Unconditional parenting types - help me with tantrums

[tinierclanger]

DS is now 17months and really starting to discover his rage. We want to bring him up in UP type way and on the whole I know the idea is to find out his unmet neds and deal with them.

But sometimes I do feel I have to say no to something he really wants - at the moment he is hooked on cheese and keeps demanding more cheese (BabyBels!). If I refuse he really goes for it now with a full tantrum. I am a bit lost for how to deal with it. I wonder if I just dish out unlimited amounts of cheese will he eventually get bored of it? I just think there is such a thing as too much cheese!

Either way, once the tantrum has kicked off, if you haven't managed to avoid it, how do you deal with it? Yesterday I just sat with him talking to him calmly until the worst had passed.

How much cheese is he really asking for?

He would probably ask for it about 4 times a day I think, given free rein. Am I overreacting?

Coming at it from having kids of 4, 6 and 8 and really struggling at times I would say start picking your battles now. Let him have the cheese but tell him if you have it now there will only be 5, 4 ,3, 2, 1 left so he can see if becoming a smaller pile in the fridge. Cheese is okay at this age, he isn't asking for constant jam/chocolate/sweets etc.

Do you think he is old enough to understand the declining pile? I will definitely try that. He is a very snacky child, but I don't have a problem with it in principle as I think it's fine to eat little and often and on the whole he varies what he asks for, and a lot of it is fruit.

Thanks for the reassurance. I don't want to say no to him all the time or to make it a big issue.

It has to be worth a try.

You could try reverse psycology when he wants a snack. Decide you want one too but get what you want him to have and see if he wants to try it too.

Good idea, I hadn't thought of that. Will try that too!

If you have decided (for genuine reasons and not on a whim) that he really can't have any more cheese or if it's something that he can't have then I would say 'no more'. With the Babybels could you show him the empty packet/container/string bag and tell him they've all gone and maybe get some more later?

If all fails and he does have a tantrum then it sounds as though you are doing the right thing in how you deal with it.

Ignore, but don't stand and look at him, as you're giving him attention for unsocial behaviour. Just get on with what you're doing (create a job if necessary) and occasionally give him a hug or a pat - he may need a bit of an emotional crutch to stop.

Even if he does need something - he'll learn that screaming gets him nowhere.

The naughty step does not work. He's exhibiting completely normal behaviour, so don't amplify the situation, or make an issue out of it.

When he does calm down, do acknowledge his feelings by saying something like, 'crikey, you were really mad!'.

I can also highly recommend 'How To Talk So Your Kids Will Listen...'. Fab book for tuning into your children's feelings.

The tantrums will stop, but it takes about a year. By ignoring them, he will slowly learn to use words to ask for what he wants. the whole naughty step 'instant' solution ain't so instant as they make out....

Also, start to give him a choice that you ulitmately control. e.g.

Clothes - do you want the blue or red top?

Food - do you want an apple or a banana for a snack?

Which plate would you like your supper on?

etc etc etc

after agonising about the amount of cheese, he'll probably decide next week that cheese is devil's food

My dd genuinely didn't and doesn't tantrum which is luck, sheer, sheer luck. She also spoke very well from around 18 months so could express herself so that probably helped. I am never having another as I know I've used up all my luck with dd.

Anyway, my dn is 23 months and reacted similarly to denials of food requests once upon a time. What her Mum does (and I do when babysitting her at weekends) is tell her well in advance if she's had her limit of something. She likes bananas so when she's had her first one, we say only one more and when that one's gone, no more. If she wants one after that she gets offered an alternative, or two. It nearly always works. Consistency and fore-warning helps. She doesn't get a third banana ever and knows when she's out of bananas for the day and knows that alternatives will be offered and bananas refused. She now says 'no more nanas. Biscuit?' Or similar.

actually, I think there is such a thing as too much cheese - the salt levels in cheese are very high and you could easily end up giving a 17 month old too much. Don't be afraid to say no and just let him get on with a tantrum - all children have to learn to control anger/disappointment etc and having tantrums is part of that. If you try to stave off every tantrum you won't do him any favours in the long run. I find diversion a good tactic - let him have a bit of a tantrum and then "oh look! Let's build this tower/go out in the garden/whatever". All children have tantrums - but it doesn't go on forever - by the age of 3 you can start to reason with them (you are wasting your breath at 17 months.....)

There's deffo such a thing as too much cheese. It is salty.

I don't agree that all children have tantrums and I don't think you're wasting your breath reasoning.

DD spoke very fluently at 18 months and was able to express herself. At 2 and a half she's eminently capable of understanding reasoning. I've always discussed things with her and explained what's happening and when. She's currently explaining to her toy frog that if he doesn't drink his milk, his kidneys won't be happy as they like sorting drink into good and bad so that he can wee and then when he's finished they can play teaparties (actually don't know where she gets some of this stuff from). Sounds like she's grasped the concept of reasoning to me.

Thanks all, lots of helpful suggestions here, I'm also glad to know I'm not being unreasonable trying to limit the cheese! After all that, he only asked twice today and I have showed him the declining stack.

He understands a huge amount but his verbal skills are still pretty basic and I think that is the core of his frustration so I do empathise with him. I think, just as when he started walking he became a lot more relaxed and happy, the same will happen again when he can communicate a bit better.

I have started to give him choices when possible but I think I need to work on that a bit more because it's sometimes hard to remember to do so-I need to practice.

And I have read 'How to Talk' and do try to work with those principles, and it does seem like he is listening when I voice back what I think he's feeling, so I think it's all worthwhile trying.

Thanks again all.

Hi, I have a 17mth too!

Agree that you can explain and 'reason'to a degree with a 17mth old (I have with dd and ds - dd was pretty verbal by now, but ds sounds like yours. Understands loads but doesn't say much) but I wouldn't go overboard with the negotiating - we are parents, they are children and they need to learn appropriate behaviour from us.

Agree with the poster who said give warning, so teach 'last one' (and MEAN IT - be consistent). It works wonders. Worked well on dd, but it def reduces tantrums with ds.

It's ok for them to be cross at not getting their way IMO. I say 'I know/sorry, sweetheart. Never mind, let's play with this train set instead'.
Top tip (even works on ds - worked v well on dd) is to say 'last one' - you do have to mean it though.

I think you are right to use your instinct to deal with a 'tantrum' (empathising/ignoring/distracting as necessary). With ds, he likes to go on the floor, so I let him, then after three seconds he gets up . Dd did the same thing Is v cute, hard to stop laughing with at him.

For all their incredible learning and development, 17mths is still very, very little. They are just babies really and need cuddles.

bah, didn't proof-read that very well, sorry

Anyway, meant to say I agree with LastofMulledWine that you do need to be constantly talking and explaining, but that the explanation should be simple.

Firstly, he is very young so his understanding of 'n' is debatable. I am sure he understands it, and do go on saying it to mark the 'rules' but it's too early to expect him to 'listen'.

Secondly, that's the whole point, tantrums will be part of your life now for the next eh, 18 years or so? It's nothing you can 'deal' with or 'remove'. Kids need tantrums to develop!

Just say 'no' to him when he wants more cheese and he will have his tantrum. Eventually he will learn that no is a no and ther is no point in screaming. It's hard work but kids ARE hard work. Having a tantrum isn't being naughty. Patience and deep breathing for the parents!

Surrounded by care, love, support, boundaries and respect, the tantrums fm your child will gradually decrease. But don't expect them to stop. Patience... Good luck!