So how exactly do yuo explain to your 9 year old ds he misses out on a trip to a Sikh temple because you are devout Christians and how can hat be right?

[DrNortherner]

DS's clas visiting a Sikh temple today. His friends family are extremely devout Christians and he is being taken out of school for the day.

Now I am curious as to how they explain this to their son. As far as I am concerned should kids not be encouraged to learn respect and tolerance for other peoples religion?

I find this attitude totally bigoted actually.

Thoughts?

"We are supposed to visit different places of worship, not to pray but just to gain some understanding of how different people practise their religion."

Do you go during their services? Because otherwise you are mostly just looking at a building and its contents.

I agree with the sugestion that the parents probably think that their children will be expected to pray, rather than just going to have a look.

No, not during services, that would be imposing, and harder to justify that we are not asking the children to worship.
Ime, there is usually a Rabbi/vicar/Iman etc booked to talk to us and show us round. I take you point about just looking at the building, but, listening to the local Rabbi, talking about the scrolls and showing the children the respect with which they are handled, makes a huge impression on the children and really helps them to understand how important these things are to some people. I say all this as a very committed atheist.

Whilst I do agree with all that as well Bolivia I still maintain that calling someone a BIGOT (which you must agree is a harsh word) just because they refuse to visit someone elses place of worship is wrong and does not necessarily mean they are intolerant or disrespectful.

Libra, I do agree that bigot is a very strong word. I wouldn't use it unless had had been told, by the parents, their reasoning for excluding their child from a trip. I use it myself to describe situations I have been in, because of the comments parents have made to me. Believe me, they were bigoted! In the op situation, I agree that we cannot judge their actions until the op has spoken to them and can give more insight.

Whilst I do agree with all that as well Bolivia I still maintain that calling someone a BIGOT (which you must agree is a harsh word) just because they refuse to visit someone elses place of worship is wrong and does not necessarily mean they are intolerant or disrespectful.

opps sorry for the double post I pressed wrong button!

My kids juniors regularly visits a Hindu temple. Its a C of E school, a group of pupils is kept off school every year. I'm Christian my kids went, and I accompanied the visit with one of mine.

There was a time when they watched a ritual, they didn't take part.

A friend allowed her oldest to go, and he came back very upset. She hasn't allowed her younger ones. However from my observation I think if you haven't been exposed to other cultures you might find it disturbing, I also think it relevant that this child suffered migraines, so may have been especially sensitive to noise and light.

Also some people believe that God is only worshipped by Christians (maybe in some distorted form by Jews or maybe even Muslims). There for what are Sikhs and Hindus worshipping? Maybe its bad.

They may be misguided, but that is their religious opinion and they have a right to have it as much as someone does to be a Hindu. Its what happens afterwards that matters.

This is a C of E school. The boy in question comes from a devout family who attend the local Gospel Church. Their church is very active in the local community handing out bags/leaflets/pens about how we are all sinners etc etc. The boy in question does not celebrate Halloween or take part in any halloween activities and actually told my ds that he would go to hell if he didn't beleive in God. He was about 5 years old at the time....

Another boy in ds's class is a Sikh. His family have invited them to the temple and his Gran is going with them too!

The Sikh boy btw goes to the local church with school when ever there are times of worship.

Actually the Germany/WW2 think is a stupid comparison but the rest of the post still stands

I'm glad that you said it-I was going to say of course everyone should visit a concentration camp.

I don't think the rest of the argument stands. Why on earth wouldn't people of that faith want people to visit? Much better to get an understanding ans toleration of other views. The DC in question is merely the DC of evangelical Christians-he could equally have had atheist parents or Sikh parents-there is nothing whatever to say that he will follow his parents. (going the way they are I would bet on him being atheist when he can vote with his feet).

I remember my brother being devastated because he thought Jesus wouldn't love him anymore after his class took part in some ritual at a mosque. My parents checked with the school and he was accurate in what he'd described. My parents kept me off school when we went to a mosque because they told the girls to dress a particular way which my parents felt is showing respect to another god. If we'd been allowed to go in normal uniform they wouldn't have had a problem.

There is a difference between being respectful of another person and another god. As a Christian I believe in one god and whilst I will leave others to their own beliefs I won't show respect to their god and I wouldn't expect the same from them. I grew up in an area where I was in the minority as a white person so my friends were mostly Muslim. I remember my best friend coming to the church bazaar with us at Christmas and getting a present from Father Christmas but she wasn't expected to do anything other than have fun at a fun day. I've also been to Islam fun days but nothing was expected of me either.

