Jealous vs. Envious

[MoleAtTheCounter]

I was reading a thread where posters were using both of these about the same topic. I was going to post on that thread that they are not synonyms but held back as I know that pedants are not welcome (except for this safe space).

Envy is about wanting something someone else has, while jealousy is about fear of losing something you already have.

Yep. YANBU. People just don't know the difference. But maybe they will now you've started this thread!

I’m very confused. One example from the Cambridge Dictionary -

jealousI'm so jealous that she's going to that concert!

Surely that should be envious then?

I could be wrong but I've never heard of jealousy being a fear of losing something you already have.

You could be jealous of someone, for instance.

I feel jealousy is stronger than envy, an irrational feeling.

When I explain it to my kids I say envy is wanting what someone else has, jealousy is not wanting that person to have it.

Ooh interesting.
I always thought Jealousy is when you want something some one else has and you begrudge them having it. You would happily take it away from them.
Envy, a similar feeling in that you want something for yourself but you don't have the resentment.

That might be bollocks though 🤔

I think that the meaning you give OP is less commonly used than the meaning that is effectively synonymous with envious. However I agree that they are not completely synonymous - I usually try and explain it as ‘envious’ is wishing you had something someone else had, but with no ill will, and ‘jealous’ is the same feeling but with negative implications ie. you behave or speak differently (and negatively) towards or about that person because of your jealous feelings.

Both words describe feelings of wanting what someone else has, I think, but jealousy is ugly because it's fuelled by resentment.

I'm with you on this.

Jealousy contains some element of ill-will – unless with some modifier to make it obvious a comment is in affectionate jest.

Eg "well jel". The choice of "jel" derives only from the fact it rhymes.

I think it depends on the context. A jealous lover could not be an envious lover. But both jealous and envious could apply in other contexts.

I always think that envy is less invidious, and can actually be positive. I could envy someone, for example, for being confident enough to travel to nice places on their own, but that could inspire me to take a leaf out of their book and do the same.

Jealousy, on the other hand, could eat me up inside, make me resentful and then cause me to be nasty to that person, or about them behind their back to others.

Envy is what everyone else has said.
Jealousy is when someone makes you feel lesser for what they have. ie girl steals your boyfriend and you doubt your own attractiveness/personality so feel jealous.
Someone has a new, flash car and it makes you feel inferior with your reliable mini etc. You are jealous of the car because of how it makes you feel about yourself.

That is what I was taught in my Philosophy degree a thousand years ago.

I could be wrong but I've never heard of jealousy being a fear of losing something you already have.

It used to mean more like possessive eg you could be jealously protecting something. dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/to-guard-protect-jealously

Nowadays it basically means the same an envious though.

I have only used it once and that was to say,
"That trifle was too jealousy for me - I prefer it with a bit more sponge"

Jealousy - malign
Envy - benign

For those who have not heard of 'jealous' used as in my OP there is an idiom "guard jealously" meaning to protect something very carefully because it is important to you.

In Shakespeare's four great tragedies the protagonists have fatal flaws -

Macbeth - ambition
King Lear - self-delusion
Hamlet -indecisiveness
Othello - jealousy

Othello will do anything to prevent losing Desdemona to Cassio.

I believe the dictionary definitions of the two words are interchangeable. However, in practice "envy or envious" are generally used in a more nuanced way. For example, you can express envy of someone's achievements or possessions without actually coveting them or resenting their owner. It can often be used as a compliment such as "I'm really envious of your auburn hair, it's so beautiful!".

Jealousy on the other hand is always a negative emotion. It is covetous and bitter and called "the green eyed monster" for good reason.

Jealousy can also be used, as the OP suggests, to "jealousy guard" a person or thing which means you are possessive in the extreme.

I think it's one of those words were the meaning/common usage has subtley changed over time.

Jealousy can also be used, as the OP suggests, to "jealousy guard" a person or thing which means you are possessive in the extreme

Perfectly illustrated by, John Lennon's, Jealous Guy. He is fiercely and excessively posessive of his own wife, and not jealous of some other man's wife

But that’s not what you said in your OP, you were proving a point, and were wrong 🤷‍♀️

Dictionaries only reflect current usage though, so definitions will change according to different ones and how old they are. So if envious and jealous have become to mean the same thing (through incorrect use) then the dictionaries are eventually going to say they mean the same thing, which I think is a shame, as we lose nuance. I have a beef with 'begs the question' being now almost always used to mean raises a question, when it used to have a useful distinct meaning (accepts something as proven). But admittedly that original meaning is not easy to grasp instinctively.

This.

My understanding of it is that jealousy implies you'd rather the other person didn't have the thing you are jealous of, which isn't the case with envy. Envy is therefore socially acceptable, whereas jealousy is not.

Othello and Desdemona are married. Othello is jealous as he wants Desdemona all to himself. Iago says to Othello “O, beware my lord of jealousy. It is the green-eyed monster which doth mock the meat it feeds on”.

Someone has been busy on Google today OP 😅
I agree with pps that envy and jealousy are interchangeable depending on the context and that jealous has an almost malicious edge to it whereas envy not so much.
I think we're all just jealous of your knowledge on Shakespeare OP (or should that be envious?)
It's all just words at the end of the day and the meaning is how it's said.

Ooh, I didn’t know this but it makes a lot of sense. I thought the same as pp but suspect the meanings have been corrupted through usage.

I love Shakespeare and have seen all of his plays at least once. The latest was Henry IV in Bristol with Sir Ian McKellen playing Falstaff. He injured himself falling off the stage in London a few weeks earlier so it was his understudy.😥