Dog urinating in the dining room!

[Sicksicksick9]

I’m at my wits end! I have a 1.5 year old border collie, she is house trained unless the dining room door is open which for context needs to be open during the day as I am a childminder and use the living room and dining room as play rooms.
regardless of whether she needs a wee or not she goes into the dining room and wees! She knows she shouldn’t because she won’t do it if someone is in the dining room.
I’ve used enzyme cleaners specifically for dogs I have no idea what to do!
any suggestions?
she’s not poorly perfectly healthy gets walked twice a day 6.30am for 30 mins and 6.30pm for 30 mins - 1 hour is calm and chilled in the house. She also gets let out for a wee in the garden 3 times during the day at 11.30 1.30 and 3.30
I'm baffled!

Baby gate to keep DDog out, but allow for doors to be open and kids visible?

Could she be upset by the children in some way and be wanting to get your attention (even if negative)?

Since she only wees in the dining room when no one is in there, it does sound more like a learned habit or a “this spot smells like a toilet” association rather than a housetraining problem or a medical issue (especially since you’ve ruled health out). Even with enzymatic cleaners, some dogs can still pick up the tiniest residual scent, so to her that room may still be flagged as “the place to go.”

A few things could try:

Reset the association with supervision + reward, For a couple of weeks, whenever the dining room is open, keep a very close eye on her. The moment she enters and doesn’t wee, reward her for calm behaviour in there , treats, praise, scatter feeding, a toy. You’re basically teaching her: “This room is for hanging out, not going to the loo”

Block access unless you can supervise

Add a temporary ‘job’ in that room
Feeding her meals in the dining room or giving her a stuffed Kong in there can help shift the mental association away from toileting.

Increase garden toilet opportunities before she’s allowed in

Think about boredom or understimulation
Collies are very bright, high-drive working dogs. Even when they seem calm and chilled, they often need more mental work than the average breed. Sometimes boredom or a lack of “jobs” can lead to quirky behaviours

Hopefully a short reset plus some mental stimulation will break the cycle!

Or pop her in a dog band/nappy? My boy used to do this and stopped once her wore a belly band

She needs more than 1 hours exercise a day! She’s a working dog and the breed is used to a lot of mental stimulation. To be blunt unless you can give her more exercise she’s not the dog for you!

I don't even know where to start. Border collies are high energy, high intelligence and need far more stimilation than two 30 minute walks a day. Problem behaviours usually arise when a dog is not getting their needs met.

The peeing is probably a synptom of a bigger problem. It could be anxiety, stress, boredom ...or even attention seeking.

I'd get a trainer in to help you understand what's going on with her, and put a plan in place.

30 mins at 6.30am is barely a walk for that breed, then a loooong wait until the next wee wee opportunity at 11.30.

I mean i am in no way clued up on dogs hence why I don't have one(plus I don't really have time for a dog either with work and kids)but surely she isn't going to only pee at set times can you not have the back door open so she can go outside whenever she needs to in order to avoid having her pee in the house? but then I suppose in the colder weather you don't really want the house cold if you've got a few little ones around either.does she not let you know if she needs to go out in the garden?

She's a border collie, one of the most high energy and most clever dogs on the planet! They are a working breed that are not great as a pet dog UNLESS they are doing a LOT of work to keep they brains working, dog agility, flyball, working trials etc. She's bored out of her brain and she's trying her hardest to get the attention she desperately craves and needs! She's actually trying her hardest to find a way to get through to you what she needs. And she's found that by weeing in the dining room, she's getting a least some kind of attention over it, even though it's a negative attention. And two half an hour walks is absolutely horrendous for a breed such as a collie!! She needs hours of exercise!! Unless you can change your lifestyle completely (and I'm guessing you can't due to you job) I would suggest either finding someone who knows working breeds and can take her out for several hours or work her during the day, or you re-home her to an experienced home who knows how to work a collie.

Collies are one of the breeds that end up in rescue the most due to people like yourself buying a working breed as a pet and not researching what the breeed needs. A lot start getting aggressive, destroying property and biting, I'm hoping you can find a way to help her before she feels she needs to step it up to this, especially when you have children in the house.

She’s perfectly happy with the exercise she has, we also do lots of games for stimulation she literally sleeps all the time. I appreciate she’s a working breed dog but lots of professionals have said an hour is enough the more exercise she gets the more energy and stamina she will have and I will never tire her out.

She’s scared of the garden unless I’m stood in it, she’s a really nervous dog on our walks she ends them early she just runs home without me and when I eventually get home she’s sat on the door step waiting for me

I understand what your saying but she doesn’t get shouted at or any attention at all positive or negative for seeing in there unless I see her I don’t say anything.
the walks situation she doesn’t get walked too much as she hates them, she runs home without me very quickly and waits on the doorstep she’s extremely nervous of anything a tractor once came in the field we walk in and was a dot int he distance and it was like enough to send her running home tail between her legs.
I got given her from a farmer who bred them stupidly and I got her at 20 weeks as a nervous wreck we tried agility but she doesn’t like the sound of cars so she’d hide constantly we tried fly all worked great but then she became extremely aggressive with other dogs when she has a toy so attacked to other dogs and got banned.
so we do trick training at home every evening she knows so many tricks it’s unbelievable so I understand what your saying about energy but she is mentally stimulated in other ways.

