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Original poster

I'm a bit uncomfortable about Sunday's church service

11 replies

create · 26/04/2011 18:41

I go fairly regularly to Church Services at the local Salvation Army. I love the Army, I love the work they do in the community, I love the people and I love the way they worship. I know they pledge not to take alcohol, but I have never taken that pledge and do drink occasionally, although I fully understand why they believe it to be so harmful etc.

Anyway, this week two new Junior Soldiers were invested. They've done several weeks of Bible study and whatever else is involved and made their promises in church. Part of the promise was never to use substances which would harm their bodies, such as alcohol or tobacco. I felt that they couldn't possibly understand (at 7yo) what it was they were promising and that it was wrong to ask them to make such a promise. What do you think?

OP posts:
cat64 · 26/04/2011 18:47

This reply has been deleted

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AMumInScotland · 26/04/2011 18:49

I agree it's far too young to be making promises about something they can't really understand - is 7 the usual age for that service? Personally, I prefer churches etc to leave any promises until children are mid to late teens at least, so that they can make a (reasonably) adult committment to their promises.

blackeyedsusan · 27/04/2011 00:22

do they not have to renew it to be a grown up soldier?

Original poster
create · 27/04/2011 15:26

I've no idea blackeyedsusan, but if so, why include such an adult pledge in a child's promise?

OP posts:
nickelbabe · 27/04/2011 15:33

hmm, that is tricky.

I do understans infant baptism, and even older children being baptised or taking communion, but I don't get why children that age would be allowed to never mind encouraged, to take vows they can't possibly understand!

I mean, we've just had confirmation candidates who are convinced that they will never drink alcohol - exactly what I said at 14! but I wouldn't have been able to keep that promise through my adult life (cos Wine )

GrimmaTheNome · 27/04/2011 15:42

Curious to know what the other parts of the promise were, and if they were appropriate to the understanding of a 7 year old.

DHs grandma always claimed to be TT because she'd 'signed the pledge' as a girl. Oddly, sherry seemed to be exempt Grin. She lived into her 90s so I guess it didn't harm her much either way ....

Original poster
create · 27/04/2011 15:50

The full promise is here

My Gran took the pledge and was "teetotal" Grimma. When she died we found her store of "tonic wine" which was 18% proof!!

OP posts:
GrimmaTheNome · 27/04/2011 16:00

Well, I'd be far more uncomfortable with the first parts of that, giving a child the idea he's got sins which he needs Jesus to save him from.

The last part is far more comprehensible than that.

Original poster
create · 27/04/2011 16:09

Yes, Grimma. It was shy children talking in church and I've only seen the full wording when I just googled it.

I'm concerned becasue my DC love the Sunday school there. They've made no noises yet about becoming Junior Solidiers but DS2 particularly is very keen to be "a good Christian" which I like, but I wouldn't like him to make that promise.

OP posts:
Ihavewelliesbuttheyrenotgreen · 09/05/2011 13:58

I don't know much about the Salvation Army but am quite suprised that there is a promise like that that young children, or actually anyone has to make. The bible doesn't specifically state that it is wrong to drink (I don't think that it mentions tabacco). The bible talks about not getting drunk and also says that 'Everything is permissible for me"but not everything is beneficial. "Everything is permissible for me"but I will not be mastered by anything.' Meaning I think that not all things are good for you (alcohol, drugs, even food) and you shouldn't be controlled by them, but at the same time these things are not banned as such.

Middlemarchlover · 11/05/2011 01:05

I grew up in The SA, and after a long time away have recently gone back as an adult. I made the Junior Soldier promise at 9, and had no idea of the significance of the words in the promise; I fully believed that I wouldn't drink or smoke because I had no other reason to think otherwise. Its a nice ceremony for the kids and the congregation, but I know I'd have serious reservations about it because of their level of understanding.

The main reason why I'm not a Senior Soldier now is simply because I know how important it is to keep the promises you make to God; I'm too fond of Wine haha. I think the kids should make a similar promise to the one I have made- I'm an adherent, which means The SA is my church, I believe in God and will try to serve the church as much as I can. Maybe this is something you can talk through with your officer? If they aren't sympathetic, someone at your local DHQ (contact details on Army website) will chat about it to you.

I really respect people who have kept the promise though, a lot of my friends don't drink/smoke and it takes serious willpower. The reason why The SA gets soldiers to make this promise is so they aren't 'mastered' by anything, but also because they believe it's hypocritical for people within the organisation to work with people who have alcohol/drug dependency problems and drink themselves.

HTH and I haven't babbled too much :)

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