Can I justify a dog?

[JennyForeigner]

Former dog owner here - dog was the highlight and love of my solo 30s. Beloved dog passed away from undiagnosed, rapidly progressing cancer a few years after I met my husband. We then had a family.

Now, three young kids, one SEND/ish, one really quite SEND (autism). Busy rural household with a huge garden and nice dog loving neighbours. Someone is always at home. DH is very into fitness and runs or walks every day. Kids need as much outdoor time as we can give them. DH can be lazy about screen time when we're home and tbh we lean on distraction too much because the kids profiles and needs are so different. Particularly we have a very bright asd older child who is socially lacking in confidence, a demand avoider and I think, at risk of being very unhappy. We are never going to be able to be out and about in cities and museums or at classes as much as he wants, because of our other child's needs. We will never spend our money on overseas holidays or adventures for the same reason. For context, our youngest child will be 5 this year.

I... mostly just work incredibly hard - at home alone - and don't exercise enough. Everything revolves around the kids. I go back to work whenever they are asleep, or collapse in a heap. When I should be exercising in an evening I have no motivation at all. When I had a dog I did a daily 5km, because the dog needed me to.

Without a dog something is missing. It feels mad even to consider adding a dog to a complex household, and yet... and yet... I miss having a dog so badly. I want my children to grow up with dogs. I think they need and would benefit more than most children from a dog. Our life is a good one, for a dog. We live in a place with a lot of support and training. I have done the adolescent dog years before, and know what to expect. DH also loved my old dog and is keen. We already have cats and rabbits, so are pretty tied to home.

Is it so mad? Are we just so much in the weeds with children and SEND, that I am grasping at a straw? Is it selfish to want uncomplicated doggy love in my life as well as everything else? I love to think of a wheaten terrier or similar asleep with the kids at the end of a long outdoor day and just can't shake the feeling that there is no real point in delaying, if that is what we want.

I feel like I do really need to check our thinking on this. Our household can feel vulnerable for various reasons and I am scared of making a mistake, and life harder.

Really grateful for any thoughts or advice.

Thank you, this has been enormously helpful. I am moved by the families who have had their lives transformed by dogs where there is autism in the family. We have seen this ourselves with the child of friends.

To the person who asked why I don't make time for myself to go for a walk, I don't know. I have an consuming job which sustains us financially. I am usually flat out from 6am to 10pm and when the kids are asleep try to catch up in any way I can. If we had a dog we would take it out all day, but I would also do the evening turn around the block. For some reason I just can't do that for myself. I really have tried.

You are right collectively about the puppy years - we are looking at a trained autism dog which would be adolescent at least, but comes with quite a lot of training of the children and household as well as the dog having a three month residential training programme. They do suggest the child getting the dog should be younger - from 3 - to get the most benefit. On that basis I think we will go ahead for our daughter, and I will separately think hard about if there are ways to address being burnt out.

I just wanted to say thank you particularly for this reply. We love our daughter so much. There is nothing we wouldn't do for her and I suspect the right dog would make such a difference to her.

I am usually flat out from 6am to 10pm and when the kids are asleep try to catch up in any way I can.

On that basis I think we will go ahead for our daughter

Incredible. And entirely predictable. Poor bloody dog.

I think we must both come at it from an entirely different angle to most. It’s not imo appropriate for a dog at all but the majority appear to form their opinion on whether it’s good/bad for the people - never whether they can provide a suitable lifestyle for the poor dog.
And then you and I and others like us are left trying to pick up the pieces

OP you say it’s for your daughter. Has your daughter expressed a keen interest in dogs?

I don’t own dogs but people on here are always saying dogs and young kids must be closely watched and/or kept separate at all times. Are you able to do that?

Yep!

It's all about what's best for them - their desires - never about what is best for the dogs. And, as you say, we pick up the pieces. Sigh.

We've always had dogs, labs and spaniels. They adored our children and their friends. Now we're grandparents the present ones adore the grandchildren. At weekends they go on long walks with the dogs and grandpa.

We've never had a difficult breed though just bog standard working dogs who are sociable.

We have a working lab and he’s great with our kids (no send though). He was a bit of a dickhead for around 4-6 months (mainly because he ate everything, including walls!) but by the time he was 1 he was the goodiest boi. He now mostly sleeps but loves playing with the kids when they’re home from school.

Yes, on the go all day. And as I have been extremely clear about, as much of that as possible is out of the house with our kids. We don't do towns, our daughter doesn't like them. We do hill walks and nature reserves and at a pinch, national trust. When I said I struggle to get out for an evening walk it was in opposition to how we spent the day. It's not complicated.

If you believe that you have to sit indoors all day to be a good owner, every dog in Britain has news for you.

Hard to believe you actually read the OP and then wrote this.

Interesting use of 'them' here. What does 'them' mean here? Families with disabled children?

I am so very sad for my daughter that she will spend all of her life coping in one way or another with the judgement of bigoted people. But a dog? A dog will love her unreservedly.

Thanks for helping to make our minds up.

Ok I’ll clarify.

