insulting religions

[IneedAgoldenNickname]

Hi, I've never posted on this topic before, I tend to hang out in aibu, but don't want to start a bun fight!

So, I am a liberal Christian. I firmly believe that everyone had to right to believe (or not) whatever they want, provided that belief doesn't hurt anyone else.

Earlier today I posted a lighthearted status on Facebook, which had led to me being called mindless, stupid, stuck up, thinking I'm better than everyone else. I've been told God is a c**t (sorry I hate that word so much I won't type it) and that the Bible is only God for loo roll!

I'm just really angry that people think its ok to insult me/my religion like that, when I haven't once preached or insulted others.

Obviously the easy solution would be to delete them off of Facebook, but they are people I get on with other wise.

Don't really know the point of my post, just hoping id feel better writing it down.

[hiddenhome]

Thanks for the book recommendations niminypiminy. I'll look those up

Personally, I found that atheism had little to offer apart from an empty nihilistic feeling

[hiddenhome]

I think if you examine the actual beliefs that the religions hold Smudging you'll find that the badness is not part of the belief, but rather politics or sometimes culture getting in the way. Man will find a way of creating divisions in whatever name, whether it's religion, communism, fascism, whatever. I have yet to come across a religion that promotes hatred and evil. Hitler hated the Jews, but if Judaism didn't exist, he'd have found something else to focus his hatred on.

[firefly11]

I believe other people's religious preferences should be respected. I have left several atheist groups on FB in the past because I didn't like the way it was commonplace and accepted to mock and insult religions and their followers. It was even more disturbing to see that when the odd atheist stands up and tried to talk sense about the jeering - in a "come on, why are we mocking ordinary people for their beliefs, surely we're all better than that" way- they get shot down very quickly by the other atheists doing the mocking, told to stop commenting or "take your moral highground/self righteousness out of this discussion", etc. And justify that "it's their prerogative to mock or insult if they like, because religion promotes child abuse, etc." And let's be clear. In many atheist forums, teaching a child that there is God and teaching them to pray equals child abuse.

[niminypiminy]

Firefly, I believe you. I think the Internet promotes that kind of effulgent aggression - you see the same kind of thing (jeering and so on) in non-parent forums, indeed in all sorts of places on the interweb.

For the 'teaching a child to pray is child absuse' thing, I think Richard Dawkins is partly to blame, with absurd 'no such thing as a Christian child' nostrum.

[NicholasTeakozy]

I honestly don't understand why any sane woman would be a follower of any of the Abrahamic religions, given their obvious hatred of women.

Disclaimer: I am an atheist male who agrees with contraception and who tries to treat everybody equally.

Really, these people hate you. They will never allow you equality.

Sorry you were treated so rudely OP. I hope you don't think this is meant to be like that. This is me just being

[hiddenhome]

Jesus didn't hate women.

[IneedAgoldenNickname]

Jesus definitely didn't hate women and some women are revered within christianity (is revered the right word?)

Incidentally I'm as equal as any of the men at the church,( unless I want to become a bishop that is, which I don't)

I also agree with contraception, gay marriage, abortion etc. like I said I'm liberal! I even have children out of wedlock

[confuddledDOTcom]

Winds me up to. A friend was over our house the other week and was going on about when he was at uni and his "born again friend" I made a comment about my mum (trying to subtly remind him who's house he was in) and he said "Yes, but my friend was a born again Christian" and I pointed out that both my granddads are/ were ministers (FCoE and Elim which is how I grew up) and he brushed if off again. A little later on I was talking to another friend who was there (who's from a Methodist family) and saying how I believe in faith over religion and personal beliefs and the first one was telling me to shut up!

I've had those status messages too. I had it on a thread on MN recently where I said that faith is personal and we don't have the right to dictate to other people, someone came back and told me to shut up that people with imaginary friends have no right to tell other people what to do...

I'm so fed up of people thinking it's acceptable to bash Christians! Not just what they say (which I can understand if you feel someone is dictating) but just because they're Christian.

[deleted203]

confuddled The comment about 'imaginary friends' is not even original. It is a quote from Yasser Arafat who declared that 'fighting a war over religion is like arguing over who's got the best imaginary friend'

That would be Yasser Arafat, Leader of the PLO, responsible for many acts of bombing and terrorism. He ammassed a personal fortune of $1.3 billion dollars despite shocking conditions in Palestine. He spend many years attacking the Israeli nations and in my view is hardly a man one would wish to quote as 'the definitive voice of sage wisdom'.......Try pointing this out to the poster and tell them that it's the very essence of hypocrisy. Despite his imaginary friends Yasser Arafat was a dictator with an appalling human rights record.

