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Philosophy/religion

Join our Philosophy forum to discuss religion and spirituality.

Catholic to church of england, thoughts appreciated...

12 replies

nervousstarter · 24/02/2006 22:09

I have been a practising catholic all my life, but I am losing faith, not in my religon, but in the church.
HAving recently moved to a new parish I find the priest and the congregation to be old, and the opposite of community. Our friend are coe and have a fab relationship with their minister. I think this is wonderful. It worries me that if I bring our son up in the church we are in he will not get as much out of his religion and the christian community as he could.
My founding beliefs are the love of jesus christ and god. The christian lifestyle of support of belief in christ a good community and the enjoyment of religion atm feel like they should be more important than the type of church that you give worship in.

A would appreciate anyones thought or experience in this matter as well as advice on bringing your children up as christians

OP posts:
nooka · 24/02/2006 22:46

My brother and sisters and I were brought up as Catholics, and my sister is now a CoE vicar. I don't think that the doctrines are that far apart, but it depends on how "Cathlic" you are and the style of the church you are thinking of attending as to how comfortable you will feel. You could always look further afield for your community (I don't think we ever went to our local church as children) but if there is somewhere you feel more at home then I think you should go there, and not worry too much about denomination.

nooka · 24/02/2006 22:47

oops - Catholic

scienceteacher · 25/02/2006 09:43

There is huge breadth within the Church of England intends of worship style and theological outlook. If you live in reasonably densely populated area, you should find one that you are comfortable with.

You would be very welcome to visit any Church of England church, and hopefully someone will say hello to you.

The family friendly churches are often on the evangelical wing of the church. Probably the best way of telling from the outside is on the list of services on the noticeboard, Holy Communion is not every week.

Cybermum · 25/02/2006 10:58

There are family friendly churches on the catholic wing of the c of e. You need to ask around and visit parishes - find out what Sunday Schools and childrens clubs they organise.

MaryBS · 21/04/2006 06:13

I was received into the Church of England on Easter Sunday, having been brought up a devout RC! I stopped going to church when my ex- left me for another woman and then I met someone else and couldn't bear the thought of going through an annulment. It took me a long time to find a church I liked going to.

The church I'm attending now, is lively and full of fun. The Vicar isn't ancient, in fact his daughter is best friends with my daughter. The Mass/Eucharistic service itself is not very different. In fact the Vicar (still not too sure what to call him, some people call him Vicar, others Priest, or Father.....) refers to it as Mass when in conversation with him, and believes in the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist, so not much different really.
The children were baptised CofE where we lived before, and where I used to go to church occasionally. My 6yo comes to church with me, but my 4yo stays at home with Dad. The school my 6yo goes to is nominally CofE, which helps (wasn't impressed by the secular nativities the past 2 years!). At the moment all I do is read stories from a children's bible, and talk a bit about what goes on in church. She can recite the Lord's prayer as well, we try to do that together. The Vicar has asked if she wants to start preparation for First Holy Communion when she is 7, his daughter will be doing it too (in fact his daughter holds out her hand to receive, on the offchance he forgets, which is pretty funny!). I'll probably go into a Christian bookshop to see if I can find a book which helps....

Good luck - you can always email me if you want more details/advice [email protected]

MaryBS · 21/04/2006 06:20

Oh and they have a family eucharist once a month, where the children often partake in the sermon. It was the funniest thing I'd ever seen when I'd seen this huge hulk of a Vicar as Goliath, trying to provoke a little "David" into fighting, then being slain by a stone and collapsing on the floor!
You may even find they have a Sunday school, we are planning on opening one in September, when the church hall has finished being renovated.

KTeePee · 21/04/2006 07:50

Didn't grow up in the UK so was pleasantly surprised to find that the CoE churches I have come across are more similar to Catholic than I would have expected (it was sort of implied to us as children that unless it was catholic it was pagan!). In fact, most of the practising Catholics I have come across are more CoE in their beliefs than Catholic but as Nooka says, it depends on how "Catholic" you are.

Like you, we have a great CoE church nearby and I would definitely have no qualms in joining it - however our local Catholic church is also good (lovely, liberal priests, lots of young families, etc). There are many people here of Irish/Italian/Polish decent and ime Catholicism is a sort of cultural as well as religious thing in those communities which may be why there is a strong Catholic community here.

I think it may depend on your background as to whether you stay within the Catholic church - for me I am more aligned with the CoE in my beliefs but would consider myself to be a "secular" Catholic because of my background so will probably bring my kids up in that faith for cultural reasons as much as anything.

