptisms in other Trinitarian churches so Anglican, Methodist, URC, Baptist etc

The RC church does not recognise my priesthood but that is not because I'm a woman but because all Anglican orders are seen as invalid by the RC Church. On the ground that makes no difference as RC, Methodist, Baptist, Pentecostal all work together in the local foodbank, homeless shelter and other ecumenical projects. When it comes to communion at my C of E church we invite anyone who usually takes communion at their own church to come up to the rail. Technically RC and Orthodox Christians don't recognise my ordination but there are a fair few at the rail every Sunday. My church gets a lot of visitors and I suspect that I am present at a number of first communions each week but my theory for what it is worth is that God is gracious and will sort it out.

As greenheart says Christians work together, serve together, pray and play together and love each other. Baptism is a great example of where we are in agreement, we may theologically understand baptism slightly differently but not enough to divide us.

I find it really interesting how different Christian communities have the same experiences of Jesus but different language in expressing their experience. Sometimes we have to work hard to translate for each other but it is really fascinating and enriching.

Bottom line is do we have the will to love each other as Christ loves us (that is, flaws and all)?

I hope so, Francis.

With God's grace!

Absolutely!

Although to be honest in my own life I don't have much opportunity to work with other Christians as most of the people I know outside my faith community don't have faith. My best friend is an atheist, living with her partner and two kids. We just hosted a joint birthday party BBQ last month. So I guess she takes my unapologetic Christianity in her stride!

Francis No reason why your friend shouldn't take your 'unapologetic Christianity' in her stride. I don't think Christian belief needs to be apologised for. Even when beliefs differ, people can usually acknowledge someone being a good friend.

Talking of language and Holy Communion I have been thinking about how much I like the word realise. The use of this word which is 'make real', I find exciting. This usage illustrates how by acknowledging God in terms of the spiritual realm, He becomes physically real in us, part of us and is manifest.

Lovely. And clearly shows us it is the same Lord and we all struggle to articulate (which we never can) our experience of our love relationship with him. The sacramentality of my faith, the actions, movements and partaking in the mystery of Jesus offering himself to his father helps me with the reality that there are no words ultimately. The sacredness in silence. And how Jesus in his sacrifice takes us back with him into the heart of the Trinity.

What is your faith background capsium?

My mother was bought up Roman Catholic but stopped attending church regularly after marrying my father, who was bought up Church of England. My father has at times claimed to be an atheist but most recently he told me he did believe. My mother has explored all sorts of beliefs, including the more new age, but says she does believe in God.

My maternal Grandfather converted to Roman Catholicism after a spiritual experience in Egypt, which terrified him, during the war. The Roman Catholic church was the only ones who, he felt, were prepared to help him, at the time.

As a child we did not attend church very often, mainly for weddings, christenings and funerals.

However I have believed in God and prayed for as long as I can remember. As an adult I have explored my belief further, including reading the Bible and Bible studies, listening to different people preach, which has helped strengthen my Faith.

I can understand why it is difficult for non Catholics to understand the seeming exclusivity of limiting Communion in Catholic churches. It must feel like a deliberate attempt to exclude those 'not in the club'.

I can only really speak for myself but, for me, the Eucharist and the miracle of it really becoming the body and blood of Christ to sustain me in a very real way but one in which I can't explain, is the thing that makes me and keeps me Catholic. I think it would be strange for others who don't subscribe to this to partake as they would not be fully understanding of the meaning. I know there are many who have taken without this knowledge or without really thinking about it. I am sure God has much more important things to worry about in the way mankind behaves to he honest but I do think to deliberately partake whilst dismissing the meaning is disrespectful and dismissing the very real meaning of this Holy Sacrament God has given us.

I appreciate others see it differently but I hope this helps to explain the thinking and that it is not to exclude. At the end of the day we all, as Christians, have to do what is right by our own conscience.

Would I take communion in a Protestant church? Yes possibly. I have never to date as it has never felt right, the Eucharist is so important to me that it felt different in Protestant churches who do not believe in transubstantiation, but I could imagine doing it in the spirit of sharing together with fellow Christians.

As to the original problem surely it is for the church and school to suss out whether children coming forward for the sacramental programme have the commitment and knowledge to do so and to confirm that they have been appropriately baptised. Baptism certificates is quite a new thing in RC churches. Few people of my age have them. If I was truly concerned that the "system' was being abused I think a quiet discussion with the priest to enable him to look into it further. Otherwise I hope that we, as Catholics, would welcome all showing the commitment and understanding to become full church members.

To me, transubstantiation is very similar to the act of remembrance deeply affecting a person, in that they both involve internalising Christ, having Christ become part of a person - which involves Christ being made manifest in the physical world. The act of recognising Christ in all creation, means He is made manifest.

Saying that, I appreciate the miracle in receiving Eucharist, as at this point during the act of receiving, Christ's manifestation becomes real and is realised.

What I find difficult is where the Eucharist is valued in terms of being a ritualistic act, that is performed, because to me this seems more aligned with some Pagan beliefs which see power in the performance of ritual acts. But this would, IMO, be an example of not appreciating the true meaning of the Eucharist, which I fully expect would go against Roman Catholic belief too.

I think Church unity between all the body of Christ is important:

Galatians 3:27-29New International Version (NIV)
"27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise."

1 Corinthians 1:9-11New International Version (NIV)
"9 God is faithful, who has called you into fellowship with his Son, Jesus Christ our Lord.

A Church Divided Over Leaders
10 I appeal to you, brothers and sisters,[a] in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree with one another in what you say and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be perfectly united in mind and thought. 11 My brothers and sisters, some from Chloe’s household have informed me that there are quarrels among you."

..so I think it is important to remember, however we individually understand the mystery of the Eucharist, the end result should be that Christ is in us and we are in Christ.

I agree capsium, unity is the most important thing and the ways in which we worship are secondary to our fundamental belief in Christ and wish to try and express Christian love.