[sashh]

I'm not upset as such, as in I'm not crying, more amazed that in this day and age its seen as ok to be so rude!

I'm sorry you are upset OP. However I am glad we live in a world where insulting religeon doesn't lead to people being tortured to death. We used to.

[IneedAgoldenNickname]

Well I'd agree with that sashh! No one should die for their opinions on faith. Thank heavens we live in a more civilised society than our ancestors did.

[niminypiminy]

Well, except, of course, if you happen to be a Christian in one of the countries where Christians are currently persecuted - for example Sudan, Iraq, Iran, Egypt - to name only some of the most well known examples. And a recent international survey reported levels of persecution of religious people rising around the world - most notably, and markedly, in the UK?

[niminypiminy]

(Finger slipped - meant to have a full stop rather than question mark at the end of that.)

[pictish]

It's like Simon Amstell said:

I don?t want to attack religious people. It feels like an unkind thing to do, it just feels too easy, like the battle?s already been won.
Really it just feels rude, like if you?re at a party and you get into a conversation and someone says "Oh I?m a Christian/Muslim/Jew" its very rude there to say, "Oh how ridiculous!"
I feel we have to treat people with kindness and love and respect, in the same way you would treat a child running around saying "I?m a helicopter!" and you can say "Good for you. We're all having fun. I'm a choo choo train."

[sieglinde]

yes, exactly what I was about to say, Niminy. Let's look at China, for example, where you can be a special sort of RC who isn't really RC; where thousands of actual RCs are in jail. I mention this because all your examples are intra-religious conflicts, and China shows why secularism can't resolve the 'problem' of religion in the way fondly imagined by our detractors.

and sashh, who are the 'we' you have in mind? Presumably not the Romans?

Tea, I'm not after equality in matters of religion in the way I would be in secular life. I'm not looking for promotion from God, or equal pay. He values me equally anyway. He values us all equally and also very individually. So what point are you actually trying to make?

[saycheeeeeese]

The bible does mention dinosaurs

I dont know why people have to be so bitter about God and the fact that others find hope and strength believing in him, op I understand why you're hurt I would be too.

[niminypiminy]

Pictish, that's a wonderful use of the passive-aggressive smiley. Also, you knew, really, when you quoted that piece, that under its veneer of niceness it was intended to be very insulting.

[EllieArroway]

I think you need to make a distinction between people insulting you and people insulting your religion.

It is not the same thing.

I would and do happy insult religion (all of them). I consider it facile, divisive and based on ignorance and the world would be better off without it.

But that you have the right to your religion goes without question.

[EllieArroway]

The bible does mention dinosaurs

No, it doesn't.

Oh....




Nearly forgot.

[saycheeeeeese]

*mighty

[saycheeeeeese]

Bloody phone

[sieglinde]

Ellie, religions are made up of people, believers. Why would I not feel insulted if you insulted the RC church? I AM the RC church. This of course doesn't mean that I will agree with every other Catholic on every possible issue, but RC is who I am.

Let's try this composite of the posts above:

"I would and do happily insult humanism. I consider it abysmally ignorant and the refuge of ignorant people who can't be arsed to learn any history and think they are the pinnacle of evolution. The world would be better off without it. But that you have every right to your erroneous, bigoted opinions goes without question. Now, run away and play with your toy train, dear."

See? See why it doesn't work?

[EllieArroway]

The Science Delusion. Hmmm. This is the synopsis on Amazon:

Freeing the Spirit of Enquiry
The science delusion is the belief that science already understands the nature of reality. The fundamental questions are answered, leaving only the details to be filled in. In this book (published in the US as Science Set Free), Dr Rupert Sheldrake, one of the world's most innovative scientists, shows that science is being constricted by assumptions that have hardened into dogmas. The 'scientific worldview' has become a belief system. All reality is material or physical. The world is a machine, made up of dead matter. Nature is purposeless. Consciousness is nothing but the physical activity of the brain. Free will is an illusion. God exists only as an idea in human minds, imprisoned within our skulls

Sounds marvellous except.....

Science actually doesn't claim to understand the nature of reality.

It most certainly doesn't think all the fundamental questions have been answered.

Science wouldn't work if it was being "constricted by assumptions etc..." Has this "innovative" scientists completely unfamiliar with the scientific method?

If by "scientific worldview" he means people preferring to look at the evidence & draw conclusions from that then that's something to be proud of.

The world is a machine, made up of dead matter. Nature is purposeless. Consciousness is nothing but the physical activity of the brain. Free will is an illusion. God exists only as an idea in human minds, imprisoned within our skulls Probably true. It's certainly what the evidence suggests. So what?

Blimey. The tripe that's put out in support of faith is astonishing.