Tax wealth don't cut disability support

[Orangesandlemons77]

www.change.org/p/tax-wealth-don-t-cut-disability-support?recruiter=1159899986&recruited_by_id=ee450700-1545-11eb-b9d2-a7afe27c80a7&utm_source=share_petition&utm_campaign=share_petition&utm_medium=copylink&utm_content=cl_sharecopy_490498896_en-GB%3A9

People need to work more or the economy isn't going to be able to sustain those who genuinely have no choice. PIP shouldn't extend to many conditions and parents shouldn't get PIP for kids.

(I recently discovered I can get the Scottish equivalent of PIP for ADHD and have a high likelihood of success if I apply... Which I won't because that's ridiculous and awful and there are properly vulnerable people out there in destitution)

People can work and claim PIP, it is not an out of work benefit

Signed and shared

Parents don't get PIP for children. That is only for Adults.

Taxing the wealthy will mean more of the wealthy will move themselves and their money overseas

It sounds like a lovely idea to tax “other people” to avoid cuts you don’t want, but in reality there aren’t enough wealthy people to make a wealth tax solve our problems.

If we want better services, welfare state etc then everyone needs to pay more tax, not just the people who you think should pay more tax.

See this thread by Dan Neidle (tax expert) x.com/danneidle/status/1933882350892400790?s=46&t=X1ma7_QJJ_PDVp-SdExAEg

We already have marginal tax rates of over 100% for people with childcare expenses who earn £100k, so hardly anybody bothers to earn more. The reality is that our (not wealthy) relatively high earners pay some of the highest taxes in the entire world.

It is the lower and middle earners in the UK who pay far less than those in comparable countries with functioning services because mathematically there is no other way to fund them. The UK electorate needs to get real. The only realistic choice is between the average and lower earners paying far more or there being far lower service provision.

If cakeists keep promising the impossible and a gullible electorate continue to believe them then eventually the bond market will force the tax rises and service cuts because the country cannot sustain itself as it stands. That will be far more painful than making slow and gradual changes now.

I don’t agree with cutting disability benefits BUT huge changes need to be made to make unemployment benefits time-limited, change the NHS to a French/ German/ Australian system, make huge changes to the state and public sector ponzi pensions and to social care funding so that people pay far more of their costs themselves (not just responsible people who’ve chosen to save, but everyone being forced to contribute properly to these things and pay their fair share).

I would raise the threshold for paying tax from £12k (?) to £20k even a bit higher.
that would make the world of a difference to people on a low income and they would spend more (pay more tax) while the govt would hardly notice a dent in income.

Why shouldn't parents get pip for their 16 year olds? Disability costs don't suddenly stop at 16

It's called taking responsibility for your children.

How do you propose to ‘tax wealth’?

Because you can’t really raise income tax without reforming the system and removing some of the cliff edges. (These merely encourage people to reduce the number of hours they work to avoid the financial consequences of exceeding the threshold, or even relocate abroad).

Are you going to tax property perhaps? Or savings/investments? Or inheritance (already a v. unpopular tax)?

It had to be inheritance though

currently it’s unpopular even though very few people are affected

my guesss is that’s because the very rich hate it and through the media they have a lot of influence on people.

its primarily wealth that has never been taxed - because it’s usually a home that has soared in value way more than infkation

and the person who bought it is dead - all it does is propagate wealth through generations rather than helping us build a meritocracy. Inheritance is feuling the housing crisis but people seem big bucks and want to grab it

remeber however wealth is taxed , the inheritance will get taxed so you will lose it however if wealth is taxed so if wealth is taxed no one will get to keep the inheritance anyway

bug if it’s not just inheritance they tax then every year you pay motr off your mortgage you lose more in tax …

@InsomniacSlothi couldn't agree more! People seem to have no idea that most tax receipts already come from the wealthy and they are leaving in droves. There soon won't be enough people to pay the level of tax that's needed to support the people who really need support. There isn't a magic money tree, despite a lot of people thinking there is.

This.
Am so bored by the shouts of 'TaX thEM RicH fOLx!!!'

Which as ever is = 'anyone who has more money' than the shouter....
But of course this only means EARNED money....if a person on benefits income is higher than someone who works...that's fine and dandy and the shrieks of 'you want poor people to DIE!!' should that be acknowledged!! Another two-tier joy!!

How much tax do you think is collected by the government on people earning between 12k and 20k?

Just in case anyone else (aside from @KnickerlessParsons) is interested, a rough estimate for the cost of raising the tax free allowance to 20k is apparently 35-40bn. That’s almost half the education budget.

eta - that’s just income tax, not NI.

We have 25.5 million full time workers (so earning more than 20k) so the extra tax on the 8k difference would be
(8000 x 0.2) x 25 500 000 = 40.8 billion.

This may come out higher as a number of part time workers will earn more than 12k.

Still a drop in the ocean of the 300 billion welfare bill though

Nearly 11000 millionaires have left the UK in the last year.
Many more have registered their businesses in countries with much lower tax.
I’m not sure what the answer is but it seems psycopathic to earn huge amounts of money, live in a country, and do your utmost to not pay taxes.

yes, the range and the lower figure allows for the fact that people earning between 12-20k won’t get the dull benefit. I was responding to a poster who suggested that the government wouldn’t ’feel the dent’ which is clearly wrong. If you also change the NI threshold (for employees, not employers) which is probably what the PP means, it’s another 40bn so now basically the entire eduction budget.

I’m not making a judgement about the welfare budget although the figure you quote is 55% pensioner related.

Regardless of whether I think it’s a good suggestion or not, In no government funding mathematics is 40bn a drop in the ocean. To raise that elsewhere would require massive new taxes which are inevitably politically very difficult. France raises about 2bn from their property tax which replaced their wealth tax, for example. They scrapped the wealth tax because their analysis suggested is cost them money due to flight of capital.