Any advice for my ancient collie?

[LittleB]

I've got a 15yr old collieX she went to the vets last week as she's been drinking alot, and I mean loads, about 3 times what she normally drinks, and therefore waking us up to go for a wee in the night and weeing alot in the day. They've done blood tests for her liver and kidneys and a urine test for diabetes and they've all come back ok so they gave her some antibiotics and she's due to go back tomorrow evening. But the antibiotics haven't made any difference, does anyone know what else it could be? Could cancer do this? Its come on quickly over the last weeks or so.
I'd like to prepare myself as if the prognosis isn't good and she'll just get worse we'll probably have her put to sleep then, I don't want her to have to undergo invasive testing at her age. There are other things to, she's senile and partially blind and deaf but her worst problem is her arthritus, she can only manage short walks now, no stiles etc, although on good days she'll have a run with my younger dog, on bad days she's worn out after 15mins, more good than bad days at the mo but I know she hasn't got long left and I'm dreading the autumn when I know her arthritus will get worse as I don't want her to suffer, as she's always loved her walks.
Anyone any experience of what this could be so I can prepare myself for the worst when I see the vets tomorrow?

Sorry no idea, but I am dreading this happening to our mad BC.

We have a collieX too (about 13yrs old). Not sure if it's the same thing, but she had similar problems (with the weeing) a few months back and it started literally overnight. It turned out to be no more than an 'old-age' thing. it's also tied into some sort of 'skin' problem, her fur starts to fall out in clumps - not sure how this links to the weeing, but apparently it's all part fo the same 'illness'. The antibiotics worked, but she does keep having relapses and apparently will keep doing so(Cue getting rid of the landlords kitchen carpet and having something very washable fitted). She doesn't have any of the other problems such as arthritis, but does get extremely breathless on walks now and can't manage to go too far - but other than that she's fine, still totally off her head, but fine.
Fingers crossed that it turns out to be the same, or a similar thing for you.

Thanks, I'm just worried as she finished her course of antiboitics this morning and doesn't seem any better (no weeing in the house she will bark to go out). No hair falling out but her coat isn't as shiny as it used to be.
I feel I'm lucky really as I got her as a rescue dog when she was 6. i never thought I'd have her for over 9 years and she's been great, its only since last autumn that she really seems to have aged, even as a 14yr old last summer she would walk for miles with me leaping over stiles and running up and down riverbanks etc.
I hope your BC has a long happy life too Bree, its just heart breaking seeing her slowly go down hill and I want to make sure she doesn't suffer. Perhaps she'll just need more or stronger antibiotics, any other suggestions?

Have they checked a urine sample? Has she been speyed. There are a few reasons dogs do this and if all the other tests you mention are totally normal then these would be the next steps to check. If there are mild changes on the other bloods that they have said they are not actually worried about it may point to other problems that need testing for - things like cushings syndrome, overproduction of steroid in the body - some are not so bad to deal with. Cancer would be pretty unusual to cause a high thirst, but nothing is impossible.
Is she on any medication for her arthritis? Some medications can cause excessive thirst too so it is worth checking with your vet.

Good luck - my dog is old and arthritic too. I have just had a collegue start some acupuncture with her, on top of regular metacam that she has. Might be worth considering trying that. Your vet can advise you where you can get that done most likely if they do not offer it at your clinic.

Thanks beautiful girls, you're a vet aren't you! They did do a urine test last week and said her urine was very dilute but nothing wrong they've asked me to take another sample in tomorrow. She's on metacam too, but has been on this for years so I'd be surprised if this had affected her so suddenly. We did change her food and started giving her Hills JD (for her arthritus) but she really doesn't like it so we're putting her back o her old food, she's too thin to go without eating much. She was speyed years ago (before I got her). I'll ask about the acupuncture, but is it very expensive, we're in a rural area so I'm not sure how easy it would be to come by. I'm off to look up cushings syndrome now. Thanks.

Yes I am! If her urine is still very dilute they should consider doing a water deprivation test where they check over a period of time (usually a days stay at the surgery) under controlled conditions of no or limited water if her urine can get more concentrated. Following on from that if it does not concentrate they should check for diabetes insipidus (water diabetes rather than sugar diabetes) This is however an extremely rare condition so would be pretty unlikely. Don't try and withold water yourself unless you are doing it under very specific veterinary instruction.

