Help - I think I'm turning into a toxic parent!

[trying2bbetter]

I'm looking for advice. My childhood was generally unhappy, a lot to do with having a parent who tried to control us with threats, put downs and insults. It's taken me years to get to the point of realising I'm ok as a person and that people do like me.

The problem now is that I see it all being repeated with my 3 year old dd. Before I know it the words are out and I'm behaving exactly the same way and saying the same old things. I've read and re read the "How to talk so kids will listen" book but though I know it in my head the same old destructive stuff comes out of my mouth.

I'm terrified I'm turning into a fiercer version of my mum.

WE learn to parent from our parents, so it's not surprising.

The great thing is you realise what you are doing so you can break the cycle.

t2bb, you took the words out of my mouth. I am suffering from the same guilt / affliction at the moment, and not being able to bite my own tongue (which I am certainly not proud about).

Afraid I can't offer a solution, but I do find that an hour or two away from the house / kids/ DH gives me a bit more headspace and patience.

To break the cycle will also need you believing in yourself more, being confident that you are a good person, and a good mum, start thinking positive thoughts etc. All common sense, but so HARD to put into practice ...

All the best.

Have you read "Raising Children, Raising Ourselves" by Naomi Alhort? She gives a good strategy for breaking the habit of saying what comes to mind first - and also talks about how our own childhoods influence our reactions to what our children do, how we can try to overcome any problems that might have come from the way we were brought up. I thought it was a very positive book.

Thanks for replying.
paranoidmum you're right about it being hard to put into practice. I feel like just because I can see what's happening doesn't mean that I can necessarily do anything about it.
LynetteScavo how do I break the cycle?
Octapusinabox I would have thought that apologising was a good thing but in the book "How to talk so kids will listen and listen so kids will talk" they tell you not to apologise too much. I need to think about that one as I would have thought apologising was setting a good example. Do you think it's a positive thing all the time or would you suggest using apologies in moderation?
bananabrain I will try to get hold of the book you mention. I'm scared by how conditioned I am by my own upbringing and I sometimes say things that horrify me.

I would apologise, for example, to say sorry if you didn't mean to shout angrily.
To say to your child that you didn't mean to get angry and what would have been fair would have been/ or what I should have said or done was... XXX

What is it that you say that you regret?

Maybe try forcing yourself to count to 10 silently before speaking. It might be just enough to stop you waying hte first thing that you are conditioned to say.

3 is still young, you can break this cycle before your DS can 'remember' it.

I think apologising in moderation is a good thing - obviously not constantly of the child will see you as flaky and not in control at all. There is nothing wrong with making mistakes as long as you take responsibility for them. In fact I think it shows your kids a lesson in itself.

How does your DH/DP tackle the situations? Is it different from you (which is useful as he can help you stay on track at the time and help you deal with it afterwards too)

Would you consider therapy to deal with the anger still inside you, waiting for an outlet?

All children are often really annoying and frustrating. Accepting that they will make you feel like this often, can lessen the anger a bit.

It's hard to remember to stop and look at things differently when they suddenly make you cross, and you react before you even realise you've reacted. If you can remember to do it, looking at the children and thinking about how they are feeling and what is making them behave the way they are, and how you can make them feel better and not behave like that, takes your focus off your own annoyance a bit. You also find solutions quicker.

A book which I've found really helpful is Buddhism for Mothers.

I think that's good advice about apologising.

Dominique07 I can't really think of what I say right now, though will surely be able to make a list by the end of today. I think it's more the "don't do this, stop doing that... I said don't..., pick that up... the constant undermining and wearing down that I really don't want to do.

Re anger management, I don't really think this is so much about anger waiting for an outlet, as me trying to control my children. That's what my mum did with us, you know trying to "micro manage" our lives and making us feel totally incompetent and worthless in the process. I'm realising I need to learn to let go and not be in control of all of the tiny details, accept that milk will be spilled, things will be left on the floor and there will be a messy bathroom and wet floor.

Will conciously make a note of what I say / do to give concrete examples.

Ok, so instead of using the negative words don't, stop, no, e.g. don't spill the milk, could you try, here is a cloth, lets wipe up the mess together.

Instead of Don't make a mess, how about, ok, now we've finished playing lets play tidy up the toys into the toy box, and then lets go into the kitchen and make a snack together!

(I'm trying to avoid those words too).

Try contacting your local Children's Centre. They may run, or be able to point you in the direction of, local parenting courses. Most parenting courses I've come across are aimed at ordinary parents, who find the role harder than they expected and who are looking for new ideas and approaches to make them even beter parents.

Also, try looking at some of the films on Parentchannel.tv.
Some of the topics that might help are:
Help! I'm turning into my parents.
Positive Discipline
Raising Confident Kids.

