how would you 'help' a 9yr old get off to sleep?

[loves2walk]

I am really struggling to know how to help my 9 yr old get off to sleep at night. I think a 9pm bedtime is about right as we all wake up at 645/7am. He wakes up tired, seems tired all day, is really cranky and frankly looks exhausted. But then by 830 ish he gets a 2nd wind, wakes up a bit and can't get himself off to sleep then at 9.

The most I can do is make him lie in his bed reading. At least there is some rest in that. But it can be nearer to 10 when he gets off to sleep, he then wakes up tired and we all suffer!

He has blackout lining on his curtains which do let in some light round the sides, but not much after 9. He has a shower with DS2 at 630/7pm, then he spends an hour reading on sofa or watching TV with me and H - not cartoon wild stuff, more calming Grand Designs or Masterchef! It's a pretty consistent routine so I can't see what can be changed?

my 8 year old goes to bed at 8:00.

He always says he is not tired and cannot sleep, but I tell him he doesn´t need to sleep, just lie in his bed with the lights off. Keep it simple, no treats, reading etc.

Sleep comes and gets him 10 minutes later usually.

They grow a lot at thsi age, and need quite a bit of sleep I guess.

If he is VERY tired I even put him to bed at 7:15 with his younger brother.

This has really helped. I pulled everything earlier last night, tea then bath and left DS1 in bed at 8pm with a book. When I went up at 830 to turn his light out, he was ready and hardly complained at all.

So he was asleep when I next checked at 9pm and is a bit tired looking today but shows no mood signs of mebing tired.

So we'll keep to the 8pm in bed, at least till the end of term because I think this time of year is really tiring for them. They are so ready to break up.

I like the 715 idea, would be ideal for those evenings when I fancy a chilled glass of wine in the garden before the sun goes down!