The pedants are revolting!

[TheStepfordChav]

Sorry, couldn't resist that.

OK, help me with this one - an hotel, or a hotel? An historic, or a historic?

Why do we got both, but never an hot (water bottle) or an high (shelf)?

Surely 'an' before an aitch means you drop the aitch, so cannot be correct? (So, an 'otel, an 'istoric.)

Off on a slight tangent, why Le Havre and not L'Havre? Again because of not dropping the aitch, or something else?

Your thoughts please!

Just a guess, prob completely wrong, but is it that only words of french origin (where the aitch was unpronounced) get the 'an' treatment?

I don't use 'an' with these words, btw. It's faintly archaic and I suspect it had something to do with snobbishness about the French origins.

Not a pedant, so really shouldn't be here...but... an historic sounds right but an hotel sounds wrong.

Gosh, how helpful am I!?

No need to thank me.....

No, thanks JV! How it sounds is all-important to me (that's how I know if it's right or not!)

Had never occurred to me about French origin. Good one. Doesn't really explain it, though, does it?

Well actually, thinking about it, I suppose it does!

I'm an archaeologist and I say 'an historic' , but all the others sound wrong. It may be because I have to say 'historic' (which I nearly always mistype as hitroic btw) a lot, and get lazy, so drop my aitch!

Bloody French

SB - so as an archaeologist, you're admitting you're a bit archaic?!

Well, you're a bit annoying at times, I admit.......

This is what it says in my ref book:

'Where h is pronounced, use 'a'
Where h is silent, use 'an'
Where 'h' is pronounced in words in which the first syllable is unstressed, use 'a', eg 'a historic occasion, a hotel'

Word starting wiht silent h? Do they give an example?

I agree with PW's book.

'An honorary degree' sounds great.
'A honorary degree' is plain wrong.

It's all to do with whether the 'h' is silent or not.

OK, now I understand. Thanks

'An hotel' and 'an historic' just sound wanky. I lump them in with 'amongst' instead of 'among' and 'whilst' instead of 'while'.

Hope that came out right. Am a bit too pissed to be posting on a pedantry thread .

Policywonk, glad to find a fellow editor in pedants' corner. Tis our natural home.

Sorry, 'tis our natural home.

an hotel sounds right to me. So I do drop the h slightly. I think it's elegant and sounds nicer, it rolls off the tongue whereas "A hotel" doesn't imo.

An historic is right imo too

Oooh, didn't know you were an editor botbot.

at WWW's blatant disregard for reference books.

I remember reading yonks ago that you were an editor and wondering if I knew you in RL. Don't think I do though.

What can I say? I'm wild, me

Le Havre, and other French words of germanic origin have an aspirate H (though it doesn't sound like it compared to the much more aspirated English H). So elision is not possible, nor liaison with a preceding S. So for example you wouldn't say "les z'haricots" but "les 'aricots".

Words with a silent H are generally of Greek or Latin origin, and elision and liaison are possible, so "l'hôtel" and "les z'hotels".

Or so I understand

I'm an heditor too. (Did you notice the silent h?)

Castille - too much for me at this time of night. Will re-read demain.