The OP already has her hands incredibly full, is burnt out and exhausted. Looking for something to give her a boost. On paper, all that outside time might be fine but wrangling a puppy or adolescent dog while dealing with 3 kids, two of which are SEN is going to be anything but a life enhancing experience

She claims to be on the go literally all day - a young dog won’t be able to do that without damaging its joints and becoming an overtired, over wrought mess. So her and the kids will have less freedom.
Puppies need toilet training, bite, jump up, bugger off the minute you take your eyes off them, pull on lead, chew, dig up the garden, steal the kids toys, need training time, vet visits, socialising properly. The vast majority of my clients with young children have problems with the children being scared of the puppy once it’s mouthed them a few times too - a young SEN child will not find that easy to say the least.

When on earth is all that going to take place?
I’m talking from experience- I’ve trained dogs for many years including helping clients train assistance dogs,
So yes, the OP painted a rose tinted view of walking round the forests together but my experience tells a different story. Some people make it work, but it will add to the OPs workload and stressed not give her the break from it she craves

And from the dog’s perspective, an incredibly busy family who are very time poor with small children who have complex needs is not the best home for it.
If it was, good breeders would be more prepared to allow pups into these homes and rescues would not have an almost blanket ban on rehoming with small children

@Dunnocantthinkofone from the OP's post:
we are looking at a trained autism dog which would be adolescent at least, but comes with quite a lot of training of the children and household

I do believe that OP is looking at this from the right angle and walking into this with eyes wide open.

You are obviously allowed your to raise concerns and it's important to hear different points of view. But not every family with young children, SEND or not, is unsuitable for dog ownership by default. And I say this as someone who has an dog that was bought as fashion accessory for a family and ended up being a neurotic nervous wreck!

Youve clearly not read all of @JennyForeigner posts. She doesn’t want a puppy.

I haven't 'claimed' or 'painted a rose tinted picture' anywhere. There is no need for the loaded language. I asked for advice, because it matters to us to get this right.

Edited to add that I have read the post to which this was a response again and appreciate that the advice is coming from a place of wanting the best for dog and people.

I am really grateful to have posted this thread, because it has made me think carefully about our family. Our daughter particularly is an incredibly loving and affectionate child. She has her quirks - needing at least 50% outdoors time and being non-verbal amongst them - but she was described by her nursery as gentle, curious and loving. It's not just that she - and we - would like to have a dog, but that a dog would be very lucky to have her.

Sorry, this was more of a change than an edit should be - but posting has helped me to separate out how much I miss my old dog from what is really the matter at hand, which is what a dog might mean to my daughter. That is a big step forward - and yes, if we are approved, I will absolutely post pictures of a trained, adolescent, autism assistance and hopefully very happy dog down the road.

No mention of it in the opening post - which is the one I went from. Apologies

It’s incredibly hard (and expensive) to get a fully trained assistance dog though - and generally ime you have to get the dog untrained and put it through the train/test process yourself. Unless you are getting a medical alert or physical assist and dog that is.
Having now read more carefully, it’s not clear which option the OP is considering or how she will be sourcing the dog. And whether she is looking for the dog to be an ‘emotional support dog’ or a fully tested and certificated assistant dog

‘Them’ means families with young children in general. Dogs and young children do not mix.

And a dog might not love her, even if it’s an assistance dog. You could well end up with a dog that’s means to be hers, but has no interest in any of your kids.

But I hope whatever dog you get is happy if your family, and gets the love and attention it deserves, and isn’t just there to make your lives better - you should enrich the dogs life as well.

Just be careful of the bloody shit breeding of many of these assistance dogs! You could end up with quite an expensive mistake on your hands

On a complete tangent from your dog question OP, it sounds like you really miss holidays/travel. Could you and your husband/partner look at some options for taking short holidays separately either individually or with some but not all of the family if it’s not feasible to all go together? Might give you a lift without the commitment of a dog?

‘Them’ means families with young children in general. Dogs and young children do not mix
I disagree, dogs and young children can be fabulous together. There are 1000's of people who have dogs before DC come along... and the majority will keep their dogs. It can and does work.

And a dog might not love her, even if it’s an assistance dog
Dogs do not have humanised emotions, they don't love . Most domestic dogs will attach themselves to a person also known as a bond. Dogs were selected for his trait over centuries. And an assistance dog does not need to be attached to the DC in order to do the job at hand.
Dogs will find their space within the family environment and will be happy with this. Neglected and mistreated dogs are the ones that develop issues ... plus the ones with very poor breeding.

Just be careful of the bloody shit breeding of many of these assistance dogs! You could end up with quite an expensive mistake on your hands
Maybe you could offer up one of your puppies to a family like OP's ... help them get the right pup from the litter, help them with training and understanding the type of dog they have in order to meet it's needs as well as theirs.

Thank you, this is thoughtful. It hasn't been an option unfortunately. Our daughter can't access things like wraparound and holiday care. She has pica, which means she puts everything she can find in her mouth, while she also has very little idea of risk/struggles in unfamiliar environments so has been unsafe to travel. We separately max out our leave to support her around her term times already. We don't really have family help (for good reason - bereavement and my MIL is well into her 80s).

We have recently heard about some holiday cottages which are designed for autistic and neurodiverse children, so I think we might manage to get a shared break sometime in the not too distant future.

I hope you do get a break. It sounds like it will be very well deserved.