We had a backward step with our adolescent BC around that age, I think.
She insisted on going into our attic room and pooing on my husband's yoga mat every day just before we got up in the morning. 💩
It was a fairly brief phase iirc although at the time it felt like it would never end.
We just kept reinforcing good behaviour, especially pooing outside.

She'll pretty much poo whenever I tell her to now

Maybe go back a step with toilet training? Go back to taking her out for a pee every hour and don't come back in until she's peed.

Collies are not a dog to have in your profession . I would absolutely not be letting my child go somewhere a dogs pissing all over so your clearly not telling parents . You risk your job here its unhygienic and disgusting. Either cratethe dog or rehome it .

She does not sound like a dog that should anywhere near kids at all !!! Collies are a herding breed will it take her to takedown a kid for you to see she's a danger its the dog or your income!

Surprisingly she enjoys the company of the children gets excited when they come in but doesn’t jump at them she greets them calmly then goes and sits on the sofa the children are never left alone with her ever and are told to leave her alone so she has her own bubble my daughter included however when the children are gone she will come over and sit next to her and cuddle up to her somewhere your getting she’s going “takedown” a child from I’ll never know?

Blimey, op. In the nicest possible way a border collie is not for you. This dogs needs far more than you’re able to give it. No judgement, just how it is.

This dog has clearly got some issues going on which I’m surprised you aren’t more concerned about tbh. Her extreme nervousness isn’t the sign of a happy and well adjusted dog. I’m afraid I would agree with other posters and say she shouldn’t be around children - collies can be complicated anyway (we used to rescue them) and with her problems I wouldn’t be putting her in that position. You need to speak with a behavioural expert who can come and assess her.
and the amount of exercise is in no way sufficient for a high energy, working breed.

This goes way beyond the dog weeing in the dining room.
I would have serious concerns about a highly anxious dog, that has already shown signs of dog aggression and resource guarding of toys, regularly being around children that are not from its own household.

I'm not sure the lifestyle and the choice of dog are entirely compatible here.
It sounds as if it needs a behaviourist and, potentially, a dog walker.

I’ve owned Collies all my life, peeing in the house when she’s house trained is an extreme sign of stress and anxiety. Being petrified to go outside to the point where she won’t go out without you and wants to end walks early means she’s not a happy dog. The first steps I would be taking is going to the vet and getting her on medication for anxiety once she’s settled on that I would start desensitising training - what upsets her the most outside? I’d use that noise and give her treats (or use her food) several times a day every time every time she hears a noise that worries her when she eats the treat tell her in an upbeat tone “good” you’ll need to get your timing right but eventually she’ll associate the noises with good things. Collies are incredibly sensitive so there can be no giving her into trouble absolutely nothing negative - reward the good behaviour totally ignore the bad. She does need more exercise, 2 30mins walks isn’t good enough if she’s not great with other dogs hire a dog field take her favourite toys walk round and play with her. Have a look at hoopers it’s a lot less stressful on their joints than agility, dogs aren’t racing against another team like in flyball, it’s really taking off in the uk just now and quite a lot of reactive/yellow dogs compete in it and when dogs are competing there’s always 2 meter distances between them in the que and everyone is very respectful. This isn’t going to be a quick fix it will take a lot of time and dedication but it will worth it in the end. If you don’t have the time to really work with her and it will take a lot of your time and energy on a daily basis the reality is her reactivity will eventually be directed at you and anyone around her which makes her dangerous, in that situation the kindest thing would be to rehome her to someone that has the time, energy and money to put in to her. Collies aren’t for the faint hearted they’re one of the most complex breeds and if you do something slightly wrong when training them it can have massive consequences on their behaviour so maybe a behaviourist would be another thing to look into it wouldn’t be cheap but they could advise and set out a training plan where you’re less likely to make mistakes. I definitely would never trust them around children their behaviour and mood can change in an instant and unlike other breeds you need to be quick to read their body language this is why they failed as guide dogs initially when they were looking at the best types of dogs to train it was automatically thought that border collies would be the best breed for it as they already had a reputation as a great working dogs with amazing focus but they failed spectacularly they’re not dogs that are good with people and quite often their split second decision making is the wrong one which is not big deal when it comes to herding but it’s a massive deal when it comes to deciding if it’s safe to cross a road or deciding if they’re unhappy that someone is touching them - that unhappiness could be them snapping at someone without any warning. Good Luck you’ve got a long journey in front of you.

Have you always had Border Collies OP? What made you choose this breed when you work as a childminder? Seems bizarre when I thought everyone knew they are super high energy dogs that are clever and get easily bored/anxious/destructive etc. that's why you don't see that many of them around as simple pets. They are working breeds 🤷‍♀️

My family bred bc for 50 years. I'm sorry to say but they are working dogs and not house pets. They've specifically been bred for hours and hours of running a day. 2 30 mins walk will not cut it. She's only 18 months so I'd be surprised if she didn't act up more.

We have a border collie. He gets a two mile walk in the morning, two mile walk at lunch, another mile after dinner, and at least three five mile runs over the course of the week. All off lead and in a rural environment. Even then, he's highly strung and prone to anxiety induced IBS if his routine changes or there is disruption in the house. You've brought a highly driven working breed into a house that sounds to be hugely over- stimulating- they are generally not good around lots of noise or small children. The peeing is likely to be a stress response and if you can't meet her needs you risk this escalating into behaviour such as nipping. You are not the right home for this dog.

You’re not giving her anywhere near enough exercise or stimulation. A baby gate is all it would take to keep her out of the dining room but that won’t solve your overall problem.