Stop term time holiday fines for parents

[Louisew700]

Hi everyone,

I’ve just had a petition published calling for up to 10 days authorised school leave per year without fines, to give families a bit more flexibility.

Like so many parents, I’ve felt the pressure around attendance rules – especially when it comes to things like family time, holidays outside peak prices, or special circumstances.

If this is something you’ve ever struggled with or feel strongly about, I’d really appreciate your support. Even just a signature or share could help get this seen.

Here’s the link if you’d like to take a look: https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/763857

Thank you so much 💛

Yes the head was very understanding and said it wasn't in her hands and said we would probably get a fine. For me it was the fact it was so impersonal as well literally sent an invoice. No way of speaking to anyone the contact details were for a number that was no longer available so i emailed the council. Nobody ever replied. I would be happy if the money went towards books or equipment for the school but im certain it wouldn't. We live in a borough that has gone bankrupt twice so im sure its just seen as another way to get money out of people.

The fines are ridiculous - they are stopping family life of poor people, while the middle class "just consider the fine a part of price of the holiday".

I don't know about any other democratic country doing this.

School attendance is generally important, but especially in a multicultural multiheritage country it should be understood that learning doesn't happen only in the classroom.

The problem is, how are teachers supposed to help your child (and the other 30 odd) catch up on the massive amount they'll miss in two weeks? If the curriculum were smaller and a more sensible size I could see up to a week being feasible. However, people always moan there is too much holiday. What they really mean is that they want a cheap holiday.

I would be, if all children could take a week in term time the teacher should too. DS' teacher has had time out this year once because his DC had chicken pox he has 4 so it spread over a fortnight his wife did week one he did week 2 and a week for a vasectomy which is a voluntary procedure (I know his wife) , everyone was fine

Why don’t you petition to make the school holidays in the UK flexible so not everyone in England is off at exactly the same time and even out the demand for family holidays a bit?

I live in Ireland where everything is more relaxed, people go on holidays in term time without anyone suggesting you are ruining your child’s education- particularly in primary school. There are a certain number of days/weeks that that all schools must close but some additional days that are at the discretion of the school. So for many years in primary we could have a week away “off peak” in May or June when they’d only miss a couple of days (or sometimes none at all). And in secondary they finish at the end of May (unless doing state exams) so you can get holidays in June off peak. And even if they have exams, finishing at the end of June with the primary schools we could go the first 2 weeks in July which is a good bit cheaper and it is before England are off.

Fines just feel like a sledgehammer to crack a nut.

Why isn’t the anger focused more on the travel companies that hike prices so much. There should be a petition to limit the price % increase travel companies are allowed to charge.

It amazes me that parents in England, as a group, put up with this. My children are at an independent school so we don’t deal with this nonsense (we also almost never take them out of school) but this simply wouldn’t fly in most other countries. There would be mass disobedience! People seem to just accept government overreach here.

Of course it doesn't happen in an independent school.
The state isn't footing the bill for the education. You are.

Why isn't there mass disobedience in France, Germany and Austria, for example?
You should see the fines Austria imposes.

Anyone know what other countries apply similar fines? North Korea is probably one of them.

He wasn't on holiday though, was he?

Well of course. But the point is that it shouldn’t happen in any school.

Spain and Germany both do.

I don't know about North Korea. I do know that there are fines in many European countries such as France, Germany and Austria (qv)
The Austrian fines are quite high.

My point is he took two weeks off and no one died or forgot how to read. If a teacher was permitted to take a week term time holiday I'd be fine with it. You could argue he should've booked the vasectomy out of term time given it was elective. Again no issue for me with him choosing to do that.

Well, that's the whole point of this discussion. It does, and some people agree with it.
"Mass disobedience in other countries"! 😂
Not so far! 😂😂

Why what happens on the last day of term?

I don't think anyone is suggesting that there would be fatalities or a collapse of literacy skills. How odd. We've had staff off for serious illnesses, maybe months and the school and learning has continued, so I don't see your point.

Yes, and France and Austria. Those countries apply fines for unauthorised absence though, which to me would allow for unforeseen circumstances like funerals, illness of a parent, perhaps a wedding and so on. Austria seems to apply fines after three days unauthorised absence.

Seems to me that the application of fines in other countries is primarily to prevent truancy and deliberate non attendance, whereas in England it's a fine or else, and few if any exceptions.

No, you seem determined not to

If their place of work grants them annual leave absolutely. I have no more reason to dictate another professionals holiday entitlement than they have to dictate mine.

Why isn’t the anger focused more on the travel companies that hike prices so much.

How many times does it need to be said - travel companies don't 'hike' prices in summer, they put them down in the winter.

Airlines, hotels etc need to make a certain amount of money over the course of a year to pay their overheads and their staff and be left with a profit. If prices go down in the summer, they will go up off-season to compensate. Bye bye cheap termtime holidays.

Basic economics.

No need. Just argue the point without getting personal.
Illness is not the same as a holiday. I won't add a personal negative remark about you.

Nevertheless, this does contradict the somewhat wild claims about no other countries imposing fines or some mad revolution if they did! 😂
Countries will vary in how much, and the circumstances, of course.

Like many other families we chose holidays within our budget during school holidays.

We did this because we valued their education and also felt it set a good example about making appropriate choices and accepting your responsibilities (whether that be attending school, going to work or anything else for that matter).

I won’t be signing this petition because I fundamentally disagree with the principle of removing children from school to gain from off peak holidays. Note: off peak - prices are not increased in the school holidays, they are discounted outside of it due to lesser demand to ensure hospitality businesses can maintain year round cash flow.

That said, I do feel that there are some LA’s that need to show more flexibility and support for exceptional circumstances (such as bereavements of family not in the UK as an example quoted above by another poster).