MaryBS · 21/04/2006 12:19

A word of advice though, don't show an interest in being a Reader, if all you are interested in is reading the reading in church! Means an entirely different thing (ie licenced lay minister that takes 3 years part time study!)! Blush

Nanou1 · 21/04/2006 13:23

where do you live KTeePee? sounds like we are neighbours! lol
was born RC (in France)but feel more comfortable with CofE. our local one made us very welcome.

nearlythree · 21/04/2006 22:40

In my experience there is a big variety in the family-friendliness of CofE churches of any kind; Anglo-Catholic and moderate are just as likely to be welcoming as evangelicals - or not! There is also a big difference as to what 'family-friendly' means - some think that this means providing a creche/Sunday club/ Sunday school during services, whilst others see separating children from their parents as not family-friendly and instead expect children to stay for the whole service. If the latter appeals to you then look out for All-Age worship. IME it doesn't work that well for under-5s but that is probably because the church where I used to worship refused to provide toys or a soft safe area for them to play in.

I used to be a very committed Anglican but have now left the church, because, like you, I'd become very disillusioned. Whether you find the same problems in the CofE as in the RC church woudl depend on why you are losing faith in it to start with - I know many former Rcs find a home within Anglo-Catholicism and most Anglicans I know love the church despite its failings - I'm just really intolerant!

I agree with you totally that having Jesus in your life is more important than what church you go to. I also believe that the church should reflect Christ-like values and I no longer found that within the CofE, particularly at my local church. I now take our dds to a Baptist church at least once a month - theologically we are miles apart but we are made to feel a valued part of the fellowship, it is very child-friendly and there is no pressure on us to conform to any of their beliefs.

In terms of raising children as Christian, we started from day one, and believe that what happens at home is more important than what happens at church. From when we've brought them home our dds have been sung Christian songs, and prayed with. We also have a lot of spiritual imagery around the home, including in their bedrooms. There are crosses in most rooms in the house, and also madonnas and angels, but we also have things like crystals and natural things; in the playroom there are photos of a mountain stream, an ancient forest, and some cloisters at a ruined abbey on the walls. With dd1, we taught her to say 'god bless' at bedtime when she was two; and two and a half we added a 'thank you' prayer each night, where she chooses things from the day to thank God for, and now at four we also use a simple version of The Lord's Prayer. Dd2 (just two) is a bit different in that she fights going to bed and won't be read to at any time of day, so at the moment I say her prayers for her at bedtime. Both girls have the Lion 'My Very First Bible' and 'My Very First Prayer Book' which are great for this age - for older children Lion also do great Bibles etc so their website is worth a look. Also check out familypublications.co.uk which are Catholic booksellers.

I think it helps to think about how God speaks to you, and how you felt him as a child. For me, nature is very important, so I try to share this with our dds, and say something like, 'Isn't that sunset lovely? It reminds me how much God loves us'. I also love music so try to play a lot, not specifically Christian, just stuff that moves me - the other day dd1 and I were dancing to 'Somewhere Only We Know' by Keane and it was one of those spine-tingling moments where you really know how much you are loved. When the girls get older I've no doubt they'll find their own ways.

Children learn by watching us too, so we try to include them in trying to live in a just and compassionate way as Jesus teaches us to do, and set an example ourselves. This might mean getting the dds to sort out their toys for charity, buying Fairtrade, recycling, sponsoring a child in Africa, inviting a lonely neighbour in or joining a campaigning organisation like Cafod, CND, Greenpeace or the Refugee Council. We also try to have daily things like lighting candles and marking special family days like when dd1 goes back to pre-school after the holidays, or when dd2 passes another milestone. But I have to say that right now I'm rubbish at all of this - with two aged four and two and ds due next month I'm shattered! I'm glad that we have brought them up to believe though; tragically one of dd1's best friends died recently and she worked out for herself exactly where he is - safe in God's hands - and she ven drew a picture of them and gave it to his mummy. It's still been very hard but at least she's had a way of coming to terms with her grief.

hth!

MaryBS · 23/04/2006 07:16

Just re-read your post - would you go with your friend, is she close?

Obviously from what I've said, my reasons for becoming an Anglican are different from yours, but I probably felt the same sort of angst about it you are!

Good luck in what you decide and let us know what happens

Nanou1 · 28/04/2006 11:54

Thank you Nearly Three for all your good advice. i am doing some of what you suggest already with dd who was 2 last month. in fact, we seem very similar re nature. she does not have a bible yet, in fact wont go into it here but she is not baptised yet. good idea re the crosses which i have not done yet. we also have some christian kids book which we love reading together. noa's arch is always a winner and great to relate to nature. maybe she is now ready for the bible... must really get on with some work now.... i feel He is watching me!!!!!! wishing you all a nice weekend.

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