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Original poster

jumping through hoops to get a child christened?

65 replies

mommie · 13/10/2005 14:50

i mentioned to my local vicar that i wanted our one yr old christened. he sent me a pack of stuff saying i should be a regular church attender, and i have been for the last 3 months. then we were invited to 'baptism classes' and i went last week. he said some parents should go on the alpha course, others would be better with a thanksgiving service rather than a baptism etc and could he see parents (there were 3 of us) individually to establish our faith. he wouldn't put any dates in the diary re christenings. Is this normal?

OP posts:
roisin · 13/10/2005 19:12

Dh is a Baptist Minister, so technically we don't "do" any babies.

BUT the local CofE vicar apparently is quite unwelcoming to non-attenders: dh is not.
So - very unusually for a Baptist Church - we have had quite a few "blessing ceremonies" for babies of non-attenders, (as well as babies of members of course).

I love them - it's fantastic to have the church jam-packed full of people who wouldn't normally be there. What a great opportunity to be friendly and welcoming to them!

I realise that the Anglican Christening Service has some wording that is quite hard to stomach if the parents/godparents do not mean what they are promising. (Dh has the freedom to include whatever he wants in his service.)

But through these baby services we have done some weddings too, and some of the people have started coming along to church occasionally too. And even if the most they view us as is "the church they would attend if they attended church", it's got to be a good thing IMO.

Bozza · 13/10/2005 19:45

I agree with Roisin. And those below who were discussing having the christening in the Church service or seperately. I much prefer it to be part of the service - as a welcoming to the congregation - and insisted on this for both of my two.

Marina · 13/10/2005 22:51

We were delighted that our two were "done" in front of the congregation who already knew them and us well. But there was always boundless good will and interest in families who were visiting the church for the first time

startingtobehalloweenylover · 13/10/2005 22:53

haven't read whole thread but that's totally normal.

if you don't even go to church then why on earth would you want your child christened?

Tortington · 14/10/2005 00:02

get some holy water and at least two of you in a room and do it yourself.

some vicars are off their rocker.

john the baptist did it in a river - you dont have to go to a church - and i would mention this to said vicar, change church - what is it these days with judgement calls on who can be "saved" in the eveys of the church from original sin and those who cant - they should be fking falling over backwards - WHETHER or not you 're doing it for the piss up or doing it for the right reasons, really the whole church going christianity thing is pissing me off.

Original poster
mommie · 14/10/2005 12:24

hellmouthcrusty - yr post made me laugh! we do actually have a bottle of holy water from when my partner went to Lourdes (well it may be tap water, but he bought it for me anyway). Don't get me wrong, I do want to go along to church et al, but i am passed the age where i think i need to prove myself

OP posts:
Original poster
mommie · 14/10/2005 12:26

sorry - meant hellmouthcusty

OP posts:
tissy · 14/10/2005 13:20

erm, the Cof E (which is what i think we were talking about)doesn't "do" original sin, as tortoiseshell mentioned below, so there is no question of the child being saved or not. The baptism is a means of welcoming the child into the community of the Church and an undertaking by the parents and godparents to bring them up according to the Christian Faith. If the parents and child aren't part of the community of the church(not just the surrounding area), and if they have no intention of bringing up the child as a practicing Christian, then yes, they should be turned away (nicely) and offered a blessing/ thanksgiving.

I once knew a chap who wasn't at all convinced by Christianity, but didn't want not to be a member of the club on the day of judgement if it was all true. He went through with baptism as an adult and then confirmation, then never went back to Church again. . I have no idea whether he told the vicar of his attitude, but I doubt it very much!

Original poster
mommie · 14/10/2005 15:18

the thing is tissy - who are we to judge?

OP posts:
Nettee · 15/10/2005 07:39

The actual baptism is not about the parents but about the baby and God - something along these lines:

"You have been clothed with Christ. As many as are baptized into Christ have put on Christ. "

I felt that DS's baptism was really between him and God and that it would put him at some spiritual disadvantage if I didn't go ahead with it.

I will take him to Church sometimes and discuss Christianity with him in an open minded way. My faith is a bit wishy washy but I felt it was enough to make the required declarations

Anyway the point I am trying to make is that there are reasons why you might want your child baptised if you do not go to church. It is hard to explain but has to do with tradition and sprituality and "just in case" and the child being part of the church community and a proper celebration of the child's arrival.