We are Catholic.

I believe in respect,respect for religion comes into that-it is important for children to realise that other people have other beliefs and its equally important that they understand there is no rights and wrongs to worship God is God whatever you choose to call him.

It makes me sad that religion is used to be racist.

When my sons were at primary school they visited a methodist church (i think) and the Minister used my son to demonstrate how they walk into the water at baptism .....later he came to my house to apologise as he hadnt realised we were Catholic -I wasnt put out,Gods not gonna fall out with ds2 because he was 'interested'.

I suspect their argument would be that all religions other than their brand of Christianity are evil, and therefore it would be inappropriate and harmful for their child to enter a place dedicated to what they would see as an evil practice. Much as most people presumably wouldn't want their child to visit something like a tobacco factory, or a gun shop, a BNP rally or a porn studio -- not because the child would come to any physical harm, but because you wouldn't want them exposed to that kind of material.

I'm not agreeing with this line of argument, btw, I think it's bonkers, but I imagine the thinking goes something like that. It's analogous with the occasional media hoohah over some extreme church group refusing to hire their hall out for yoga classes because yoga has its origins in eastern mysticism. As if the spirit of Shiva will linger in the atmosphere long after everyone has rolled their mats up and departed, and somehow infect the hall.

plantsitter et al: I was asking for clarification repeatedly because the OP is the only person who can find out what I'd going on in the circumstances she cited. If she had asked a hypothetical question, the point wouldn't have arisen. But she didn't: she has given an outline of some RL events and asked about the motivation.

If she is interested in their motivation, the solution is in her hands - ask them.

We have no idea about the interior workings of the family upon whom we are invited to speculate. How one would make the explanation requested in title of the thread is in their hands.

What they say might be interesting for debate - and I am still hoping we might hear it; a hypothetical debate would also be interesting, as it would be inherently fluid. But the hybrid, which we have here, is from the outset prejudged in terms of bigotry. This both unfortunate and unhelpful.

Mumsnet would be a much worthier place if formal debating rules were enforced, but I suspect a much less honest one. It would be less entertaining for sure.

I agree-chat to the parents and ask.

In my opinion a Sikh Temple is probably one of the least controversial places to go to - when I've been on a couple of visits someone has shown us round, told uss about what they do; played a bit of music to us and then its into another area for tea and biscuits!
To be honest I find the "mock church weddings" that some schools participate in far more distasteful.

At the school I work at we had a family who belonged to a very local, almost cultish Christian Brotherhood, who wouldn't let their DC's go on any school trips / school disco's / cinema / museum visits etc.

I asked the mum why she withdrew her children from all this kind of thing and her answer was "I take them out in case they enjoy themselves".

I find that awfully sad. I can't believe God doesn't want us to enjoy ourselves.

I was wondering if you had yet found the actual answer to this case by asking the family?

Or have you tried reposting the underling question "Even though I know only part of the story, are these Christians bigots?" in AIBU?

there are three families in ds's class where the children are not allowed to visit non-Christian places of worship.

Interestingly,it's not that long ago that Roman Catholics were not allowed to visit other Crsitrian churches of other denominations!!

Haven't read whole thread but: when my DS was due to visit a sikh temple in year 6 one of his classmates was not allowed to go either, for the same reasons. I then found out that her father was on the board of governors and was the one responsible for the Religious policy at the school. Disgraceful - had I known this when he was nominated and elected I would have opposed it.

Oh God I'm so sorry Marmalade. I had no idea of your pain. I really should learn to read the whole thread before I dive in. Are the refuse people sending a car for you? Or one of those big trucks with the squasher at the back?

Oh dear - so sorry! Wrong thread.

Some Christians believe that as well as God, there are angels and demons/evil spirits, and that other religions are "false". they might go so far as to say that anyone worshiping a "false" God is in fact worshipping an evil spirit. If they also believe that spirits can have a physical location (in this case the temple) I can see why they wouldn't want their kids to go there, or take part in any act that might invoke said spirit... They might also be thinking about the first commandment in the old testament "you shall have no other gods before me". They may consider the simple act of walking into the building to be acknowledging/respecting/worshipping another god?