Sometimes it's easier to remember a visual/audio message instead of words in a book.

i have the same issue ttbb. some of the things and tones of voice i hear myself come out with make me cringe.

i found apologising upset my kids more at times. they still dont seem to like it much (tho obviously it goes down a little better than when i would cry and beg their forgiveness - i was in a bad way then)
but its worth watching closely to see how they react to apologies; i think it can scare the life out of them tbh. might not obv, you have to use your judgment there.

at least youve read the how to talk book! impressive - i have the concentrstion span of a goldfish and have not gotten far with it.

another book worth looking at is 'what mothers do - even when it looks like nothing'
on the basis that kids respond better to positive communication, maybe this will help you feel better about yourself as a mum and that will help you find more patience.

feeling guilty can be useful if it makes you find ways to be better... but it can easily become a stick to beat yourself with and while youre busy doing that, youre not getting any nicer to live with.

you can try to empathise - imagine what your dd was thinking when she did xxxxx, or ask her even (in a non-threatening tone if ou can manage it) you might be surprised and even amused at the responses.

another trick to try might be to try to record yourself and listen/play it back to yourself. you might find youre not as bad as you think. or it might be the spur you needed to dig deep and sort it out.

good luck - may the force be with you

Thanks for the link piprabbit. Unfortunately I don't live in the UK so can't access the videos. Also, don't have access to parenting classes here, or really any kind of support group, which is why I posted on MN. MN has become a way for me to interact with people from my own culture. Where I live parenting is very very different so I don't really have people around me who can model examples of the kind of parent I'd like to be.

PotPourri you asked how my dh deals with the situation. He is generally more patient and tolerant than me, though I'm noticing him picking up my bad habits and saying things that I say that I really don't want either of us to be saying. Dd is quite "willful" and sometimes we both just get exasperated.

I could give a list of things I say but it would probably look quite benign out of context. As I said earlier it's the wearing down, constant telling off, asking her not to do something then having a big fight when she says "no" and does it anyway, sending her to her room, which I know, I know is horrible and I really don't want to do that but sometimes I feel like I've run out of options and once I've said it I feel I need to follow through.

I really am appreciating advice from posters on here as I really don't have many other people to ask.

T2BB - do hang in there. Recognising there is an issue is fantastic, and requires great courage. I've gone the next step and have booked a parenting course this week (privately - I am desperate, esp with summer hols just around the corner). I will let you know how it is. They do do telephone consultations too ...

Another piece of advice (which I fail to listen to and action myself!) is to play happy background music - e.g. Abba etc. It is really hard to shout and get frustrated when you are toe-tapping to Dancing Queen!!!!

Piprabbit / Bananabrain - thx for top tips on books / channels. I'll be seeking them out too!

Dominique07 I can't really think of what I say right now, though will surely be able to make a list by the end of today. I think it's more the "don't do this, stop doing that... I said don't..., pick that up... the constant undermining and wearing down that I really don't want to do.

Re anger management, I don't really think this is so much about anger waiting for an outlet, as me trying to control my children. That's what my mum did with us, you know trying to "micro manage" our lives and making us feel totally incompetent and worthless in the process. I'm realising I need to learn to let go and not be in control of all of the tiny details, accept that milk will be spilled, things will be left on the floor and there will be a messy bathroom and wet floor.

You sounds like a normal parent to me not a toxic one..... are you sure you are not putting yourself under too much pressure.

My parents were a bit toxic in that they called me fat and lazy and selfish. The fat bit was what bothered me but I am very sure not to ptu my children down like that.

When they are young you are going to say don't do this and that a lot as they are going to be testing your boundaries.

Of course it can't hurt to read books and try to be the best parent you can be but it sounds like you are punishing yourself for nothing. Are you a bit low in general? You sounds unhappy...

Sorry the first two paragraphs were a quote from your previous message OP. Didn't make that clear.

paranoidmum thanks for the encouragement, it's nice to hear that someone else is going through the same thing. The idea about the background music is great, dd loves Abba so will certainly give that a try. It would be great to hear what kind of things are discussed on your parenting course. I would sign up too if I were in the UK.

nikki1978 You're very kind to say I'm just normal. I could give a long list of destructive things my mum told me when I was growing up (e.g. you're stupid, you always say such stupid things, no wonder noone likes you, no wonder you always fail, you really get on everyone's nerves, you always wear such tarty clothes, rolling eyes, tutting, you just have to accept that you're never going to be clever enough to do...).

For me the issue isn't really so much the words as the attitude and putting down to try to control, and I see myself doing the same thing. I was quite damaged by that style of parenting and am horrified to see that I do the same, not all the time but enough to justify asking for help to stop.

Generally life is good, I have a great relationship with dh and we both feel happy and fulfilled at the moment, despite the struggles that come with living in a foreign country. So, no I honestly don't think I'm over reacting due to feeling a bit low. This is something that is taking a lot of my emotional energy though as the problem seems to be getting worse as dd becomes more independent.

I think it might help, tt2bb, if you reviewed the whole of your parenting. You would certainly find that you do and say a lot of good things with your 3 year old and that these far outweigh the bad. Remembering all that is positive about your relationship with your child could help you feel better about the occasional lapses that happen to all of us mothers. The trouble with strategies to correct these unwanted responses is that they risk keeping you focused on the negative. Ok, so you make mistakes, but they will happen less often if you don't judge yourself too harshly. And I agree that apologising to the child helps you both to feel better about the incident.