I cant help you on the price of acupuncture I'm afraid as I get it free being in the biz It was only my dogs second try at it yesterday and she does seem a little bit more comfortable today though so I will definately get more done for her. She tollerated it really well though I suspect the food bribes the whole way through to distract her played quite a part in that

Did the increase in thirst co-incide with you putting her onto the J/d diet? Sometimes a diet change can do that though usually it settles down. What does your dog weigh and how much does she drink in a 24 period. It is worth monitoring that but putting known volumes of water down and checking what is left after 24hrs. It will show if the trend is worsening or improving. If she drinks more than 100ml of water per kg of body wt in a day that is definately excess. 50ml/kg/day is about normal, but between 50-100ml is a bit of a greyer area to know and so monitoring may be as useful as some of the tests that are being run.
Incidentally, if your dog did not eat the j/d diet take it back to your vet and ask for a refund. Hills guarantee a refund if your dog will not eat their diets. The surgery should refund you and get in touch with their area rep to sort out the surgery getting the compensation back from them.

Hopefully you will get some answers soon

Thanks beautifulgirls. She's going in tomorrow to be tested for cushings disease and to have x-rays to check for tumours. Her urine is still a bit dilute but not too bad, not showing anything else unusual though. She's drinking between 2-3 litres of water a day (its hard to tell exactly as she shares a bowl with my other dog) she usually drinks about a litre and weighs 22kg, so that does seem excessive by your quantities.
I've mixed the rest of the hills with her other food and she'll eat it like that but we won't buy it again, she's lost some weight recently so needs to eat.
Glad the acupuncture is working for your dog, I'll ask my vets about it if the tests come back negative.
Send us good luck vibes. If she has a tumour I doubt we'll be bringing her home, her quality of life isn't great now and if the prognosis is only to get worse we wouldn't want to see her suffer. Our vet discussed that with us today as we think she's too old/weak for an operation.
Thanks for your advice, I'll let you know how it goes.

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Wishing you lots of luck with everything tomorrow for her. It is so sad when our pets get old . Time goes way to fast with them. I still remember picking my dog up when she was 8 weeks old like it was just yesterday and she's 13 now.

Well Scampy hasn't got any tumours but the x-rays showed how bad her arthritus is, its all along her spine, almost every vertebrae is affected aswell as her legs, no wonder she's been struggling. We're waiting for the results of her test for cushings disease, if she has that there is some medication which may improve her condition. If it isn't that I think we've checked everything else out with several blood and urine tests and various other medications that we've tried, so then its down to her quality of life, which isn't great now, so I think we'll be taking her in again soon to be put to sleep v.. Thanks for your advice and support.

Fingers crossed for her

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Thanks for all your advice. Since spending a long weekend at my mums house (we were camping and shes too old to go camping now)she's alot better. I've spoken to the vet and the Cushings test came back negative, she's now drinking normally. We think perhaps she had a UTI which the antibiotics cleared up but the she'd got into the habit of drinking alot (she's also senile) the change of house changed her routine. I think she gets a bit compulsive obsessive anyway, especially since she's started going senile, she's gone through funny phases like this in the past of digging carpets and pooing in the house which were just phases. Hopefully that problem is better now.
I don't think she'll get through the winter with her arthritus though, she's on metacam (we tried alternative painkillers but they were no better)and has chondroitin/glucosamine supplements, we tried Hills jd but she won't eat it. I don't think acupunture is really an option for us due to the cost, she's cost me over £200 in the last couple of weeks in addition to her ongoing care. She will turn 16 this winter so she's a good age, this is a reprieve for her.
Thanks again for all of your advice and support during this difficult time.

Glad to hear she is doing well. Fingers crossed she keeps well for a good while yet.

Sad news but I thought I'd better update you, Scamps arthritus has got worse. She is now limping and weak on her back legs and they completely give way when she tries to run and I also think she's in pain despite the metacam, so she's going to the vet tomorrow to be put to sleep. The vet agress that there isn't anything more we can do to help her and thinks, like us, that it is better to end it now, before the pain gets worse and she can no longer walk. I hate feeling like I'm playing god with her life but me and dh always said that when she could no longer enjoy her walks it would be the end for her as being a collie walks are her favourite thing. She 15 and has had a great life. Just wanted to say thanks to all the mumsnetters who offered me advice with her when I've had various questions.

aw, sorry to hear that. Sounds like the right decision for her though

Big hugs to you