I think that in these days on dwindling congregations the vicars should be pleased that people are showing an interest - if you want your child baptised you are likely to at least show up once a year for the carol service. If a genaration of children are not baptised then what will happen to future church weddings and who will be the godparents of the next generation.

bobbybob · 15/10/2005 08:08

My FIL is a retired minister and we found it very easy to get ds christened! All the rules about attending just evaporated as they were so scared if they made it difficult in any way I'd just tell them to stuff it.

The vicar at their church made it difficult though by refusing to do it near Christmas "because they are really busy at Christmas".

So I said near Christmas or nothing (wanted it when my parents were here) and miraculously we could have the date we wanted, though it was after the service not during it. After all we were supplying the vicar.

Went back for Christmas service (even though I toyed with being too busy!)

tallulah · 15/10/2005 09:58

If people are having their children christened just to get into the local primary school then I'm not surprised the vicar is being cautious. If you have no intention of going to church then it is hypocritical to "use" it for your own purposes, and that includes a church wedding as a nice setting when it's probably the first time you've set foot over the threshold since you were christened yourself.

tallulah · 15/10/2005 09:58

If people are having their children christened just to get into the local primary school then I'm not surprised the vicar is being cautious. If you have no intention of going to church then it is hypocritical to "use" it for your own purposes, and that includes a church wedding as a nice setting when it's probably the first time you've set foot over the threshold since you were christened yourself.

tallulah · 15/10/2005 09:58

If people are having their children christened just to get into the local primary school then I'm not surprised the vicar is being cautious. If you have no intention of going to church then it is hypocritical to "use" it for your own purposes, and that includes a church wedding as a nice setting when it's probably the first time you've set foot over the threshold since you were christened yourself.

tallulah · 15/10/2005 09:59

Sorry about multiple posts- computer getting stuck

moondog · 15/10/2005 11:10

I wonder how many people who 'can't commit' to an hour on a Sunday are very able to commit to hours and hours of crap tv a week.........

Lonelymum · 15/10/2005 11:12

Oooh Moondog, you are soooo chapel-ish!!!!

moondog · 15/10/2005 11:14

I know...self righteous as hell these days..

Lonelymum · 15/10/2005 11:20

Got a hangover this monring? I briefly saw something last night about a bottle of champers being opened at 7!

moondog · 15/10/2005 11:21

A bit..
(Even though I didn't drink that much....five glasses over about three hours.My metabolism has gone to pot.)

Nettee · 15/10/2005 12:40

Why can't people "use" the church for christenings and weddings if that is what they want? Some people want a bit of spirituality into important events in their lives. Can you imagine the same arguments about whether people should be allowed church funerals? There would be uproar.

CarolinaFullMoon · 15/10/2005 12:45

And lots of others just want a venue that's pretty and cheap .

I can just imagine all those vicars round the country sitting around filing their nails or whatever until someone decides it's time for their once-in-a-decade bout of "spirituality" (in a nice hat or big white dress).

Lonelymum · 15/10/2005 14:34

The state the church is in in this country, they should be grateful anyone wants them for anything.

zippitippitoes · 15/10/2005 14:38

Over a third of all children born in 2000 were baptised before they were one year old. While this percentage is less than it was, it still means that over 240,000 children are brought to a church in the early months of their life. The percentage of first marriages taking place in church is 54%, more than half. Perhaps three-quarters of those who die have a Christian ceremony at the funeral - some 450,000 a year. Many millions of people who do not regularly attend church come to such events as these, with well over half the population thinking such events should be marked by a religious service

donnie · 15/10/2005 14:55

tallulah and moondog I agree with you both completely - and as others have said it is perfectly reasonable to be expected to give something back if you wish to take advantage of the services such as baptism that a church can offer.
Also the baptism is not only a welcoming into the church for the child, it is a solemn ceremony where Godparents have to make holy oaths including turning to Christ and promising to bringthe child up in a Christian way. So it shouldn't be taken lightly!
I personally fail to grasp why non Christians or people who denigrate the Church then want to have their kids christened ....weird....

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